coming soon to a cinema near you!

[Fuzzness 2]

Yeah, evangelizing is the same as torturing and killing innocent people.

no, it's not, but it is an attempt at forcing your beliefs on someone.

[incanada1234 0]

Yeah, evangelizing is the same as torturing and killing innocent people.

no, it's not, but it is an attempt at forcing your beliefs on someone.

Aaaaand....? That's as awful as simply murdering someone for not being a muslim?

[pedroh 21]

Yeah, evangelizing is the same as torturing and killing innocent people.

no, it's not, but it is an attempt at forcing your beliefs on someone.

Aaaaand....? That's as awful as simply murdering someone for not being a muslim?

not only that.. but this extremist evangelism is biasing the neutrality of the government.. like now.. this administration is not lay at all.. that goes against the basic principle of separation of church and state..

[Fuzzness 2]

Yeah, evangelizing is the same as torturing and killing innocent people.

no, it's not, but it is an attempt at forcing your beliefs on someone.

Aaaaand....? That's as awful as simply murdering someone for not being a muslim?

When did I compare it to murder? I don't recall ever saying that. As far as I know, "no, it's not" does not mean yes.

Oh I forgot I was talking to you. Let me make my point clear so there is no confusion. Forcing your beliefs on someone is WRONG.

[Alex+R 0]

Let me make my point clear so there is no confusion. Forcing your beliefs on someone is WRONG.

I believe that forcing your beliefs on non-believers is a major tenet of many types of mainstream Christianity.

[Fuzzness 2]

Let me make my point clear so there is no confusion. Forcing your beliefs on someone is WRONG.

I believe that forcing your beliefs on non-believers is a major tenet of many types of mainstream Christianity.

that may be true but it doesn't make it right does it? some people believing killing non-believers is a major tenet of their type of religion but that doesn't mean it's right.

[Alex+R 0]

Let me make my point clear so there is no confusion. Forcing your beliefs on someone is WRONG.

I believe that forcing your beliefs on non-believers is a major tenet of many types of mainstream Christianity.

that may be true but it doesn't make it right does it? some people believing killing non-believers is a major tenet of their type of religion but that doesn't mean it's right.

Of course. Just pointing out why InCanada probably has no problem with this kind of thing.

[rclouse 0]

also to refresh people's memories, see Charles's post from last month:

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...c=29577&hl=

and the first video of a small muslim girl being brainwashed into hating westerners etc..

this is just the other end of the spectrum, American kids being brainwashed into hating anyone who doesn't "love Jesus"

bunch of freaks if you ask me........

From the trailer, the scary woman says "There are two kinds of people in the world: those who love Jesus, and those who don't".

Later on they show them training with sticks in camoflage and telling them how they will be part of God's army. They ask the kids if they're willing to die for Jesus. And the kids all shout "yes!".

So, how is this different from Muslim extremists? Oh right, they're Christian, not Muslim.

[chri'stina 190]

also to refresh people's memories, see Charles's post from last month:

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...c=29577&hl=

and the first video of a small muslim girl being brainwashed into hating westerners etc..

this is just the other end of the spectrum, American kids being brainwashed into hating anyone who doesn't "love Jesus"

bunch of freaks if you ask me........

Later on they show them training with sticks in camoflage and telling them how they will be part of God's army. They ask the kids if they're willing to die for Jesus. And the kids all shout "yes!".

So, how is this different from Muslim extremists? Oh right, they're Christian, not Muslim.

I agree with what you said above, that their training to be in God's army and acting weird like that is scary/strange. Especially when the Bible says that our fight is not against the physical but is against the spiritual, which prayer is the best weapon to use. So yes I would say it's an extreme behavior to actually act like a real army under the name of Christianity.

But to think every evangelical Christian is this way, is ignorant. If someone wants to believe all "evangelical" Christians are this way, go ahead. But you don't know much about them then. I am very strong on what I believe and would not be ashamed about what I believe. But am I forcing anything on anyone? Don't think so. Even if I tell someone, this is what I believe to be true? Is that forcing anything on anyone?

To tell someone what you believe is not FORCING anything upon that person. Just say "I don't want to hear it", if you don't want to hear it. How can they really force you to do anything? People just don't like hearing things that are different than what they already believe/dont believe. Could we say the same about politics? And how passionate people get about politics? Sometimes it feels like things are getting forced down your throat by people who will rant and rave about politics, but don't want you to talk about your spiritual beliefs ever.

[Alex+R 0]

So, how is this different from Muslim extremists? Oh right, they're Christian, not Muslim.

Exactly. Christians need to admit that their religion has been manipulated to be just as warlike and violent as any other.

Interestingly, an actual majority of historic Muslim conversions were not performed "by the sword," and in South Asia, the process was almost entirely free of violence. Consider how many Muslims there are there now.

I don't think the same can be said of Christianity.

Of course, I think all religions are a crock.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

.. in South Asia, the process was almost entirely free of violence.

That is hilarious and false.

In South Asia (the Indian subcontinent), violence was used. Check out the Babar Nama at your local university library.

However, a majority of the conversions were due to economic coercion. Non-Muslims were levied a tax called jaziya by the Muslim rulers. Convert or starve to death.

[Alex+R 0]

.. in South Asia, the process was almost entirely free of violence.

That is hilarious and false.

In South Asia (the Indian subcontinent), violence was used. Check out the Babar Nama at your local university library.

However, a majority of the conversions were due to economic coercion. Non-Muslims were levied a tax called jaziya by the Muslim rulers. Convert or starve to death.

I don't know, I'm pretty sure most of the research has changed in the past few years. I have to go to work now, but I can fill in the blanks later.

It was definitely twisted coercion, no argument there, but it wasn't as physically violent as many Christian conversion periods. Yeah, let me note that I am not saying they didn't force their religion on the population. It was mostly spread in the beginning from the fringe areas that were occupied with tribal religion followers.

Sorry, I should have used the words "physical violence" and I meant to contrast it with the usual image of Islamic conversions.

[chri'stina 190]

So, how is this different from Muslim extremists? Oh right, they're Christian, not Muslim.

Exactly. Christians need to admit that their religion has been manipulated to be just as warlike and violent as any other.

Interestingly, an actual majority of historic Muslim conversions were not performed "by the sword," and in South Asia, the process was almost entirely free of violence. Consider how many Muslims there are there now.

I don't think the same can be said of Christianity.

Of course, I think all religions are a crock.

Most Christians I know do admit there are many crazies who say they are Christians and aren't afraid to speak out against the crazy people. And I would not associate with those kind of people who are manipulating it to be warlike. The bible tells us that we do need to always keep a watchful eye for people who manipulate biblical doctrines. So the bible even says there will be people who come in the name of God or Jesus, who will do things that are not at all biblical. So as Christians it is a biblical responsibility of ours to address such issues. And I am sure there will be discussion in Christian churches about such a film, and strong rebukes sent to the people who are doing this (the parts like forming a literal army for God).

Edited September 20, 2006 by stina&suj

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I don't know, I'm pretty sure most of the research has changed in the past few years. I have to go to work now, but I can fill in the blanks later.

I guess all those mosques built on top of Hindu temples are just imaginary. Recent research has been actively trying to whitewash the truth of what happened in India back in the Mughal era. I'll go by the collective memories of my people, by the writings of people like Shivaji and his peers, the writers of the courts of Babar and Akbar, who were actually around at the time. To hell with the researchers and their kumbaya the mughals were peaceful bias. The brutal assassination of the earlier Sikh gurus by the Mughals, is that imagined too? Give me a break.

Edited September 20, 2006 by Gupt

[Not Available 0]

I agree with what you said above, that their training to be in God's army and acting weird like that is scary/strange. Especially when the Bible says that our fight is not against the physical but is against the spiritual, which prayer is the best weapon to use. So yes I would say it's an extreme behavior to actually act like a real army under the name of Christianity.

But to think every evangelical Christian is this way, is ignorant. If someone wants to believe all "evangelical" Christians are this way, go ahead. But you don't know much about them then. I am very strong on what I believe and would not be ashamed about what I believe. But am I forcing anything on anyone? Don't think so. Even if I tell someone, this is what I believe to be true? Is that forcing anything on anyone?

To tell someone what you believe is not FORCING anything upon that person. Just say "I don't want to hear it", if you don't want to hear it. How can they really force you to do anything? People just don't like hearing things that are different than what they already believe/dont believe. Could we say the same about politics? And how passionate people get about politics? Sometimes it feels like things are getting forced down your throat by people who will rant and rave about politics, but don't want you to talk about your spiritual beliefs ever.

Fully agree

I dont get why people think we (I say we only because I am a kids pastor) are teaching children to hate people that dont believe in Jesus. I teach them to show others the love of Jesus and to accept them no matter who they are. I also dont teach them to force it down others throats, I teach them to stand for what they believe in. If someone doesnt want to hear it, fine. We told them what we believe and we leave it at that. I personally thought it was cool to see a bunch of kids standing up for what they believe in and expressing their passion and love towards God. Though some of the things the people said and did were a bit extreme, it's pretty much what I do with my kids.