American exceptionalism

[Captain Oates 911]

I hear a lot about American exceptionalism

Some people interpret that in supremacist way and others understand it to mean that the American constitution etc allows an egalitarian society in which anyone can do well

Chris Matthews on MSNBC has a trailer which states that only in the US could a Barack Obama make it to the white house

We don't have to go far to see that is self-congratulatory boloney

Willie Brand was an illegitimate and poor German and made it to chancellor

The UK has had Prime Ministers which were

A Jewish

B Female

C A circus trapeze artist's son with a cockney accent

The US can't equal that

I think that the US is equaled by many countries as far as upward mobility is concerned

So is American exceptionalism just a boast designed to make other peoples feel inferior ? I can turn on my telly any night of the week and hear that the US is "The finest country that has ever existed in the history of the world". Is exceptionalism just more of the same ?

I have heard Americans say that the US is exceptional but in a bad way - it is the exception in not having universal health care, declining educational standards, low life expectancy etc etc etc.

I wouldn't pile on in that way because the US is far from finished and the decline need only be temporary, but isn't it time for the boasting to stop - boasting never did help any country to gain friends - or is American exceptionalism something different to boasting and where people in other countries need not feel they are being belittled ?

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

I hear a lot about American exceptionalism

Some people interpret that in supremacist way and others understand it to mean that the American constitution etc allows an egalitarian society in which anyone can do well

Chris Matthews on MSNBC has a trailer which states that only in the US could a Barack Obama make it to the white house

We don't have to go far to see that is self-congratulatory boloney

Willie Brand was an illegitimate and poor German and made it to chancellor

The UK has had Prime Ministers which were

A Jewish

B Female

C A circus trapeze artist's son with a cockney accent

The US can't equal that

I think that the US is equaled by many countries as far as upward mobility is concerned

So is American exceptionalism just a boast designed to make other peoples feel inferior ? I can turn on my telly any night of the week and hear that the US is "The finest country that has ever existed in the history of the world". Is exceptionalism just more of the same ?

I have heard Americans say that the US is exceptional but in a bad way - it is the exception in not having universal health care, declining educational standards, low life expectancy etc etc etc.

I wouldn't pile on in that way because the US is far from finished and the decline need only be temporary, but isn't it time for the boasting to stop - boasting never did help any country to gain friends - or is American exceptionalism something different to boasting and where people in other countries need not feel they are being belittled ?

Really, who ever liked the kid in class who thought they were better than everyone else because of where they lived?

[mawilson 2,133]

The UK has had Prime Ministers which were

A Jewish

B Female

C A circus trapeze artist's son with a cockney accent

But black?

[Captain Oates 911]

But black?

Well Mr O isn't proper black (well only in the USA is he black).... and he isn't even the descendant of slaves.

Only when the US has a president who is either gay or non religious, will I concede that anyone can be president in reality

If a classification of people cannot be president in reality, then where is the exceptionalism ?

I think the truth is that the USA is a collection of peoples from all over the world with no shared ethnicity or history, and they are terrified of it not holding together, and so all the " exceptionalism" and flag waving is nothing but a desperate attempt to forge the kind of common identity that other nations have had for centuries. If that is so, then it is born of underlying insecurity

The US need not be insecure and the best way to show that it is comfortable in its own skin, is to acknowledge that it is one country among many, and many have admirable attributes as well as the US.

Walking into a party and saying my wife is better looking than the other wives is no way to to make friends in the world

If the US really believes in the egalitarian way, then it should start with the community of nations and not claim to be any more (or any less), than fully equal but not superior, with the rest

Doing otherwise is where Adolf went wrong

Edited November 8, 2011 by Austin Devon

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Walking into a party and saying my wife is better looking than the other wives is no way to to make friends in the world

No, but it is a way to make friends on VJ.

[Captain Oates 911]

No, but it is a way to make friends on VJ.

I spend all my time trying to perfect the art of false modesty, and it isn't fair that Americans don't even try

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

I spend all my time trying to perfect the art of false modesty, and it isn't fair that Americans don't even try

False modesty is a trait we're sorely lacking, though I of course got to hone my skills in my 12-year sabbatical abroad.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

I spend all my time trying to perfect the art of false modesty, and it isn't fair that Americans don't even try

I blame it on John Wayne.

[Captain Oates 911]

False modesty is a trait we're sorely lacking, though I of course got to hone my skills in my 12-year sabbatical abroad.

Every American should have 2 years training in false modesty. Americans already have the pre requisites of looking down on the surrender monkey French, the snotty Brits, the inadequately rest-roomed Italians etc, and so they already have the first required element of superiority. It is only a short step from that to becoming proficient at false modesty as the main ingredient is a smirk and a patronising approach and a shrug of the shoulders as to how one actually achieved all one's attributes so effortlessly and it must have been pure luck.

Saying how popular one was at school and how the one's dentist sculpted the most advanced tooth braces in the world resulting in a word class smile, is an automatic fail.

Thinking about it, the doctrine of American exceptionalism is merely an extension of the "aren't I wonderful" which is at large in society generally, and so banishing the concept of exceptionalism would do no good as it is only the tip of the iceberg

One look at how a rugby union team reacts to a scored point, (grim determination, restrained smile), compared to say the Green Bay Packers who rapturise and pat each others bottoms for what seems like an eternity, demonstrates the point very clearly.

Yes it looks like we are stuck with exceptionalism as much as we are stuck with dandelions

[Danno 1,228]

After the fall of the USSR, the USA was the sole super power in the world, I'm not sure very many countries in History have had that power and not used it for ill will.

In fact one of our faults is, when we go to war, we return with nothing but the bodies of our dead. (and future business contacts)

IN just a few hundred years we not only survived with our original Government but we vaulted to Super Power status, completely shaping the course of world history with our foreign Policy and war efforts.

Thats pretty exceptional.

We put a man on the moon when your country couldn't get one off the ground.

Actually the British people in an earlier century we pretty exceptional, unfortunately your time has come gone..... though I fear ours too is ebbing.

You made the observation of:

I think the truth is that the USA is a collection of peoples from all over the world with no shared ethnicity or history, and they are terrified of it not holding together, and so all the " exceptionalism" and flag waving is nothing, but a desperate attempt to forge the kind of common identity that other nations have had for centuries. If that is so, then it is born of underlying insecurity

Historically we are a collection of Europeans with a minority of a few others, Ex-Slaves I suppose being next largest group.

More recently we have been (as you noted) a collection of people from around the world, I have predicted that'll be our undoing (among other things) but at this early stage, I see no major crumblings outside of pocketed areas.

We referred to ourselves as "Exceptional" when we were nearly 90% white so I doubt we are using that line now to mask or forge some new Identity which you say we lack.

Q: IF the USA is not exceptional..... tell me who is?

IF we are all exceptional in our own way (gag) ... then no peoples are exceptional.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

It's funny -- I was raised to be modest about my achievements and to praise those of others, but when I first moved to the UK all I heard about was how I needed to bury my light under a bushel a bit more. Now that I'm back here, I'm told I'm far too modest.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

[Captain Oates 911]

After the fall of the USSR, the USA was the sole super power in the world, I'm not sure very many countries in History have had that power and not used it for ill will.

In fact one of our faults is, when we go to war, we return with nothing but the bodies of our dead. (and future business contacts)

IN just a few hundred years we not only survived with our original Government but we vaulted to Super Power status, completely shaping the course of world history with our foreign Policy and war efforts.

Thats pretty exceptional.

We put a man on the moon when your country couldn't get one off the ground.

Actually the British people in an earlier century we pretty exceptional, unfortunately your time has come gone..... though I fear ours too is ebbing.

You made the observation of:

I think the truth is that the USA is a collection of peoples from all over the world with no shared ethnicity or history, and they are terrified of it not holding together, and so all the " exceptionalism" and flag waving is nothing, but a desperate attempt to forge the kind of common identity that other nations have had for centuries. If that is so, then it is born of underlying insecurity

Historically we are a collection of Europeans with a minority of a few others, Ex-Slaves I suppose being next largest group.

More recently we have been (as you noted) a collection of people from around the world, I have predicted that'll be our undoing (among other things) but at this early stage, I see no major crumblings outside of pocketed areas.

We referred to ourselves as "Exceptional" when we were nearly 90% white so I doubt we are using that line now to mask or forge some new Identity which you say we lack.

Q: IF the USA is not exceptional..... tell me who is?

IF we are all exceptional in our own way (gag) ... then no peoples are exceptional.

The fact is that the rocket program was the brain child of Hitler's inventor of the V2 rocket Wehrner von Braun. His rockets killed thousands of people in England. Yes American money enabled this SS Officer and favorite of Hitler to fulfill his dream of getting a rocket to the moon and certainly the American money was exceptional, but more importantly, German science. German science also put the Russians in space.

The atom bomb was the brainchild of Einstein and other foreigners who were also sucked in by US money

The US has lost its way in two important areas but the good news is that both are repairable. Firstly health care which is a crazy cost that shackles US industry, and secondly the political system which is in need of change to a more parliamentary form. The second is held back by the constitution and so although it could be changed, it wont be changed and is now paralyzed. The country will now be paralyzed at all times when the president and both houses are not from the same party. The dems wont forget the last 3 years and if they have a chance, they will paralyze future government as a retaliation.

So I have mixed feelings about the future in that it could be fixed but it won't be fixed. My concern is that the US will keep telling the world they are inferior to the US, while living on past achievements and thereby not acknowledging the need to change

eg Socialized medicine is cheap and helps with competitiveness - but the US refuses to do what 'they' do and so no change is possible.

If the US is not careful, its exceptionalism will only be apparent through its outmoded institutions holding it back while others go ahead.

18th century political methods and dogmas won't work today and that's the problem. The US needs to borrow political/educational/societal ideas from Europe and Singapore and China and all sorts of foreigners who might actually be better at some some things - just as they did with einstein and von Braun in science

Equating my rights to that of a fertilized egg is a distraction the country cannot afford

Edited November 8, 2011 by Austin Devon

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

The U.S. is exceptional in being the New World. There's only one on this globe.

It was built on the idea that it would be a safe heaven for peoples from all over the world and all walks of life, regardless of their ethnicity and religion. It's a rather new nation, so we had a few hiccups regarding the color of the skin. Oh, and the gender, of course, but now blacks and even women can vote after all.

It took a revolutionary war, and pretty much 200 years for this nation to get somewhere, in large part to the greatest President of the United States of modern times: F.D.R. Although born with a gold spoon in his hand, his contraction of Polio and the fight to conceal its effects created the little bit of a social net the U.S. has. Or had. When Cowboy actor Ronald Reagan came into office, he immediately started to dismantle this safety net and hand all of it over to his super-rich Cronies.

Unfortunately, the American sheep didn't realize this. Too impressed with fame and bling and empty words, they were easily distracted by non-issues, something that continues today with gays, and immigration, and abortion . . . all things that has nothing to do with them personally, but it keeps 'em occupied in times when Jerry Springer and Oprah and the Kardashians are off air.

But now, for the first time, we have finally a movement of the 99%. Latest polls of today show that 78% of Americans are in favor of stopping to give money to the almighty corporations and already filthy rich, and instead finding a way to more equal distribution of tax burden and benefits. In fact, that's something even the crazy Tea Party folks agree on!

So there's hope again. Maybe we will really see a change we can believe in very soon. It would be a dream come true. I remember the mid-'60s when I was just a young lad, driving a worn out VeeDub Beetle with rust holes, seeing the suffering of my fellow people behind the iron curtain, yet was also able to admire the American Way of Life, when American automobiles were as luxurious as it gets, and as big as American freeways, American parking spaces, American Malls, and American refrigerators. The U.S. was truly # 1 in everything, and that's the America I remember and that's the America I wanted to live in.

Exceptional? You bet.

[Captain Oates 911]

I went to East Berlin before the wall came down and everything bad they said about communism was true - much to my surprise as I thought it would be mainly propaganda.

It is the tendency in nature for the predators to eat the herbivores until there are few left - and then the predators die out

The predators are the 1% and they have grown fat on the sheep and are moving on. The doctors and dentists in the US are like predators with no sense of vocation - just get rich quick

I wouldn't mind the US being exceptional so long as they didn't say it

It's not very English you see

Perhaps that is the problem

Anyway I think the world would like to see the USA being exceptional again so long as they weren't then told how inferior they were (by inference )....

The Brits thought their motorbikes were good in the 60's, but they were junk and the Japanese outclassed them immediately. Same thing with Ford - many Americans wont buy Ford and buy Toyota. They lived on their laurels and their economy of scale until they were easily displaced by a better product. If they had realized they were not number one forever, they might have been willing to learn from the foreigners. They sure are now but its too late for many buyers. Rice burners indeed.

Pride comes before a fall as they say

Every country has good things and bad things about their country but the country that says it is number one and is the best in everything and has nothing to learn from foreigners, will learn a sharp lesson.

I still think the US will recover, but those at the bottom are stuffed unless they want to compete for lawn mowing jobs with the illegals - however they will still vote for no unions, no teachers, no firemen, dirty water, air pollution, oil spills, executions, huge jails, no health care please and eggs are people. In that, they will be wholly exceptional in the developed world but they bring it on themselves.