TRANSPARENCY

[WhidbeyGirl 1]

Hubby and I have been married now for 3 years. While he was still in Senegal I would send him weekly updates of how much income I made and how it was spent - so he could get an idea of what it was like here in the US.

I attempted to do that when he moved here but he just couldn't understand how my system worked no matter how much I explained it to him. We would both get frustrated and he just told me to do it and tell him what percentage of his check I needed. That worked for awhile - until he started his own business. I KNEW it was going to be tough starting up his own business, especially is this economy and his field. So, since he started not once have I asked him for anything - NOTHING. For a time he was giving me anywhere from $300 to $500 a month, which I figured was just fine. But that stopped over 6 months ago and I had yet to bug him about getting anymore, I've just made adjustments and done without for somethings. Last month my children's state medical came up for review - I HAVE to have his income and expenses, they WILL NOT process it without it, they will deny my children. Biggest issue is we had to take my daughter to the emergency room twice last week for a horrible kidney infection - those are going to be over $4,000 in bills. I had sent in everything except his income and expenses before the visits so they will be covered - as long as he gives me that info.

I've told him I need it otherwise the kids will be denied and then uninsured and the bills will be huge after this last week. He absolutely refuses to give me anything and turned around and said I'm using the kids against him.

I've told him that we NEED absolute transparency in our marriage for it work, he just keeps saying I'm treating him horribly, that he gave up everything to be here and I'm the reason others have left me and that I should just get online and find someone else since I found him online. #######??????????????????? I seriously have no idea how on earth this escalated to this drastic! Yes in the heat of battle I said things that were not appropriate also (won't let myself off the hook or appear that I'm not at fault too). I just don't know how to get through this African pride. I won't be his little subserviant wife who's asks "How high?" when told to jump. He KNOWS he married a strong independent American woman who isn't going to take ####### from anyone or be walked all over.

Any suggestions????????

[mapletree 33]

Couples counseling.

Or give him all the paperwork and let him manage it so he can submit it all.

It may be that he is not doing well financially and embarrassed to share it with you.

[Mzsitch 2]

I agree have you tried counseling?

[NY_BX 397]

Hubby and I have been married now for 3 years. While he was still in Senegal I would send him weekly updates of how much income I made and how it was spent - so he could get an idea of what it was like here in the US.

I attempted to do that when he moved here but he just couldn't understand how my system worked no matter how much I explained it to him. We would both get frustrated and he just told me to do it and tell him what percentage of his check I needed. That worked for awhile - until he started his own business. I KNEW it was going to be tough starting up his own business, especially is this economy and his field. So, since he started not once have I asked him for anything - NOTHING. For a time he was giving me anywhere from $300 to $500 a month, which I figured was just fine. But that stopped over 6 months ago and I had yet to bug him about getting anymore, I've just made adjustments and done without for somethings. Last month my children's state medical came up for review - I HAVE to have his income and expenses, they WILL NOT process it without it, they will deny my children. Biggest issue is we had to take my daughter to the emergency room twice last week for a horrible kidney infection - those are going to be over $4,000 in bills. I had sent in everything except his income and expenses before the visits so they will be covered - as long as he gives me that info.

I've told him I need it otherwise the kids will be denied and then uninsured and the bills will be huge after this last week. He absolutely refuses to give me anything and turned around and said I'm using the kids against him.

I've told him that we NEED absolute transparency in our marriage for it work, he just keeps saying I'm treating him horribly, that he gave up everything to be here and I'm the reason others have left me and that I should just get online and find someone else since I found him online. #######??????????????????? I seriously have no idea how on earth this escalated to this drastic! Yes in the heat of battle I said things that were not appropriate also (won't let myself off the hook or appear that I'm not at fault too). I just don't know how to get through this African pride. I won't be his little subserviant wife who's asks "How high?" when told to jump. He KNOWS he married a strong independent American woman who isn't going to take ####### from anyone or be walked all over.

Any suggestions????????

I'm not the best in marital advice, since 1) I've never been married and, 2) I'm not a licensed expert. However, do you have written documentation that proves you need his information? Do you have taxes reports and the like? Maybe if he reads how serious this is, he'll reconsider. I don't mean to be intrusive, but, are your kids his also? If they are, I find it hard to believe he'd refuse to help his own children. Other than that, beign disrespectful to each other won't fix the problem. I don't think is African pride, more than just macho pride which makes it more disturbing. Did you marry in Senegal? How long has he been in the US? Did things change once he landed here? It sounds like he's only thinking of his well-being and not of his entire family. Starting a business without your consent is a major red flag. That is a huge decision that requires a lot of thought and capital.

Finances are the #1 reason for divorce. Not infidelity, not anything else. Finances. If I were to judge exclusively on this post, you're heading down that path. I hope you can reconcile with him and make it work.

Good luck

[Ebunoluwa 6,136]

Sorry for the problems you are having. It is very difficult for some from 3. world countries to understand our system and protocol here.

First I suggest you calm down and talk quietly to him. No insults and name calling etc..things are said in the heat of the moment, both of you should apologize and move forward to find a solution. Take him to the office if you can or let him speak on the phone to the case worker in regards to your children's medical so that he hears the regulations first hand and doesn't think he is being manipulated through the children and being schemed out of his money. He needs to feel secure about that and understand the regulations of disclosing certain financial things here. Many Africans in general ( of course not all ) are a cash society and want to save and have cash on hand and seeing it evaporate makes them feel panicky. They are not used to our gazillion do's and dont's. Our financial concept is not easy to understand much less the health insurance rat race.

You are so right transparency is a must here in the West and he is not used to that when it comes to his personal business and income. It sometimes starts out alright but then old patterns take over that says I am the man, it is no ones business how much I make, not even my wife's. $300-500 a months was very little to contribute I might add.

Work through this patiently and quietly but firmly. Tell him if he no longer wishes to be transparent so that your children are covered then you will be forced to take another option to protect your children's health and your finances. The other option would be .....ask the case worker.....to live in separate places or something like that, whichever may work. Then let him decide what he wants to do. Your first priority is the children's health and well being and that you are financially secure. You can't go from good to worse because of him. You have to do what you have to do...with or without him. Your priority is with your children, not with the consequences of his lack of transparency and working together as a team.

Counselling with a financial adviser, a spiritual leader or otherwise professional would help to mediate this dilemma.

I wish you the best.

[WhidbeyGirl 1]

Couples counseling.

Or give him all the paperwork and let him manage it so he can submit it all.

It may be that he is not doing well financially and embarrassed to share it with you.

He refuses counseling.

He has seen the paperwork, he won't do it.

I know he's not doing great, he really hasn't had any good painting jobs in 5 months, this is EXACTLY why we need the financial assistance of insurance for the children. I told him if he refuses to give it to me then I'll just give him the bills, he said fine, if he can pay them he will if not he won't. Ummm ya, that won't work, I'm trying to fix my credit after filing bankruptcy not destroy it more.

[WhidbeyGirl 1]

I'm not the best in marital advice, since 1) I've never been married and, 2) I'm not a licensed expert. However, do you have written documentation that proves you need his information? Do you have taxes reports and the like? Maybe if he reads how serious this is, he'll reconsider. I don't mean to be intrusive, but, are your kids his also? If they are, I find it hard to believe he'd refuse to help his own children. Other than that, beign disrespectful to each other won't fix the problem. I don't think is African pride, more than just macho pride which makes it more disturbing. Did you marry in Senegal? How long has he been in the US? Did things change once he landed here? It sounds like he's only thinking of his well-being and not of his entire family. Starting a business without your consent is a major red flag. That is a huge decision that requires a lot of thought and capital.

Finances are the #1 reason for divorce. Not infidelity, not anything else. Finances. If I were to judge exclusively on this post, you're heading down that path. I hope you can reconcile with him and make it work.

Good luck

He's seen the paperwork, doesn't care. No they aren't his kids, but my daughter calls him daddy and he refers to her and her brothers as his daughter and sons.

Yes married in Senegal.

He's been here just over 2 years

He didn't start a business without my consent, we talked it over completely, that's not the issue at all.

Being a former counselor I do know that finances are the biggest reason for divorce, that is why I started the way I did with emailing him all of my finances before he even got here. He doesn't like that I spend money on my farm (a whole $130 a month maybe) and that my daughter goes to private school (which after my parents pay over half we are only paying at most $295, most months a lot less because my older kids pick my daughter up right after school so we don't have to pay afterschool care.)

[WhidbeyGirl 1]

Sorry for the problems you are having. It is very difficult for some from 3. world countries to understand our system and protocol here.

First I suggest you calm down and talk quietly to him. No insults and name calling etc..things are said in the heat of the moment, both of you should apologize and move forward to find a solution. Take him to the office if you can or let him speak on the phone to the case worker in regards to your children's medical so that he hears the regulations first hand and doesn't think he is being manipulated through the children and being schemed out of his money. He needs to feel secure about that and understand the regulations of disclosing certain financial things here. Many Africans in general ( of course not all ) are a cash society and want to save and have cash on hand and seeing it evaporate makes them feel panicky. They are not used to our gazillion do's and dont's. Our financial concept is not easy to understand much less the health insurance rat race.

You are so right transparency is a must here in the West and he is not used to that when it comes to his personal business and income. It sometimes starts out alright but then old patterns take over that says I am the man, it is no ones business how much I make, not even my wife's. $300-500 a months was very little to contribute I might add.

Work through this patiently and quietly but firmly. Tell him if he no longer wishes to be transparent so that your children are covered then you will be forced to take another option to protect your children's health and your finances. The other option would be .....ask the case worker.....to live in separate places or something like that, whichever may work. Then let him decide what he wants to do. Your first priority is the children's health and well being and that you are financially secure. You can't go from good to worse because of him. You have to do what you have to do...with or without him. Your priority is with your children, not with the consequences of his lack of transparency and working together as a team.

Counselling with a financial adviser, a spiritual leader or otherwise professional would help to mediate this dilemma.

I wish you the best.

He does understand a whole lot because I made him make sure he was running his business COMPLETELY legal - he not only has a state license, he has a contractors license, he collects and pays state tax for all of his customers, he bonded, he's insured - the whole ball of wax! This is all about him not wanting me to know how much his income is. He seems to think I don't know he's sending money back to Africa to support his siblings and friends.

Moving separately is NOT an option unless he files for divorce. I'm probably being very stubborn here but it's not happening. Part of me knows that's exactly what he wants, his good friend who got him online to the place I met him is "lucky" enough to be married to someone and they live in separate houses and he "visits" her on the weekend. How the heck they made it through all the gc stuff I have no idea because they haven't lived together - ever.

Ultimately, I will do what I have always done, sacrifice for my children, that's what mom's do (at least they should!). I just really thought I finally met someone to do life with me at my side working together as a family.

I realize $300-$500 a month was very little to contribute, but it was better than nothing.

Edited November 15, 2011 by WhidbeyGirl

[Ebunoluwa 6,136]

If he seems to think that you don't know that he is sending money to family and friends then that secrecy would be a deal breaker for me.

Putting 'friends' above the children is ridiculous. Him not talking about sending money home and how much is shady. His focus is elsewhere.

If part of you knows he is wanting to move out then let him go and get your life back. You were fine without him and will be again.

You can't hold on to someone who has an emotional foot out the door and you deserve so much better. It is extremely stressful.

I also know someone who 'visits' his wife once in a blue moon. It is all a facade.

Man, WhidbeyGirl....I am so sorry. I hope he will come to his senses and things turn to the better. I have no more suggestions for you except to pray and seek God. I feel your pain and I hate this. HUGS.

[NigeriaorBust 4,087]

You need to have a big talk with him. Explain that while you are married your bills are joint and if you can't pay they will come to him to pay even if you divorce later. The smart thing to do is let the government help pays as much of these bills as they will that will mean less will be for YOU ( as in the plural you ) to pay. Joseph and I do a separate account thing. I don't want him to be pressured by family to send money there that will mean me missing important payments and he wants to have control over his own money. So we take what we each make and the "common" bills ( housing, utilities, insurance and such ) and they get divided by the respective percentage. When it comes to taxes the same thing applies. I showed him how it is better to file together and then spilt up the return. Appeal to his sence of saving money , I don't know an African male that doesn't like working a deal.

[Tosh Love 77]

Hello,

I seldom reply to postings on this forum but yours touched me and I am inclined to add my two cents. First of all, I commend you for putting your "business" out there and trusting that the same intent will be relayed by others. I am not an expert by any stretch of the imagination but I have been married once, and I am a Ghanaian who was born and bred overseas, have a several stubborn brothers and spend a lot of time back home with my other male relatives and friends, so I somewhat see both sides.

My suggestion is to take a step back and take a deep breath. I suspect that your husband expected to be doing better financially now than he is doing currently, therefore going "public" (from his perspective) to share his financial circumstance is somewhat not an option. It is akin to telling the world about his masculinity or lack thereof. A typical African male's financial status is one of the most important things to him so please tread lightly.

I suspect if this were happening to someone else, you would know exactly how to get through to them, but since you are too close to the scene you are attacking it as a battle. You know him and know how to get through to him. Try a different angle and please feel free to PM me. Good Luck and Best Wishes.

[MAO36 30]

If he seems to think that you don't know that he is sending money to family and friends then that secrecy would be a deal breaker for me.

Putting 'friends' above the children is ridiculous. Him not talking about sending money home and how much is shady. His focus is elsewhere.

If part of you knows he is wanting to move out then let him go and get your life back. You were fine without him and will be again.

You can't hold on to someone who has an emotional foot out the door and you deserve so much better. It is extremely stressful.

I also know someone who 'visits' his wife once in a blue moon. It is all a facade.

Man, WhidbeyGirl....I am so sorry. I hope he will come to his senses and things turn to the better. I have no more suggestions for you except to pray and seek God. I feel your pain and I hate this. HUGS.

Great advice!

[patient2010 93]

I pray things work out for the two of you

[forchika 4]

I pray things work out for the two of you

I am in agreeance with patient2010..I think he will change his mind once those bills, start to come in. Medical expenses here in the US are very,very expensive. Even a rich person could go broke here trying to pay medical bills. He should loose his stubbornest and realize it is for the sake of the kids and your financial future! GOOD LUCK

[WhidbeyGirl 1]

He FINALLY agreed and we gathered all the info this weekend and faxed it in yesterday morning - 9 days past due, but the worker called me and said she extended the deadline. Yesterday we got the two hospital bills for my daughters ER visits - over $8,400!!! I'm sure if he hadn't agreed over the weekend yesterday's bills would have "motivated" him. So that issue is resolved. Others still exist and I realize that. I'll just keep tackling them as they arise.