Mom Runs Burglars Off with Gun

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Xebec I certainly never said I wouldn't arm myself to protect my family. Only someone with serious myopia would believe the only way to protect oneself and his/her loved ones is with a gun.

Serious academics have indeed thoroughly discredited Lott and his bogus study as well as conclusion. If you choose to ignore all evidence to the contrary and worship Lott, go ahead. It is a free country. But if you spout his bogus claims expect them to challenged and corrected.

Link to ONE serious acedemic challenge. ONE.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Just looking at open carry you can see it wouldn't do much regarding crime because the firearm is unloaded and visible. A criminal would choose to disarm the individual first.

Open carry is useless and I would never do it. The benefit of concealed carry is it protects everyone because no one knows who has the gun. Allowing MORE people the abilty to carry concealed reduces crime further. Allowing EVERYONE to carry reduces it to the minimum.

example. Florida. In 1986 passed non-discretionary concealed carry for state residents that qualified for a permit. Crime decreased 24% in one year BUT there was an increase in crime among tourists who were driving rented cars. They were being attacked by people who staged accidents and robbed them. Tourists had no guns and had cash, they were driving out of rent a car lotsin airports and easy to spot. In response, Florida started issuing concealed carry permits to non-residents and recognizing other states permits (by that time many states had followed Floridas lead) The riobberies which had generated travel warnings throughout the US...STOPPED. STOPPED.

Example, same time frame. Florida State University, Gainesville. 13 co-eds raped over a 4 month period. The university made quite a show of offering a concealed carry class on campus for students to obtain their concealed permits, The RAPES STOPPED.

example. Vermont does not have a noticeably lower rate of crimes that do not involve the risk of getting SHOT. Someone that knows tells me the "Old Navy" store in Burlington had the 2nd highest rate of "shrink" in the country! You do not get shot for shoplifting in Old Navy, even in Vermont, that is a given. Larceny, theft even the breaking in of summer homes in the mountains where it is very clear no one is home in the winter, is similar to other states. There has not been a random, on the street, homicide here since 2006 and that was a college girl that willingly went "home" with some guy she met at the bar that raped her, strangled her to death and tossed her in Huntington Gorge. He was pretty sure she was unarmed before he did the deed. There IS no safer place to take a walk than Downtown Burlington. And it is truly delightful to be able to enjoy a walk at the lakefront in summer, or stay out late if the fish are biting and not worry about the guy coming down the boardwalk. He will not threaten myself or my wife.

Street robbery, assault, homicide, home invasions, car jacking, heck it is even rare for a liquor store to get knocked over and then it is usually one of the national chains that is known for not allowing employees to be armed. Great idea. In 12 years ONE cab driver was robbed in Burlington and that is suspicious, it is believed the driver made up the story to keep the night's earnings for himself, not injured, saw no weapon and had no description of the perpetrator. I have never heard of the pizza guy getting robbed. Criminals just do NOT take that face to face risk.

The easier you make it for law abiding citizens to arm themselves and the more difficult you make it for criminals to determine who or how many people may have guns, the safer people are.

Vermont has ALWAYS, for more than 200 years, allowed ANYONE to carry a concealed firearm, or open carry if you so desire. There are NO restrictions on the carrying or firearms. Vermont has a tradition of firearms and hunting, we close schools for the first week of deer season. There are a large percentage of people who own guns and carry them...but NOONE knows how many and when or where.

The same technique worked for hiding nuclear missiles in submarines...as a DETERRENT. Funny how anyone would think the SAME technique would not affect crime.

Anti gun people are protected by others carrying guns, because no one knows who has the gun. Who are you going to assault or rob or rape? Are you going to pull a car jacking here? Dude, you are seriously suicidal if you do that!

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

http://www.nsrpa.us/legal/nevlocal.html

And from what I have read Nevada has one of the worst crime rates...

And open carry would do nothing to prevent that. No one has suggested open carry is a crime preventing measure, it is not.

But it would be interesting to "see" what you are reading. Easy to say "from what I read..." Much harder to show it. FBI Uniform Crime Report is the best source.

Antis just love to say "from what I read..." "It does not have an effect..." But offer no reasons no explanations no examples, basically nothing.

This is why gun regulations have been rolled back all over the country, why there has been NO federal firearms legislation since 1994 and why we have the McDoanald and Heller decisions. We also have a 23% nationwide reduction in crime since the first of dozens of states implemented concealed carry (1986), despite a 32% increase in firearms sales (FBI NICS, and FBI UCR)

Edited February 14, 2012 by Gary and Alla

[Leatherneck 693]

http://www.nsrpa.us/...l/nevlocal.html

And from what I have read Nevada has one of the worst crime rates...

Do you mean Arizona? Nevada is a "Shall" issue state, a CCW is required.

Arizona is unrestricted, no permit needed.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Do you mean Arizona? Nevada is a "Shall" issue state, a CCW is required.

Arizona is unrestricted, no permit needed.

he is referring to open carry. Off topic but they cannot argiue the point they have to makeup arguiments that do not exist. NO ONE here is arguing for open carry.

[Leatherneck 693]

.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Leatherneck

[Leatherneck 693]

he is referring to open carry. Off topic but they cannot argiue the point they have to makeup arguiments that do not exist. NO ONE here is arguing for open carry.

Good point.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Xebec I certainly never said I wouldn't arm myself to protect my family. Only someone with serious myopia would believe the only way to protect oneself and his/her loved ones is with a gun.

here is another example. NO ONE has said that the ONLY way to protect ones family is with a gun. In fact I have said over and over it is the LAST thing I want to use to protect my family. But we have these arguments "set up" and then knocked down that no one presented whil at the SAME TIME there is not one shred of evidence offered or even an example to support the claims.

Lott is discredited? Where? Can you even give the name of the publication? Other things cause low crime in Vermont. WHAT????????

Instead we get non existant arguments. I can only say that I am extremely relived that you are not arguing for my side. PLEASE, carry on.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Good point.

You have caught most of their hyperbole and unsubstantiated claims, but be careful, they NEED to deflect the argument. Next they will be saying handguns are not good for hunting or that we should all be allowed to have thermonuclear weapons. Typical. Check my earlier posts, I told another poster I expected to see the VPC "study" soon that eliminates 98.4 % of all fireams defensive uses and then says firearms are not effective in reducing crime. They did.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Gary and Alla

[Ban Hammer 13,334]

There really is no point to carrying an unloaded firearm, but its the open carry law in many states.

well i've done that

to and from the range firing line

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

well i've done that

to and from the range firing line

lol okay okay.

I've been reading the law on carrying in a National Forest in CA. Its sooo complicated!!! Needlessly too.

[Leatherneck 693]

lol okay okay.

I've been reading the law on carrying in a National Forest in CA. Its sooo complicated!!! Needlessly too.

It is better for that mountain lion or bear have you for lunch, no way will the statist make it easy for you to have a firearm in a National Forest or Park.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

http://www.nsrpa.us/legal/nevlocal.html

And from what I have read Nevada has one of the worst crime rates...

FBI Uniform Crime Report. Vermont has a crime rate 1/3 that of Quebec. Canada has three times the crime as Vermont. Vermont has a higher population density, 7 times greater than Quebec, Canada.

We also have healtcare for all Vermonters heavily subsidzied by Canadians coming here to escape National Health Care, a thriving retail industry fed by Canadians escaping the 15% sales tax to pay for health care.

53% of departing passengers from BTV are Canadians. Much lower airport taxes makes it MUCH cheaper to fly out of Burlington.

We LOVE Canadians!

Even Canadians can carry concealed handguns in Vermont.

Google it. Read it.

[Leatherneck 693]

You have caught most of their hyperbole and unsubstantiated claims, but be careful, they NEED to deflect the argument. Next they will be saying handguns are not good for hunting or that we should all be allowed to have thermonuclear weapons. Typical. Check my earlier posts, I told another poster I expected to see the VPC "study" soon that eliminates 98.4 % of all fireams defensive uses and then says firearms are not effective in reducing crime. They did.

It's always the same ole straw man arguments, nothing new.

[natty bumppo 297]

well i've done that

to and from the range firing line

i find that many are simply out of ammo when returning from the range ... thereby unloaded

there is however .... one that always has ammo