Jesus was a tax and spend liberal. The Bible tells us so!

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's. And they marvelled at him. -- Mark 12:17

Zacchaeus the Tax Collector

1 Jesus entered Jericho and was passing through. 2 A man was there by the name of Zacchaeus; he was a chief tax collector and was wealthy. 3 He wanted to see who Jesus was, but because he was short he could not see over the crowd. 4 So he ran ahead and climbed a sycamore-fig tree to see him, since Jesus was coming that way.

5 When Jesus reached the spot, he looked up and said to him, “Zacchaeus, come down immediately. I must stay at your house today.” 6 So he came down at once and welcomed him gladly.

7 All the people saw this and began to mutter, “He has gone to be the guest of a sinner.”

8 But Zacchaeus stood up and said to the Lord, “Look, Lord! Here and now I give half of my possessions to the poor, and if I have cheated anybody out of anything, I will pay back four times the amount.”

9 Jesus said to him, “Today salvation has come to this house, because this man, too, is a son of Abraham. 10 For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.” --Luke 19:1-10

[Danno 1,228]

One would have to define "tax and spend":.

IN our common language it might mean "compelling others to pay more to the gov't that it will be able to spend more on programs it deems worthy."

With that being said, quote for me the scripture where Christians are to compel anyone else to give anything?

If I vote for a tax increase, I am compelling my neighbor to pay more. Now this might or might not be prudent but lets not say "jesus supports it" because you can't show that.

Jesus instructs his followers to do certain things,,,, he does not instruct his followers to compel others to do those things.

Sorry.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

The Rich and the Kingdom of God

17 As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. “Good teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

18 “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone. 19 You know the commandments: ‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.’[d]”

20 “Teacher,” he declared, “all these I have kept since I was a boy.”

21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. “One thing you lack,” he said. “Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth. Mark 10:17-22

Edited February 4, 2012 by ☼

[Danno 1,228]

The Rich and the Kingdom of God

17 As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. “Good teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

18 “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone. 19 You know the commandments: ‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.’[d]”

20 “Teacher,” he declared, “all these I have kept since I was a boy.”

21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. “One thing you lack,” he said. “Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth. Mark 10:17-22

Again where in the account does Jesus tell the man to vote or do anything to force others to give to the poor?

THis is not difficult.

It's baffling how you can extrapolate "give to the poor" into meaning "Give to the State so they might in the most inefficient way.... aid the poor.

THere is a reason why even the biggest Lefties choose to donate their money to private endowments of causes when say some like Warren Buffet could just give to the Gov't. Not only don't they donate to the Gov't they take every deduction they can to avoid it.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Submission to Governing Authorities

1 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor. -- Romans 13:1-7

Edited February 4, 2012 by ☼

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

The Parable of the Rich Fool

15 Then he said to them, “Watch out! Be on your guard against all kinds of greed; life does not consist in an abundance of possessions.”

16 And he told them this parable: “The ground of a certain rich man yielded an abundant harvest. 17 He thought to himself, ‘What shall I do? I have no place to store my crops.’

18 “Then he said, ‘This is what I’ll do. I will tear down my barns and build bigger ones, and there I will store my surplus grain. 19 And I’ll say to myself, “You have plenty of grain laid up for many years. Take life easy; eat, drink and be merry.”’

20 “But God said to him, ‘You fool! This very night your life will be demanded from you. Then who will get what you have prepared for yourself?’

21 “This is how it will be with whoever stores up things for themselves but is not rich toward God.” Luke 12:15-21

[luckytxn 2,265]

Not one thing you have cut and paste has shown Jesus to be a tax and spend Liberal. They are Biblical phrases.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

The entire US government was founded on a sin lol.

Rom 13:1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except by God’s appointment, and the authorities that exist have been instituted by God.

Rom 13:2 So the person who resists such authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will incur judgment

[Danno 1,228]

Not one thing you have cut and paste has shown Jesus to be a tax and spend Liberal. They are Biblical phrases.

The closest he comes is to demonstrate people should pay their taxes.

Paying for ones place in society is not the same as being "a tax and spend liberal".

Many books in the New testament were actual letters written to a church or another person.

While we can gleen insight and principles from them, we can't assume everything was directed at everyone... every where.

Could one logically expect the instruction to "submit to Authorities" in gov't a[applied to all gov't everywhere at all times?

The Apostle Paul escaped from jail and fled, Baby Moses was hidden in a basket from the Kings order that all male babies be killed.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

The entire US government was founded on a sin lol.

Rom 13:1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except by God’s appointment, and the authorities that exist have been instituted by God.

Rom 13:2 So the person who resists such authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will incur judgment

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,

An interesting use of the passive voice to be consistent with scripture: God creates governments with the charge to preserve individual rights, but only as long as their charges say it is okay.

Edited February 4, 2012 by ☼

[SuperDuper! 230]

Is this another Anti-Christian, hater, pile-0n thread attempt? Seems so much easier to get away with than anti-Jewish rhetoric.

[dalegg 143]

A communist too.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

A communist too.

True, and a pacifist.

Jesus Arrested

3 So Judas came to the garden, guiding a detachment of soldiers and some officials from the chief priests and the Pharisees. They were carrying torches, lanterns and weapons.

4 Jesus, knowing all that was going to happen to him, went out and asked them, “Who is it you want?”

5 “Jesus of Nazareth,” they replied.

“I am he,” Jesus said. (And Judas the traitor was standing there with them.) 6 When Jesus said, “I am he,” they drew back and fell to the ground.

7 Again he asked them, “Who is it you want?”

“Jesus of Nazareth,” they said.

8 Jesus answered, “I told you that I am he. If you are looking for me, then let these men go.” 9 This happened so that the words he had spoken would be fulfilled: “I have not lost one of those you gave me.”[a]

10 Then Simon Peter, who had a sword, drew it and struck the high priest’s servant, cutting off his right ear. (The servant’s name was Malchus.)

11 Jesus commanded Peter, “Put your sword away! Shall I not drink the cup the Father has given me?”

12 Then the detachment of soldiers with its commander and the Jewish officials arrested Jesus. They bound him 13 and brought him first to Annas, who was the father-in-law of Caiaphas, the high priest that year. 14 Caiaphas was the one who had advised the Jewish leaders that it would be good if one man died for the people. -- John 18:3-14

[Danno 1,228]

True, and a pacifist.

Well not quite.

As you know he and the Father are one... thats why scripture says man was made in "our" image and in "our likeness.

When not wearing the hat of savior we don't see pacifism.

In fact even as he was here in the savior roll he also said this: in Luke 22-

31“Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift youa as wheat. 32But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.”

33But he replied, “Lord, I am ready to go with you to prison and to death.”

34Jesus answered, “I tell you, Peter, before the rooster crows today, you will deny three times that you know me.”

35Then Jesus asked them, “When I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?”

“Nothing,” they answered.

36He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and ]if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one[/u]. 37It is written: ‘And he was numbered with the transgressors’b; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment.”

38The disciples said, “See, Lord, here are two swords.”

“That is enough,” he replied.

--------------------------------------------

and then we have the part where he got angry at the venders at the temple in John 2

Jesus Cleanses the Temple

13The Passover of the Jews was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 14In the temple he found those who were selling oxen and sheep and pigeons, and the money-changers sitting there. 15And making a whip of cords, he drove them all out of the temple, with the sheep and oxen. And he poured out the coins of the money-changers and overturned their tables. 16And he told those who sold the pigeons, “Take these things away; do not make my Father’s house a house of trade.” 17His disciples remembered that it was written, “Zeal for your house will consume me.”

If you need my input at the Aitheist site, let me know.... ignorance is sad, deceit is a scourge.

Edited February 4, 2012 by Danno

[james&olya 1,121]

Again where in the account does Jesus tell the man to vote or do anything to force others to give to the poor?

THis is not difficult.

It's baffling how you can extrapolate "give to the poor" into meaning "Give to the State so they might in the most inefficient way.... aid the poor.

THere is a reason why even the biggest Lefties choose to donate their money to private endowments of causes when say some like Warren Buffet could just give to the Gov't. Not only don't they donate to the Gov't they take every deduction they can to avoid it.

Danno, do you really not see the gross hypocrisy in the right's battle against tax funded aid for the 'have-nots' of society in spite of the Christian theme of charity and compassion, and then trying to compel all people to adopt the right-wing christian moral position on abortion by making it a criminal act! You want government to compel against behaviors that many surmise may violate Christ's laws and admonitions under penalty of civil law, yet you protest those charitable actions of government that directly fulfill many of Christ's direct teachings on our obligations to our fellow citizens!

H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-S-Y!!!