The rest of the industrialized world has universal health care

[Welshcookie 17]

Ahhh Social Health Care what a great Socialist idea.

Hehe, the NHS SUCKS!

I would hate to be without it.....I take it you chose to go private for your health care then?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

People who think government can't manage things such as healthcare never once question government's capacity to manage the military - even when there's plenty of evidence they bungle that one too. Hell, why don't we privatize that?

Careful what you're asking for...

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I'm not good with authority figures...that's for sure, Charles. But believe it or not, my childhood dream was to join the Air Force and be a pilot - contemplated attending the AFA. I was even in CAP (Civil Air Patrol) and a boy scout. My grandfather (Dad's father) was stationed in France during WW1 and got gassed by the Germans - we still have his purple heart. My father served in the Navy and 3 of my brothers all served (2 Army, 1 Air Force), one of them recently came back from volunteering in Iraq. The military would have been a great career but I'm just not cut out for being a 'yessir' kinda guy.

I right there with you on the authority figures !

Believe it or not my mother worked with the CAP during the gulf war...MY MOM!

...hehehe...we had a song that went something like... "...in the Civil Air Pa...Civil Air Patrol." We had our meetings on an air base and actually did marching drills. Some guys though were hardcore about it which I found amusing...I mean, come-on, we're the Civil Air Patrol, not the Marines.

People who think government can't manage things such as healthcare never once question government's capacity to manage the military - even when there's plenty of evidence they bungle that one too. Hell, why don't we privatize that?

Careful what you're asking for...

Yeah...I realize that it's already partially true...sigh.

[homesick_american 1]

Every time someone brings this up, instead of intelligent debate we get this ...

Ahhh Social Health Care what a great Socialist idea.

Tell ya what, if your anti-social get off the internet. Its subsidized big time. Why not stop flying, driving, heating your home too.. All socialized systems to one degree or another. Heck, 50% of medical care in the US is allready socialized. Whats the other 50% going to do? Put a few insurance companies out of business? Geez, Id hate to see that. After all, Insurance companies have the right to tell people they are not covered and to go to the worst doctor in town and then pay their VP's million dollar bonuses becaused they saved the company a few bucks. Private healthcare, sure is great aint it? I guess if you can afford about 5K / month or so and have a couple of mil in the bank in case of disaster its just dandy.

Don't forget also our national defense is socialized as well. People who think government can't manage things such as healthcare never once question government's capacity to manage the military - even when there's plenty of evidence they bungle that one too. Hell, why don't we privatize that?

I don't doubt *a* government's capacity to run healthcare. I doubt the *US* government's capacity to run it. Just look at the byzantine bureaucracy involved in...well...ANYTHING in the United States. Would you really want them running healthcare for everyone? I sure wouldn't.

Plus, I would DREAD...absolutely DREAD...the introduction of an NHS-style model in the United States, where healthcare is severely rationed and patient care (in my opinion) is compromised while nurses lose their jobs and patients sit unattended in pools of their own blood and urine and GPs are paid obscene wages and middle managers suck down more and more money at the trough. In my opinion the NHS is a disaster redeemed in part ONLY by devoted, selfless doctors and nurses who still give a #######.

I have gotten caring, attentive medical attention in the UK. However, most of the medical care I have received here has been sub-standard compared to what I received in the US. All in all, I would rate the NHS as inferior to the US's maze of private healthcare providers, though the NHS is probably better than what you'd get at county facilities/free clinics in the US. If you can afford good medical care, the quality in the US is stellar. In the UK, it's so-so everywhere unless you can afford to go private, but even then going private just means you get to jump the queues since private physicians seem to be bound by the same N.I.C.E. straitjacket that NHS doctors are.

I have a condition called interstitial cystitis. It's not contagious, serious, or fatal. It's just uncomfortable. There is an array of treatments available for it in the United States, but even the most basic and rudimentary of these are not available in the United Kingdom, either because they are deemed 'too expensive' or because the NHS just doesn't care. I am currently not on any medication for the condition because the one medication available to me, a tri-cyclic anti-depressive, made me so exhausted I could barely get through the day, plus I put on forty pounds (which I've since lost). The only other 'treatment' would involve caustic chemicals being pumped directly into my bladder. The #1 reason for us to return to the United States is so I can receive adequate treatment for this condition. Even my GP and my consultant urologist here both agreed that I would receive FAR better treatment in America. You can't even get urinary analgesics like phenazopyridine here. If you have a UTI, they recommend that you drink water with baking soda in it. If you have high blood pressure, I guess you'll just have to bite on a block of wood or risk a stroke. It's BARBARIC.

Something needs to change in the US, that's for sure. Spiralling healthcare costs have the potential to devastate our economy. However, I do not agree that an NHS-style model is the way to go. I can't speak for all 'socialized' healthcare models, only this one...as this one is the one I have the most experience with. I've experienced emergency healthcare in France, but it was one time only and I was so out of it that I can't really speak about it with any authority.

Ahhh Social Health Care what a great Socialist idea.

Hehe, the NHS SUCKS!

I would hate to be without it.....I take it you chose to go private for your health care then?

LOL, who could afford that? I just don't go to my GP anymore, it's a waste of my time and hers. Besides, all they do here is push pills at you anyway. I'm not on any medication so there's no point in seeing a doctor. The last time I saw the doctor was months ago, and that was so she could check on my weight loss progress. I have a good relationship with my GP, but I don't actually need her for anything at the moment.

[godsavethequeen 0]

The NHS ain't perfect by any means but if I fall over sick I get treated whether I have Health Insurance or not. ...and I won't own my soul to Insurance Company Shareholders either.

I'd rather have a lower standard "free" health care than the US "pay for best treatment and be bankrupt thereafter"

Yeah I noticed that while in the US the doctors passing out pills for absolutely anything. One woman I met was taking pills for forgetfulness!! Not Alzeheimers, forgetfulness. Those US Docs seem slightly to be in the Drug Companies greasy palms.

Shoot man I know I'm gonna get real ill over there with some doctor ripping the last bucks out my pocket before I pass away, I just know it....

[homesick_american 1]

The NHS ain't perfect by any means but if I fall over sick I get treated whether I have Health Insurance or not. ...and I won't own my soul to Insurance Company Shareholders either.

I'd rather have a lower standard "free" health care than the US "pay for best treatment and be bankrupt thereafter"

Yeah I noticed that while in the US the doctors passing out pills for absolutely anything. One woman I met was taking pills for forgetfulness!! Not Alzeheimers, forgetfulness. Those US Docs seem slightly to be in the Drug Companies greasy palms.

Shoot man I know I'm gonna get real ill over there with some doctor ripping the last bucks out my pocket before I pass away, I just know it....

*shrug* Or you could stay in the UK and use the NHS. Up to you.

When I lived in the US, my doctor never gave me any pills just for the asking. If she suspected some kind of bacterial infection, she actually RAN TESTS to make sure before prescribing me anti-biotics, whereas in the UK anti-biotics are simply thrown at me if I ask for them, and they're not targeted to a specific infectious agent because obviously THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

If you can afford good medical care, the quality in the US is stellar.

Afford? If a doctor cares to see you. I remember quite well how almost impossible it was to find an OB/GYN that was going to care for my wife for the last trimester of her pregnancy after we moved from one state to another when she was about 6 months along. Health insurance wasn't an issue. Most doc's just happened to make it a rule that they don't take pregnant women as new patients if they're past week 12. Stellar care my patoot.

[incanada1234 0]

I actually agree that private health care has many, MANY problems. But now that I've actually experienced socialized medicine, I can't say I prefer it. I'm really not wholly for either system but really, what would be a happy medium?

The one main HUGE reason I'm against universal health care is the taxes. I shudder to think how much I gave the Canadian government in the last four years, and it WAS a lot because I made good money. A study was done that showed that the average Canadian family paid $4000 a year for "free" health care. The only time it would be useful is if you needed a major operation or you had cancer, etc; something that kept you in the hospital for a long time. But is $4000 a year, money that you have no choice whether you want to pay it or not, really worth it? We researched once we got to the U.S. and found a company that offers us amazing health care coverage for $130 a month. That's for both of us, not each. Granted we're young and healthy, but why should I have to be young and healthy and have to pay for others' medical expenses in Canada?

Really, if you're curious just google Canadian health care, see what kind of wonderful things are written about it (from people that actually experience/have experienced it. not some jack A american who's never used it in his life and yet seems to think it would solve all the US's health care problems...Steven).

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

A study was done that showed that the average Canadian family paid $4000 a year for "free" health care.

Who did that study?

Besides, I pay somewhere around 3K a year out of my pocket for premiums, then I pay co-pays and somthing to the tune of $500.00 flat per hospital stay. My employer gets shafted as well as they contribute to my premiums also. Then I pay the medicare tax off my payroll. And I finance the county health facilities as well as the VA via my taxes. Bottom line: I'd take all-around healthcare for 4K a year in a heartbeat. Would save me tons of money.

[godsavethequeen 0]

The NHS ain't perfect by any means but if I fall over sick I get treated whether I have Health Insurance or not. ...and I won't own my soul to Insurance Company Shareholders either.

I'd rather have a lower standard "free" health care than the US "pay for best treatment and be bankrupt thereafter"

Yeah I noticed that while in the US the doctors passing out pills for absolutely anything. One woman I met was taking pills for forgetfulness!! Not Alzeheimers, forgetfulness. Those US Docs seem slightly to be in the Drug Companies greasy palms.

Shoot man I know I'm gonna get real ill over there with some doctor ripping the last bucks out my pocket before I pass away, I just know it....

*shrug* Or you could stay in the UK and use the NHS. Up to you.

When I lived in the US, my doctor never gave me any pills just for the asking. If she suspected some kind of bacterial infection, she actually RAN TESTS to make sure before prescribing me anti-biotics, whereas in the UK anti-biotics are simply thrown at me if I ask for them, and they're not targeted to a specific infectious agent because obviously THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS.

Why everytime some immigrant criticises the US system they get told to stay in your own country. You lot are right fascists sometimes. What is so wrong with paying higher taxes for health care? You pay them to wage wars!!

I can always hop a plane to the UK fall out of it and get my free health care. Do it the opposite way and you're financially crippled.

& of course they do your bacterial infection tests in the US they are charging mega bucks for it. And making a handsome profit.... They do have private clinics in the UK too you know!! They'll snatch your £££'s big time too.

[cmartyn 0]

Well, we all seem to agree on it. We want universal healthcare that is affordable for all and doesn't suck :-) And I think we all agree that the government would botch it up the ying yang if they tried to deliver it.

I like the old Eskimo approach where the sick are put on a piece of ice and floated out to sea.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I like the old Eskimo approach where the sick are put on a piece of ice and floated out to sea.

Well, with all the global warming, the Eskimo's are going to have to find a new system to "take care" of their sick as well. There'll be a premium on these pieces of ice soon. Maybe I should trade in futures on pieces of arctic ice.

[homesick_american 1]

If you can afford good medical care, the quality in the US is stellar.

Afford? If a doctor cares to see you. I remember quite well how almost impossible it was to find an OB/GYN that was going to care for my wife for the last trimester of her pregnancy after we moved from one state to another when she was about 6 months along. Health insurance wasn't an issue. Most doc's just happened to make it a rule that they don't take pregnant women as new patients if they're past week 12. Stellar care my patoot.

*shrug* You'd have the same problem here.

The NHS ain't perfect by any means but if I fall over sick I get treated whether I have Health Insurance or not. ...and I won't own my soul to Insurance Company Shareholders either.

I'd rather have a lower standard "free" health care than the US "pay for best treatment and be bankrupt thereafter"

Yeah I noticed that while in the US the doctors passing out pills for absolutely anything. One woman I met was taking pills for forgetfulness!! Not Alzeheimers, forgetfulness. Those US Docs seem slightly to be in the Drug Companies greasy palms.

Shoot man I know I'm gonna get real ill over there with some doctor ripping the last bucks out my pocket before I pass away, I just know it....

*shrug* Or you could stay in the UK and use the NHS. Up to you.

When I lived in the US, my doctor never gave me any pills just for the asking. If she suspected some kind of bacterial infection, she actually RAN TESTS to make sure before prescribing me anti-biotics, whereas in the UK anti-biotics are simply thrown at me if I ask for them, and they're not targeted to a specific infectious agent because obviously THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS.

Why everytime some immigrant criticises the US system they get told to stay in your own country. You lot are right fascists sometimes. What is so wrong with paying higher taxes for health care? You pay them to wage wars!!

I can always hop a plane to the UK fall out of it and get my free health care. Do it the opposite way and you're financially crippled.

Yeah, and taxpayers in the UK (like me) just LOVE it when British expatriots abuse the NHS like that. I say if you leave, you abandon your safety net.

& of course they do your bacterial infection tests in the US they are charging mega bucks for it. And making a handsome profit.... They do have private clinics in the UK too you know!! They'll snatch your £££'s big time too.

Hey, at least when they treated my bacterial infections in the US, they actually CLEARED UP! Here they just throw random antibiotics at it and I usually need 2-3 courses to clear it up, which almost always brings on a scorching yeast infection. But hey, YAY NHS! *scratch*

The NHS can suck my ###.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Comparatively speaking, when I had my surgery in California last year - the cost of that made income tax, national insurance and council tax I was paying in the UK look like peanuts.

The quality of the care was not significantly better either - the only advantage is in not being put on a outpatient waiting list.

[homesick_american 1]

Comparatively speaking, when I had my surgery in California last year - the cost of that made income tax, national insurance and council tax I was paying in the UK look like peanuts.

The quality of the care was not significantly better either - the only advantage is in not being put on a outpatient waiting list.

Hey, I didn't say it was cheap. However, in my experience it has been better. I've seen how the NHS treats my husband's uncle's diabetes, how they've ignored my mother-in-law's cancerous cough, how they botched my husband's skin grafts, how they have completely ignored my interstitial cystitis (my urologist told me to 'either learn to live with it or go back home'), and how they treated my best friend when she had a baby three years ago.

My friend's hospital room was filthy and hot, the patient in the next bed was crying in agony all night because she had had a c-section and there weren't enough nurses to care for them, there was a pool of blood on the bathroom floor that was there when I visited one day and was still there the next day, and they sent her home with what I felt was a very obviously jaundiced baby. I expressed my concern to my friend and her husband; they brought it up with the consultant pediatrician, who said it was 'normal' for Latino babies to look like that. Oh, and what happened 2 days later? After a visit from the midwife, the baby had to be RUSHED to the hospital with SEVERE jaundice and was hooked up to machines and IVs for six days. Now I'm not a doctor, but I CAN tell the difference between YELLOW and OLIVE.

My husband's uncle now has brittle diabetes because of the way the NHS bullsh!tted him around. First they didn't give him enough testing supplies. Despite being a type-2 diabetic, he was only given enough testing supplies to test his blood sugar 3-4 times a week, not before every meal. This went on for a couple of years. He was obviously worsening and the medication he was on was failing to control his blood sugar, so they referred him to the hospital for more tests. They kept cancelling and/or delaying his appointments...since he's on disability benefits obviously he's not a high priority patient. When he finally got the tests months after the doctor ordered them, they decided to put him on insulin. Not having received proper guidance about how to use the insulin and still not having enough supplies to test his blood sugar regularly, his condition could do NOTHING but get worse. Now he can't control his blood sugar even with insulin. Oh, and he's had a stroke too. We didn't even know about this until recently because he didn't want to 'be a bother.' It is DISGUSTING. He's very close to losing one or both of his feet at this point, and I blame the NHS 100%. They were supposed to take care of him and they didn't do sh!t. They cast him aside and wrecked his health. They f*cked him.

So...talk about the US healthcare system all you like, but I and members of my family have always received what we consider to be top-notch healthcare. I feel certain that if my family had been unlucky enough to live in Britain, my mother's breast cancer would have killed her, my grandfather wouldn't have survived his quintuple bypass or prostate cancer, and my grandmother SURELY would have died from her injuries when her dog knocked her over. See, her heart stopped and her doctors worked for forty minutes to bring her back. I have a friend who is a nurse at the local NHS hospital and he says there is no way in hell they'd have flogged an 82 year-old woman with pernicious anemia for forty minutes. He said, "Your gran is lucky she was in America when that happened; if she was here, they'd have let her die."

Indeed. The NHS disgusts me.