Small Ky. Church Votes Against Interracial Couples

[Dakine10 5,452]

Don't worry, there is little chance of taking any of this seriously.

And yet you did.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

http://news.yahoo.com/uproar-ky-church-revisits-interracial-ban-235931692.html

After uproar, Ky. church revisits interracial ban

By DYLAN LOVAN | AP – 45 mins ago

LOUISVILLE, Ky. (AP) — When Stella Harville brought her black boyfriend to her family's all-white church in rural Kentucky, she thought nothing of it. She and Ticha Chikuni worshipped there whenever they were in town, and he even sang before the congregation during one service.

Then in August, a member of Gulnare Free Will Baptist Church told Harville's father that Chikuni couldn't sing there anymore. And last Sunday, in a moment that seems from another time, church members voted 9-6 to bar mixed-race couples from joining the congregation.

The policy has drawn a firestorm of criticism in just a few days and sent church leaders scrambling to overturn it, perhaps as early as Sunday.

The executive secretary of the church's national organization said he has been inundated with angry phone calls, and had an inch-high stack of emails printed out on his desk.

"We are not a group of racist people," said Keith Burden of the National Association of Free Will Baptists. "We have been labeled that obviously because of the actions of nine people."

The resolution approved by the Gulnare church says it does not condone interracial marriage and "parties of such marriages will not be received as members, nor will they be used in worship services and other church functions, with the exception being funerals."

Ballots were cast after the service, attended by about 35 to 40 people, but it wasn't clear why so few people voted.

The church member and former pastor who pushed for the vote, Melvin Thompson, wouldn't tell The Associated Press why he did it.

"I am not racist. I will tell you that. I am not prejudiced against any race of people, have never in my lifetime spoke evil" about a race, Thompson said earlier this week in a brief interview. "That's what this is being portrayed as, but it is not."

Thompson stepped down as pastor earlier this year for health reasons, according to Harville's dad, Dean Harville. He said it was Thompson who told him that Chikuni couldn't sing at the church, a small, one-story red brick building with few windows and a white steeple.

After giving interviews earlier this week, the church's current pastor, Stacy Stepp, and several other church members did not return phone calls Friday. One of the members said they were shocked. Stepp said he voted against the measure and would work to overturn it.

The national group distanced itself from the resolution in a statement Thursday, saying it "neither condemns nor disallows" interracial marriage.

It said the church was working to reverse its policy and added, "We encourage the church to follow through with this action."

Harville, who is now engaged to Chikuni, said earlier this week that she felt betrayed by the church.

"Whether they keep the vote or overturn it, it's going to be hard for me go back there," she told AP.

Gulnare is a small town in Pike County, in eastern Kentucky. The county celebrates its Appalachian heritage in the spring with the Hillbilly Days Festival in downtown Pikeville, the county seat, and the Apple Blossom Festival in Elkhorn City, according to a tourism website.

Harville is working on her master's degree in optical engineering at an Indiana college. She met Chikuni, who is from Zimbabwe, at Georgetown College in central Kentucky.

"It's like we were kind of blindsided," Harville said of the church's action.

More than 40 years ago, the U.S. Supreme Court knocked down a Virginia statute barring whites from marrying nonwhites, overturning bans in 15 other states. But while interracial marriages have soared since then, many churches remain largely segregated.

Curtiss Paul DeYoung, a professor at Bethel College who has studied interracial churches, said church members opposed to a more diverse church usually just go somewhere else.

"Rarely today do you see it so blatantly come to a vote. Usually people just leave but they don't say much about it," DeYoung said. "I think this is still one of the last hurdles around race for a lot of folks in this country. It's just rarely stated this bluntly."

The Free Will Baptists trace their history to the 18th century. They emphasized the Arminian doctrine of free will, free grace, and free salvation, in contrast to most Baptists, who were Calvinists and believed Christ died only for those predestined to be saved.

There are some 4,200 churches worldwide. The National Association of Free Will Baptists organized in Nashville, Tenn., in 1935 and is now based in Antioch, Tenn.

The group said in its statement that the denomination has no official policy regarding interracial couples "because it has not been an issue."

[106206 15]

The best action people can take is to stop attending this church if they believe this exclusion is unfair. No response is a response. If they didn't vote against it they voted for it.

These old bigots are dying away, they are reminiscing of the days of separate water coolers and Uncle Tom. I don't think we will be reading about these articles in another 25-40 years. But for now it sucks.

[Darnell 8,479]

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/340738-small-ky-church-votes-against-interracial-couples/page__view__findpost__p__5033100

[Danno 1,228]

The best action people can take is to stop attending this church if they believe this exclusion is unfair. No response is a response. If they didn't vote against it they voted for it.

These old bigots are dying away, they are reminiscing of the days of separate water coolers and Uncle Tom. I don't think we will be reading about these articles in another 25-40 years. But for now it sucks.

- you over estimate human nature, if you don't hear about these cases in 40 or 140 years from now

it's not because people have changed but rather the basic right of free association have been further limited.

- You look down your nose at these "old dying Bigots"... but what about the younger ones, the ones leading people and indeed our country?

Read this set of Values our President embraced until he was vaguely exposed during the 08 election.

This small Ky church has nothing on Obamas church.

88888888888888888888888888888888888888888888

THE BLACK VALUE SYSTEM

Trinity United Church of Christ adopted the Black Value System, written by the Manford Byrd Recognition Committee, chaired by the late Vallmer Jordan in 1981.

Dr. Manford Byrd, our brother in Christ, withstood the ravage of being denied his earned ascension to the number one position in the Chicago School System. His dedication to the pursuit of excellence, despite systematic denials, has inspired the congregation of Trinity United Church of Christ. Prayerfully, we have called upon the wisdom of all past generations of suffering Blacks for guidance in fashioning an instrument of Black self-determination, the Black Value System.

Beginning in 1982, an annual Black Value System - Educational Scholarship in the name of Dr. Byrd was instituted. The first recipient of the Dr. Manford Byrd Award, which is given annually to the man or woman who best exemplifies the Black Value System, was our brother, Dr. Manford Byrd.

These Black Ethics must be taught and exemplified in homes, churches, nurseries and schools, wherever Blacks are gathered. They consist of the following concepts:

Commitment to God. "The God of our weary years" will give us the strength to give up prayerful passivism and become Black Christian Activists, soldiers for Black freedom and the dignity of all humankind. Matthew 22:37 - Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

Commitment to the Black Community. The highest level of achievement for any Black person must be a contribution of strength and continuity of the Black Community. I John 4:20 - If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother [or his sister], he is a liar; for he that loveth not his brother or sister whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

Commitment to the Black Family. The Black family circle must generate strength, stability and love, despite the uncertainty of externals, because these characteristics are required if the developing person is to withstand warping by our racist competitive society. Those Blacks who are blessed with membership in a strong family unit must reach out and expand that blessing to the less fortunate. Deuteronomy 6:6-8 - And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart: And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up. And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.

Dedication to the Pursuit of Education. We must forswear anti-intellectualism. Continued survival demands that each Black person be developed to the utmost of his/her mental potential despite the inadequacies of the formal education process. “Real education” fosters understanding of ourselves as well as every aspect of our environment. Also, it develops within us the ability to fashion concepts and tools for better utilization of our resources, and more effective solutions to our problems. Since the majority of Blacks have been denied such learning, Black Education must include elements that produce high school graduates with marketable skills, a trade or qualifications for apprenticeships, or proper preparation for college. Basic education for all Blacks should include Mathematics, Science, Logic, General Semantics, Participative Politics, Economics and Finance, and the Care and Nurture of Black minds. Matthew 22:37 - Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul and with all thy mind.

Dedication to the Pursuit of Excellence. To the extent that we individually reach for, even strain for excellence, we increase, geometrically, the value and resourcefulness of the Black Community. We must recognize the relativity of one’s best; this year’s best can be bettered next year. Such is the language of growth and development. We must seek to excel in every endeavor. Ecclesiastes 9:10 - Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do [it] with thy might; for [there is] no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.

Adherence to the Black Work Ethic. "It is becoming harder to find qualified people to work in Chicago." Whether this is true or not, it represents one of the many reasons given by businesses and industries for deserting the Chicago area. We must realize that a location with good facilities, adequate transportation and a reputation for producing skilled workers will attract industry. We are in competition with other cities, states and nations for jobs. High productivity must be a goal of the Black workforce. II Thessalonians 3:7-12 - For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you; Neither did we eat any man's bread for nought; but wrought with labor and travail night and day, that we might not be chargeable to any of you: Not because we have not power, but to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us. For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat. For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies. Now them that are such we command and exhort by our Lord Jesus Christ, that with quietness they work, and eat their own bread.

Commitment to Self-Discipline and Self-Respect. To accomplish anything worthwhile requires self-discipline. We must be a community of self-disciplined persons if we are to actualize and utilize our own human resources, instead of perpetually submitting to exploitation by others. Self-discipline, coupled with a respect for self, will enable each of us to be an instrument of Black Progress and a model for Black Youth. I Peter 1:4-7 - To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations: That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perishes, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honor and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ.

Disavowal of the Pursuit of "Middleclassness." Classic methodology on control of captives teaches that captors must be able to identify the "talented tenth" of those subjugated, especially those who show promise of providing the kind of leadership that might threaten the captor's control. Proverbs 3:13-14 - Happy are those who find wisdom and those who gain understanding, for her income is better than silver and her revenue better than gold.

Those so identified are separated from the rest of the people by:

Killing them off directly, and/or fostering a social system that encourages them to kill off one another.

Placing them in concentration camps, and/or structuring an economic environment that induces captive youth to fill the jails and prisons.

Seducing them into a socioeconomic class system which, while training them to earn more dollars, hypnotizes them into believing they are better than others and teaches them to think in terms of "we" and "they" instead of "us."

So, while it is permissible to chase "middleclassness" with all our might, we must avoid the third separation method - the psychological entrapment of Black "middleclassness." If we avoid this snare, we will also diminish our "voluntary" contributions to methods A and B. And more importantly, Black people no longer will be deprived of their birthright: the leadership, resourcefulness and example of their own talented persons.

Pledge to Make the Fruits of All Developing and Acquired Skills Available to the Black Community.

Pledge to Allocate Regularly, a Portion of Personal Resources for Strengthening and Supporting Black Institutions.

Pledge Allegiance to All Black Leadership Who Espouse and Embrace the Black Value System.

Personal Commitment to Embracement of the Black Value System. To measure the worth and validity of all activity in terms of positive contributions to the general welfare of the Black Community and the Advancement of Black People towards freedom.

http://www.trinitychicago.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=114

[106206 15]

- you over estimate human nature, if you don't hear about these cases in 40 or 140 years from now

it's not because people have changed but rather the basic right of free association have been further limited.

- You look down your nose at these "old dying Bigots"... but what about the younger ones, the ones leading people and indeed our country?

Read this set of Values our President embraced until he was vaguely exposed during the 08 election.

This small Ky church has nothing on Obamas church.

Those guys are dying too. They are going to get left in the dust by everyone else around them who is stepping up to the plate and taking jobs and raising themselves socioeconomically. They might not physically be dying like the others but no one will listen when they are too busy making money. Obama didn't get elected because of his church or their views he got elected because he seemed like the best viable alternative to most voters. And he will likely get voted out next time around, or at least it looks that way.

I'd worry more about Obama's church but I'm too busy making money and hanging out with my wife of 3% African descent

Edited December 5, 2011 by caterino

[Danno 1,228]

Those guys are dying too. They are going to get left in the dust by everyone else around them who is stepping up to the plate and taking jobs and raising themselves socioeconomically. They might not physically be dying like the others but no one will listen when they are too busy making money. Obama didn't get elected because of his church or their views he got elected because he seemed like the best viable alternative to most voters. And he will likely get voted out next time around, or at least it looks that way.

I'd worry more about Obama's church but I'm too busy making money and hanging out with my wife of 3% African descent

You kinda raise a good point, as long as everyone is doing well, people become numb to these issues, it's when certain groups fall behind or can't keep up.. or worse when large portions of the society if Jones'in for the

good life they once had or thought was coming that things can get ugly.

You mentioned your wife is 3% african, at such a low percentage is it physically visible?

I've have people in my family do the genealogy research stuff, in fact for a wedding gift my Uncle gave me my mothers side in a book form...... but I really hav't checked to see if there are any "surprises" in there.

Could be Ole Danno is 3% African as well.

[106206 15]

You mentioned your wife is 3% african, at such a low percentage is it physically visible?

It's her great-great grandfather, which I think makes her actually 6% assuming he was 'right off the boat'. Her great-great grandmother was from Spain and when she married him she got booted out of the family.

No, she doesn't look like she is of african descent. Her dad is from north italy, her mom is venezuelan. So she basically looks like a northern Italian and a Venezuelan had a child

All I know is she is really attractive to me

[TBoneTX 46,042]

Could be Ole Danno is 3% African as well.

We've all descended from one ancestress, "Lucy," whose remains were found in the Olduvai Gorge. According to the "one-drop" theory, this makes us all African-American, and ergothuswithforthly eligible for Affirmative Action benefits and probably also reparations, whee man. Edited December 6, 2011 by TBoneTX

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

We've all descended from one ancestress, "Lucy," whose remains were found in the Olduvai Gorge. According to the "one-drop" theory, this makes us all African-American, and ergothuswithforthly eligible for Affirmative Action benefits and probably also reparations, whee man.

My ancestors are all British but they were from the ruling class of African colonies so I am white African-American and I am also a male lesbian. Try not to offend me!

[Danno 1,228]

We've all descended from one ancestress, "Lucy," whose remains were found in the Olduvai Gorge. According to the "one-drop" theory, this makes us all African-American, and ergothuswithforthly eligible for Affirmative Action benefits and probably also reparations, whee man.

Following that logic, we are also "part" great ape as well as descended from them.

If I do have african blood (my mother does tan rather well) I would assume the cross to be much farther along than the 50 thousand of years it took for the races to begin their separate development.

Part of that development may well have included the "inbreeding" of the Africa migrants heading northward to existing Neanderthal.

Some speculate Humans developed regionally rather than coming from Africa.

Multiregional model

Main article: Multiregional hypothesis

Multiregional evolution, a model to account for the pattern of human evolution, was proposed by Milford H. Wolpoff[83] in 1988.[84] Multiregional evolution holds that human evolution from the beginning of the Pleistocene 2.5 million years BP to the present day has been within a single, continuous human species, evolving worldwide from ** erectus into modern ** sapiens. According to the multiregional hypothesis, fossil and genomic data are evidence for worldwide human evolution and contradict the recent speciation postulated by the Recent African origin hypothesis. The fossil evidence was insufficient for Richard Leakey to resolve this debate.[85] Studies of haplogroups in Y-chromosomal DNA and mitochondrial DNA have largely supported a recent African origin.[86] Evidence from autosomal DNA also predominantly supports a Recent African origin. However evidence for archaic admixture in modern humans had been suggested by some studies.[87] Recent sequencing of Neanderthal [88] and Denisovan[89] genomes show that some admixture occurred. Modern humans outside Africa have 2-4% Neanderthal alleles in their genome, and some Melanesians have an additional 4-6% of Denisovan alleles. These new results do not contradict the « Out of Africa » model, except in its strictest interpretation. After recovery from a genetic bottleneck that might be due to the Toba supervolcano catastrophe (73.000 years ago), a fairly small group left Africa and briefly interbred with Neanderthals, probably in the middle-east or even North Africa before their departure. Their still predominantly-African descendants spread to populate the world. A fraction in turn interbred with Denisovans, probably in south-east Asia, before populating Melanesia.[90] HLA haplotypes of Neanderthal and Denisova origin have been identified in modern Eurasian and Oceanian populations.[9]

[edit]

[slim 1,530]

Back to topic here... why can't a religious institution be discriminatory if they choose?

[The_Dude 1,142]

Back to topic here... why can't a religious institution be discriminatory if they choose?

They can, they would however have to forgo any benefits they receive from the federal government as a result of being a religious institution. Sorry Slim, but racism and bigotry is something that is trying to be discouraged, not rewarded.

[Danno 1,228]

They can, they would however have to forgo any benefits they receive from the federal government as a result of being a religious institution. Sorry Slim, but racism and bigotry is something that is trying to be discouraged, not rewarded.

Who has this list on exactly what the Gov is trying to "discourage" ?

Have you in the past complained about the Nation of Islam not paying taxes on their income?

[slim 1,530]

They can, they would however have to forgo any benefits they receive from the federal government as a result of being a religious institution. Sorry Slim, but racism and bigotry is something that is trying to be discouraged, not rewarded.

What's funny is some of you think the government is "rewarding" folks by allowing them to keep money that's already theirs.