My time at Walmart: Why we need serious welfare reform

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

While it would suck to work at Walmart and have to deal with these kinds of individuals, I am having trouble conjuring up much outrage.

I have seen much much worse offenders in the financial industry and private government contractors. I have seen individuals get salaries of 150k+ without a lot of difference when compared to a welfare check. Half of them have even been conservatives riling up against the illegal boogymen. It's like waving your arms and pointing to someone stealing form a cookie jar while you help yourself to some gold bars. That's when some can really bring out their inner outrage that would make a high school drama teacher proud.

So yeah I'm not sure I can get hell bent over someone buying a kit cat bar with EBT instead of corn flakes. And in this day and age, information acess disparity is growing and for many people a smart-phone is their only access to the web and/or email. So yeah I'm not going to be outraged about that either. And we should be grateful that we live in a society that having net access is considered a bare necessity.

Is the system perfect? Of course not. Are there many people taking advantage of the system. Definitely. But I can't really find any outrage when there are so many Enron and Haliburton class offenders running around.

This country is taking a beating and it's coming from both ends and the middle class is being squeezed by both.

[Robby999 1,024]

Edited December 23, 2011 by Robby999

[Robby999 1,024]

Edited December 23, 2011 by Robby999

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

why do you hate illegals?

You are the one that wants to arrest them, box them up, and ship them (in boxes) across the border.

And on top of that, you hate the people that hire them. You want them shut down, fined, and imprisoned.

I have not once read a post from Gary that advocated boxing illegals up and ship them across the border. Not once. He was also very clear on not wanting to see those that hire illegals imprisoned. Or shut down or fined, for that matter. He just wants them very heavily taxed for each and every infraction of our labor laws. Which would ultimately help low and medium skilled American labor and help honest businesses to compete on a more level playing field.

Edited December 23, 2011 by Mr. Big Dog

[Robby999 1,024]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DamaPKMJagA

[Robby999 1,024]

[웃 910]

I have not once read a post from Gary that advocated boxing illegals up and ship them across the border. Not once. He was also very clear on not wanting to see those that hire illegals imprisoned. Or shut down or fined, for that matter. He just wants them very heavily taxed for each and every infraction of our labor laws. Which would ultimately help low and medium skilled American labor and help honest businesses to compete on a more level playing field.

You're right, I refreshed my memory on Gary. He wants to tax the employers so that there is no work for illegals. Then magically "99.999% of them will self-deport".

1) Many paid in cash industries (construction, landscaping, housekeeping, skilled trade) would still thrive. So not sure how he arrived at the 99.999% self-deport number.

2) It's my understanding that the majority of the workers in the berry picking industry are illegal. Not because they are underpaid, not because they are abused, not because they are being cheated or forced to work long hours. Illegals do the work because nobody else will. And they happily and voluntarily show up each day.

3) There are much larger problems than illegals working in the US. They account for a very small fraction of the economy. They make up *maybe* 3% of our population. There are 100,000 gang bangers in Chicago alone. We are fighting wars all over this planet. We have an energy crisis. We have a debt crisis. About 1.5 million Americans declare bankruptcy a year. We have 50 million legal citizens that are uninsured. 1 out of 6 Americans are on food stamps. I could care less about a couple measly percent of hard working families trying to seek a better life that don't have papers because they overstayed their visa or walked across an open border. Deporting them (or having them "self-deport") and their children is not gonna fix our real problems. If deporting/self-deporting 3% of our population not having papers is gonna fix the economy, and help low and medium skilled American labor, and also help honest businesses compete then I have a really big bridge for sale, PM for details.

Edited December 23, 2011 by Lord Infamous

[Robby999 1,024]

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

You're right, I refreshed my memory on Gary. He wants to tax the employers so that there is no work for illegals. Then magically "99.999% of them will self-deport".

1) Many paid in cash industries (construction, landscaping, housekeeping, skilled trade) would still thrive. So not sure how he arrived at the 99.999% self-deport number.

2) It's my understanding that the majority of the workers in the berry picking industry are illegal. Not because they are underpaid, not because they are abused, not because they are being cheated or forced to work long hours. Illegals do the work because nobody else will. And they happily and voluntarily show up each day.

3) There are much larger problems than illegals working in the US. They account for a very small fraction of the economy. They make up *maybe* 3% of our population. There are 100,000 gang bangers in Chicago alone. We are fighting wars all over this planet. We have an energy crisis. We have a debt crisis. About 1.5 million Americans declare bankruptcy a year. We have 50 million legal citizens that are uninsured. 1 out of 6 Americans are on food stamps. I could care less about a couple measly percent of hard working families trying to seek a better life that don't have papers because they overstayed their visa or walked across an open border. Deporting them (or having them "self-deport") and their children is not gonna fix our real problems. If deporting/self-deporting 3% of our population not having papers is gonna fix the economy, and help low and medium skilled American labor, and also help honest businesses compete then I have a really big bridge for sale, PM for details.

Here's another myth told by the Dream Loving Act peeps on here and wherever; "Illegals do the work that Americans won't do."

That's pure bs. It's a supply and demand system here in the US. You pay enough and Americans will do any kind of work. You want something for nothing aka slave labor, just so you can make a bigger profit margin...than ya, hire illegals and pay them slave wages. Break the law by not paying taxes, over time, insurance, safety measures/equipment, etc... Pay less than half of what the legal employer / business pays and get away with bloody murder.

I know this game and the lies/excuses that come with it.

Edited December 23, 2011 by Why_Me

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

You're right, I refreshed my memory on Gary. He wants to tax the employers so that there is no work for illegals. Then magically "99.999% of them will self-deport".

1) Many paid in cash industries (construction, landscaping, housekeeping, skilled trade) would still thrive. So not sure how he arrived at the 99.999% self-deport number.

2) It's my understanding that the majority of the workers in the berry picking industry are illegal. Not because they are underpaid, not because they are abused, not because they are being cheated or forced to work long hours. Illegals do the work because nobody else will. And they happily and voluntarily show up each day.

3) There are much larger problems than illegals working in the US. They account for a very small fraction of the economy. They make up *maybe* 3% of our population. There are 100,000 gang bangers in Chicago alone. We are fighting wars all over this planet. We have an energy crisis. We have a debt crisis. About 1.5 million Americans declare bankruptcy a year. We have 50 million legal citizens that are uninsured. 1 out of 6 Americans are on food stamps. I could care less about a couple measly percent of hard working families trying to seek a better life that don't have papers because they overstayed their visa or walked across an open border. Deporting them (or having them "self-deport") and their children is not gonna fix our real problems. If deporting/self-deporting 3% of our population not having papers is gonna fix the economy, and help low and medium skilled American labor, and also help honest businesses compete then I have a really big bridge for sale, PM for details.

1) How would that work? You would hire a guy to mow your lawn if that could end up costing you $100K in taxes? Don't think you'll pay the taxes? Try living with frozen assets. The IRS can pull that shite easily. Would you take that chance? I sure wouldn't. Only an idiot would even consider hiring anyone that may not be eligible to work here.

2) There are enough people that will go out and harvest berries and other produce. It's a matter of working conditions and pay. Tired of this old bag of those "jobs Americans won't do". Bullshite. Time and again, Americans have stood in line for the jobs they allegedly won't do after some meat packaging plant was raided by ICE. Works every time.

3) That's true. But that does not mean that we cannot ensure that working conditions and pay are not eroded by millions upon millions of illegal aliens and that we cannot protect our sociel safety nets from use and abuse by people who have no business being here in the first place.

[웃 910]

1) How would that work? You would hire a guy to mow your lawn if that could end up costing you $100K in taxes? Don't think you'll pay the taxes? Try living with frozen assets. The IRS can pull that shite easily. Would you take that chance? I sure wouldn't. Only an idiot would even consider hiring anyone that may not be eligible to work here.

2) There are enough people that will go out and harvest berries and other produce. It's a matter of working conditions and pay. Tired of this old bag of those "jobs Americans won't do". Bullshite. Time and again, Americans have stood in line for the jobs they allegedly won't do after some meat packaging plant was raided by ICE. Works every time.

3) That's true. But that does not mean that we cannot ensure that working conditions and pay are not eroded by millions upon millions of illegal aliens and that we cannot protect our sociel safety nets from use and abuse by people who have no business being here in the first place.

1) Are we going to create a new agency that forces all citizens to be a self-regulating private security force that checks immigration status on every odd job, from babysitters to on-the-side roofers/mechanics/etc.? Or just the ones that look Mexican? I don't know about you but I've never asked a single person I've hired for proof of their immigration status - you do that? *Mr. Smith, did you have Jorge do your lawn in the summer of 2009? You did? And you didn't check his papers? Sorry Mr. Smith, here is a $100,000 fine!*

2) Comparing packaging meat to picking berries. That's a bad analogy. How many blond-haired blue-eyed 'Mericans do you know that pick strawberries for a living?

Here's another myth told by the Dream Loving Act peeps on here and wherever; "Illegals do the work that Americans won't do."

That's pure bs. It's a supply and demand system here in the US. You pay enough and Americans will do any kind of work. You want something for nothing aka slave labor, just so you can make a bigger profit margin...than ya, hire illegals and pay them slave wages. Break the law by not paying taxes, over time, insurance, safety measures/equipment, etc... Pay less than half of what the legal employer / business pays and get away with bloody murder.

I know this game and the lies/excuses that come with it.

How much would you have to make an hour to pick strawberries in 100 degree weather from 9am to 9pm Monday through Saturday?

Edited December 23, 2011 by Lord Infamous

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

1) Are we going to create a new agency that forces all citizens to be a self-regulating private security force that checks immigration status on every odd job, from babysitters to on-the-side roofers/mechanics/etc.? Or just the ones that look Mexican? I don't know about you but I've never asked a single person I've hired for proof of their immigration status - you do that? *Mr. Smith, did you have Jorge do your lawn in the summer of 2009? You did? And you didn't check his papers? Sorry Mr. Smith, here is a $100,000 fine!*

2) Comparing packaging meat to picking berries. That's a bad analogy. How many blond-haired blue-eyed 'Mericans do you know that pick strawberries for a living?

1) I don't hire anyone for "odd jobs". Either I do the job myself or I hire a licensed and insured company to do the job. I can't see any job that I would go to the Home Depot to pick someone up to do it for me. And if I did that, I'd be quite aware that that somebody is very likely not to be authorized to work. Common sense tells me that. And again, it's not a fine - it's a tax that's been discussed. Call it the stupid tax. Yes, I'd like to tax stupid people.

2) I've picked fruit in my earlier years. I'm blond-haired and blue-eyed and I saw many that fit that description doing the same thing. What keeps people from doing these jobs are two things: pay and working conditions. Both have eroded over the years and that happened for one major reason - the ample and easy availability of illegal labor.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Here's another myth told by the Dream Loving Act peeps on here and wherever; "Illegals do the work that Americans won't do."

That's pure bs. It's a supply and demand system here in the US. You pay enough and Americans will do any kind of work. You want something for nothing aka slave labor, just so you can make a bigger profit margin...than ya, hire illegals and pay them slave wages. Break the law by not paying taxes, over time, insurance, safety measures/equipment, etc... Pay less than half of what the legal employer / business pays and get away with bloody murder.

I know this game and the lies/excuses that come with it.

That's B.S. You hear that all the time, and a couple of decades ago, somebody called them on it. They took several buses, collected dozens of unemployed inner city males in a major East SF Bay town, offering them top dollar to work in the fields. First day, they filled all the buses, and brought them down to Salinas to pick lettuce. Even though they didn't produce as well as the seasoned workers, they paid them cash at the end of the day, and bused them back home, telling them to report early next morning for work. The buses waited until noon, and not one single person showed up for work the next day.

They used to use hippies up here to pick melons, and after a few years, it became evident that no matter how well you pay them, there are just not enough white people willing to do the back breaking work in the sun. There were folks like that here in California during the depression, and whole families would fight each other for the opportunity earn enough scrip to barely buy the food they needed from the company store. People just don't feel that desperate yet, as long as half of them are on some sort of government assistance. The other half pays them not to work.

Edited December 23, 2011 by Crusty Old Perv

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I've picked fruit in my earlier years. I'm blond-haired and blue-eyed and I saw many that fit that description doing the same thing. What keeps people from doing these jobs are two things: pay and working conditions. Both have eroded over the years and that happened for one major reason - the ample and easy availability of illegal labor.

Thanks for proving my case.

[Danno 1,228]

That's B.S. You hear that all the time, and a couple of decades ago, somebody called them on it. They took several buses, collected dozens of unemployed inner city males in a major East SF Bay town, offering them top dollar to work in the fields. First day, they filled all the buses, and brought them down to Salinas to pick lettuce. Even though they didn't produce as well as the seasoned workers, they paid them cash at the end of the day, and bused them back home, telling them to report early next morning for work. The buses waited until noon, and not one single person showed up for work the next day.

They used to use hippies up here to pick melons, and after a few years, it became evident that no matter how well you pay them, there are just not enough white people willing to do the back breaking work in the sun. There were folks like that here in California during the depression, and whole families would fight each other for the opportunity earn enough scrip to barely buy the food they needed from the company store. People just don't feel that desperate yet, as long as half of them are on some sort of government assistance. The other half pays them not to work.

Seriously, why should people do hard work at low wages when the Gov't makes it so easy... even a right to live in comfortable poverty?

Back in our fathers and grandfathers day Americans used to travel around the country chasing the harvesting periods.

It's so easy now you need not even trek to the Public assistance office they either mail it to your door or recharge your card via computer.