Why Baby Boomers Don't Understand Occupy Wall Street

[slim 1,533]

$2000 is better then paying $100,000...

yeah because getting a lump in your neck or a baby needing to be in the NICU is caused by stress.. ..

Babies aren't a sickness or injury. They're a choice. There's always a free (or low cost, depending on your income level) way to get rid of them.

Maybe you personally won't, but somebody like you will.

I don't want to pay for any schmuck who doesn't have health insurance and ends up getting sick.

I don't like paying insurance for all the shmucks who do get sick. Why do I have to pay more money because other people lead horrible lifestyles?

[mawilson 2,133]

I don't like paying insurance for all the shmucks who do get sick. Why do I have to pay more money because other people lead horrible lifestyles?

You can lead a healthy lifestyle and still get sick.

It may not be you, but somebody will, statistically speaking.

And when they do, the cost of their treatment will come out of my pocket.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Case in point.

If this happened now, they would've had $20,200 in medical bills. Still responsible?

Not quite. It goes something like this: Hospital bills insurance $100K. Negotiated rate for the services provided is 30K. You owe only the percentage on the negotiated rate not on the billed amount. Happened to my friend. Surgery, one day hospital = $20K bill. Insurance negotiated rate = $4.4K. $200 deductible and 80/20 after that. That comes to $1,040.00 rather than $20K. Responsible? You betcha.

Having medical insurance tied so heavily to employment has always seemed a little insane to me.

That's because it is insane.

[slim 1,533]

You can lead a healthy lifestyle and still get sick.

It may not be you, but somebody will, statistically speaking.

And when they do, the cost of their treatment will come out of my pocket.

That's the choice you make. It's not going to come out of my pocket. If I get sick, that's for me to worry about. If you get sick, it's not my concern.

My beef with insurance is you have an otherwise healthy group of people paying for a group of unhealthy people and it's a disproportionate rate. If you worked for one company for 30 years like our grandparents used to or if you paid into the union's medical fund or something like that, I'd have no problem with it. That makes sense. You're protecting your interests for later on down the road when you're more likely to get sick.

What we have nowadays is job jumpers who stay at a place for a year or two or even worse, the company switches policies every year or two and you end up with healthy young people paying $100/wk for insurance they never use.

That's #######.

The other thing that's ####### is folks live a lazy, sedintary lifestyle and smoke, drink, abuse drugs, etc., and then expect me to pay for it when they "get sick." The fact is, they didn't get sick, they simply mistreated their body. That is also not my fault.

Not quite. It goes something like this: Hospital bills insurance $100K. Negotiated rate for the services provided is 30K. You owe only the percentage on the negotiated rate not on the billed amount. Happened to my friend. Surgery, one day hospital = $20K bill. Insurance negotiated rate = $4.4K. $200 deductible and 80/20 after that. That comes to $1,040.00 rather than $20K. Responsible? You betcha.

Same situation, different take on it -

Surgery and one day in hospital $20K. You call the hospital, doctor, etc., and negotiate a cash price with each. (Or, better yet, do it up front.) Cash price, $2,000.

[mawilson 2,133]

That's because it is insane.

I don't know what's so insane about it. Health care is not free - somebody has to pay for it, be it the government, you or your employer.

If your employer didn't pay for it, you'd probably get more money in your paycheck and pay for it yourself, or pay more in taxes if the government provided it.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Same situation, different take on it -

Surgery and one day in hospital $20K. You call the hospital, doctor, etc., and negotiate a cash price with each. (Or, better yet, do it up front.) Cash price, $2,000.

That's presuming that 1) you have more negotiating power than an insurance company which I would submit you do not and 2) that you have the time and are in a condition to actually negotiate at all prior to the medical procedure taking place. Not a particularly strong case in support of your argument. Fact of the matter is that most of the invincible that end up having to undergo medical procedures stick the rest of the country with their bill. Most of the invincible are freeloaders. To the tune of tens of billions of dollars each and every year. ** that.

[slim 1,533]

I don't know what's so insane about it. Health care is not free - somebody has to pay for it, be it the government, you or your employer.

If your employer didn't pay for it, you'd probably get more money in your paycheck and pay for it yourself, or pay more in taxes if the government provided it.

The government should not pay for my healthcare. An employer should not pay for my healthcare. I should pay for my healthcare.

That's presuming that 1) you have more negotiating power than an insurance company which I would submit you do not and 2) that you have the time and are in a condition to actually negotiate at all prior to the medical procedure taking place. Not a particularly strong case in support of your argument. Fact of the matter is that most of the invincible that end up having to undergo medical procedures stick the rest of the country with their bill. Most of the invincible are freeloaders. To the tune of tens of billions of dollars each and every year. ** that.

So those who pay millions of dollars every year to a corrupt system are better off? How are you justifying that? Morally?

And you'd be surprised how much leverage you have with medical folks when you say, "I want to pay you but I can't pay that much. Let me pay you X."

[웃 910]

The government should not pay for my healthcare. An employer should not pay for my healthcare. I should pay for my healthcare.

Do you have health insurance?

Edited October 20, 2011 by Lord Infamous

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I don't know what's so insane about it. Health care is not free - somebody has to pay for it, be it the government, you or your employer.

If your employer didn't pay for it, you'd probably get more money in your paycheck and pay for it yourself, or pay more in taxes if the government provided it.

That is true. If health insurance would be mandatory then the playing field would be level and you can make an argument that private employers might be better at keeping insurance premiums low - it's in their best interest. That not being the case, we're in a rather shitty situation where people are tied to their employers for the sake of the health care insurance coverage they provide.

[^_^ 5,021]

Do you have health insurance?

We've already been over that.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

An employer should not pay for my healthcare.

An employer doesn't pay for your healthcare. You earn that healthcare coverage. It's part of your compensation.

[웃 910]

We've already been over that.

[Alex & Rachel 78]

Why do two healthy adults in their mid-twenties need coverage? You're basically paying $2,000/yr on insurance you don't need.

Well, prevention is better than cure.

Also, I'm not taking the chance of getting into a car accident, catching a virus, etc.

I know far too many healthy-eating, non-smoking people who exercise regularly be diagnosed with cancer/other life-threatening conditions these past few years.

We did live without insurance for 10 months, but it was a pretty hairy time. We were also in two car accidents during that time. Both were so minor that they resulted in zero injuries - but it did go to show you can never be too sure.

It's not. If you lose your job, you can keep your coverage for a period of time (12 months?) - you just have to pay for it yourself.

Yes - and I really could not afford to pay for it myself, especially since my income would be drastically decreased.

I buy my own for about $400 a month. Can't remember the exact figure - I'm paying for myself and three employees, and the total is about $2,400 per month - the breakdown is $1000 (family coverage) and $400 x 3 (individual).

To be fair I haven't looked into the cost of individual plans here. I know costs can vary by state and availability. I recall Kaiser as being relatively inexpensive, but our current company doesn't offer Kaiser so I'm going off old information.

[웃 910]

It'd be interesting to poll the people that had universal coverage and now live in the US....Which system works better? Which system is more affordable?

[mawilson 2,133]

That's the choice you make. It's not going to come out of my pocket. If I get sick, that's for me to worry about.

Er... no. If you get sick, you'll get a $100,000 bill. Since you can't pay it,

it gets written off as a loss by the hospital and becomes my problem.