Egypt:Muslim Brotherhood Takes Elections by Storm

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

The Palestinians made trouble in Jordan and tried to off the King of Jordan so they got put in their place. Same thing happened in Lebanon when they started their mischief there and also in Israel. Until they learn to behave proper like and act civil I don't think anyone's going to want them around.

This page has about as much to do with the discussion as your posts:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_food

[mawilson 2,133]

This page has about as much to do with the discussion as your posts:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_food

Dammit, now I'm hungry.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

The Palestinians made trouble in Jordan and tried to off the King of Jordan so they got put in their place. Same thing happened in Lebanon when they started their mischief there and also in Israel. Until they learn to behave proper like and act civil I don't think anyone's going to want them around.

Palestinians are people, not a monolith or a terrorist organization. There are thousands of Palestinians in Jordan. My Palestinian mother was raised in Jordan. The Queen Rania of Jordan is a Palestinian. We are "around" a lot of places, including Israel. The King and the Jordanian government is very active in the two-state issue, so it must not be as put off by the process as you are.

Israeli Leader Visits Jordan to Discuss Palestinian Issue

By ETHAN BRONNER

Published: November 28, 2011

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Until they learn to behave proper like and act civil I don't think anyone's going to want them to be around them.

Doesn't seem to be working. The Israelis don't seem to get the hint.

[The_Dude 1,142]

The territory that the Palestinians claim for their state does not belong to Israel. Israel occupies it and colonizes it, but it does so illegally.

And why would Palestinians claim lands for their state in Syria or Lebanon or Egypt ? Their property isn't there - they weren't expelled from those lands.

You are a joke WOM. You ask for a map, I provide it, and you keep demanding. Over 70% of the land that was originally a part of the Palestine Mandate was in fact annexed by Syria, Jordan and Lebanon, you you, and real Palestinians demand only land from Israel. Seems quite odd don't you think? Not to me of course, because I know you are only making claims to Israel because of a vendetta. If you were making a serious claim, you would be making the same demands of Syria, Lebanon and Jordan that you do to Israel.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Don't play coy, I have brought this up several times and you have merely ignored it. But for the sake of this argument, here is the Palestine Mandate map.

I wonder why you don't blame Syria, Lebanon et al for taking land from Palestine after the mandate? Could it be your own personal bias, or your insufferable hatred of Israel?

Here's the part you ignorantly omitted from your cut and paste job from a pro-Israel Biblical site. Your puppetmasters don't serve you well. You should have paid attention in history class or you would know who was drawing those boundaries and creating nations at will. It wasn't the Arabs.

The joke is you trying to sound knowledgable about something you're entirely clueless about.

1920

The San Remo Peace Conference gave Britain a provisional 'Mandate for Palestine' based upon the Balfour declaration. In legal terms, 'The Mandate for Palestine' was 'The Trust' and Britain was the 'Mandatory' or 'Trustee'. The primary objective of the Mandate was to grant political rights in respect to Palestine to the Jewish people. Initially the Mandate defined "Palestine" as spanning both west and east of the Jordan (Fig.1), an area much larger than the historic Palestine as envisaged by the Zionists.

Fig 1: The 1920 provisional Palestine Mandate (Image courtesy Eli E. Hertz)

1922

The British Mandate was formalized in September 1922 by the Council of the League of Nations. Essentially this body gave unanimous approval for a Jewish national homeland in Palestine. Article 25 of this Mandate enabled the Mandatory to change the terms of the Mandate in the territory east of the Jordan River. Britain, under Colonial Secretary Winston Churchill, activated this option and cut away 77% of the original mandated area for the Jews and created a new country called Trans-Jordan, later called Jordan (Fig.2). The East Bank was therefore given to Britain's Arab allies!

Fig 2: The 1922 British sub-division of the mandated land (Image courtesy Eli E. Hertz)

So the 1922 Mandate for Palestine redefined the boundary of Jewish Palestine as west of the river Jordan. Even though this created a fourth Arab state east of the Jordan, the Arab communities wanted as little to do with the Mandate as possible.

Edited December 4, 2011 by Sofiyya

[The_Dude 1,142]

Nice Red Herring Sofiyya, I guess I should be glad you aren't just trolling. The fact remains that from the current claim by Palestinians is from the Palestine Mandate, of which, 70% of the land was actually annexed by Lebanon, Syria, and Jordan, you and your ilk only demand reparations from Israel. Much of the land that was Palestine was annexed by what you would consider your allies, yet you make no claim to them. Even if a majority of the land was taken by Israel, you still make zero claim to Syria, Lebanon, or Jordan, thus reinforcing the notion that this is simply a vendetta. Even with your prejudiced theory, you don't address the fact that a massive part of Palestinian land was taken by Jordan, Lebanon and Syria. You can twist words all you like, but the fact is, you only demand land from Israel. You can keep up your personal assaults, but that does not change the fact that you are a hyperpartisan with a dog in this fight (Wife_of_mahmoud does not, so I will ask her for her rationale).

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Nice Red Herring Sofiyya, I guess I should be glad you aren't just trolling. The fact remains that from the current claim by Palestinians is from the Palestine Mandate, of which, 70% of the land was actually annexed by Lebanon, Syria, and Jordan, you and your ilk only demand reparations from Israel. Much of the land that was Palestine was annexed by what you would consider your allies, yet you make no claim to them. Even if a majority of the land was taken by Israel, you still make zero claim to Syria, Lebanon, or Jordan, thus reinforcing the notion that this is simply a vendetta. Even with your prejudiced theory, you don't address the fact that a massive part of Palestinian land was taken by Jordan, Lebanon and Syria. You can twist words all you like, but the fact is, you only demand land from Israel. You can keep up your personal assaults, but that does not change the fact that you are a hyperpartisan with a dog in this fight (Wife_of_mahmoud does not, so I will ask her for her rationale).

My turn to point out that you are ignoring what I posted so that you can continue to try to sound like you know what you're talking about, even as you fail. I do have a dog in this fight, and, pay attention now, so does WoM. You, however, do not, so, in the big picture, you and your biases matter not at all.

Have a nice night.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

You are a joke WOM. You ask for a map, I provide it, and you keep demanding. Over 70% of the land that was originally a part of the Palestine Mandate was in fact annexed by Syria, Jordan and Lebanon, you you, and real Palestinians demand only land from Israel. Seems quite odd don't you think? Not to me of course, because I know you are only making claims to Israel because of a vendetta. If you were making a serious claim, you would be making the same demands of Syria, Lebanon and Jordan that you do to Israel.

Nice Red Herring Sofiyya, I guess I should be glad you aren't just trolling. The fact remains that from the current claim by Palestinians is from the Palestine Mandate, of which, 70% of the land was actually annexed by Lebanon, Syria, and Jordan, you and your ilk only demand reparations from Israel. Much of the land that was Palestine was annexed by what you would consider your allies, yet you make no claim to them. Even if a majority of the land was taken by Israel, you still make zero claim to Syria, Lebanon, or Jordan, thus reinforcing the notion that this is simply a vendetta. Even with your prejudiced theory, you don't address the fact that a massive part of Palestinian land was taken by Jordan, Lebanon and Syria. You can twist words all you like, but the fact is, you only demand land from Israel. You can keep up your personal assaults, but that does not change the fact that you are a hyperpartisan with a dog in this fight (Wife_of_mahmoud does not, so I will ask her for her rationale).

So now you’re concerned about “personal assaults” ? Much of your posts are simply ad hominem.

Anyway, you are either mistakenly or deliberately equating two different concepts as interchangeable when they are not. That's why your map is irrelevant.

The Palestinian people are the people who lived in historic Palestine - the land between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea.

“Historic Palestine” is not the same thing as the “Palestine Mandate.” The Mandate is what the British called their administrative demarcation of territory carved out of the old Ottoman Empire. This area, as shown on the map you posted, included historic Palestine (which had been part of Greater Syria) as well as a large chunk of land that had historically belonged to Arabia. In fact, the land of historic Palestine made up less than 25% of the Palestine Mandate.

Palestinian refugees do not originally come from Damascus or Beirut or Amman - they are from Jerusalem, Haifa, Jaffa, Lydda, Ramle, Akka, Safed, Ashkelon, etc. Syria, Lebanon and Jordan are not the ones who ethnically cleansed them and seized their property.

However, Palestinians are not claiming for their state all of the territory that they lived in before 1948. (Personal property claims are a separate issue and not to be confused with “sovereign state territory.”) They claim only a fragment of the nearly half of historic Palestine that was designated for them in the U.N. Partition Plan.

These are the maps that pertain to the discussion - on the left, the original Partition Plan (which Israel officially accepted upon its declaration of statehood) and on the right the much smaller West Bank and Gaza after Israel invaded and annexed additional areas in 1947-1949:

This reduced territory (shown in tan on the right) is the land that the Palestinians have declared as their state - the PA has ceded claim to all the additional territory that Israel seized up until 1967.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]