Careful What Country You're Born In

[one...two...tree 2,762]

OTTAWA, Sept. 18 — A government commission on Monday exonerated a Canadian computer engineer of any ties to terrorism and issued a scathing report that faulted Canada and the United States for his deportation four years ago to Syria, where he was imprisoned and tortured.

The report on the engineer, Maher Arar, said American officials had apparently acted on inaccurate information from Canadian investigators and then misled Canadian authorities about their plans for Mr. Arar before transporting him to Syria.

“I am able to say categorically that there is no evidence to indicate that Mr. Arar has committed any offense or that his activities constituted a threat to the security of Canada,” Justice Dennis R. O’Connor, head of the commission, said

The report’s findings could reverberate heavily through the leadership of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, which handled the initial intelligence on Mr. Arar that led security officials in both Canada and the United States to assume he was a suspected Al Qaeda terrorist.

The report’s criticisms and recommendations are aimed primarily at Canada’s own government and activities, rather than the United States government, which refused to cooperate in the inquiry.

But its conclusions about a case that had emerged as one of the most infamous examples of rendition — the transfer of terrorism suspects to other nations for interrogation — draw new attention to the Bush administration’s handling of detainees. And it comes as the White House and Congress are contesting legislation that would set standards for the treatment and interrogation of prisoners.

“The American authorities who handled Mr. Arar’s case treated Mr. Arar in a most regrettable fashion,” Justice O’Connor wrote in a three-volume report, not all of which was made public. “They removed him to Syria against his wishes and in the face of his statements that he would be tortured if sent there. Moreover, they dealt with Canadian officials involved with Mr. Arar’s case in a less than forthcoming manner.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/19/world/am...;pagewanted=all

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

With enough torture (mental or physical) people will confess to anything. This is a terrible story. Why did they send him to Syria for torture?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

With enough torture (mental or physical) people will confess to anything. This is a terrible story. Why did they send him to Syria for torture?

I'm trying to find out what the U.S. official story for removing him from Canada and sending him to Syria, but here's more...

On Oct. 8, he was flown to Jordan in an American government plane and taken overland to Syria, where he says he was held for 10 months in a tiny cell and beaten repeatedly with a metal cable. He was freed in October 2003, after Syrian officials concluded that he had no connection to terrorism and returned him to Canada. . . .

Evidence presented to the commission, said Paul J. J. Cavalluzzo, its lead counsel, showed that the F.B.I. continued to keep its Canadian counterparts in the dark even while an American jet was carrying Mr. Arar to Jordan. The panel found that American officials “believed — quite correctly — that, if informed, the Canadians would have serious concerns about the plan to remove Mr. Arar to Syria.”

Mr. Arar arrived in Syria on Oct. 9, 2002, and was imprisoned there until Oct. 5, 2003. It took Canadian officials, however, until Oct. 21 to locate him in Syria. The commission concludes that Syrian officials at first denied knowing Mr. Arar’s whereabouts to hide the fact that he was being tortured. It says that, among other things, he was beaten with a shredded electrical cable until he was disoriented.

Do any other counties in the world kidnap civilians who are citizens of other countries and torture them?

http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.com/2006/09...f-us-under.html

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Do any other counties in the world kidnap civilians who are citizens of other countries and torture them?

More common than we think. I bet.

[Kathryn41 3,205]

I am very glad Mr. Arar has been vindicated. His case has been a miscarriage of justice from beginning to end. I remember very well when this story broke and the consternation surrounding the events. Basically, Mr. Arar was a Canadian citizen who had immigrated to Canada from Syria as a child with his family. He and his family were returning from a vacation in Tunisia and the plane landed first in the US before its final stop in Canada. When it touched down in the States, US security forces boarded the plane, hauled him off and he disappeared into some sort of security void. US authorities refused to deal with Canadian authorties in their investigation, refused to let Mr. Arar contact Canadian authorities, refused to deport him to Canada, and refused to acknowledge his whereabouts or his supposed crime until faced with evidence of their actions when they then took an attitude of high arrogance stating it was their right to detain him and deport him to Syria even though he was a Canadian in the name of national security. He was kept imprisoned in Syria , if I remember, for about a year and repeatedly tortured before the Syrian officials released him saying they were satisfied he had no terrorist connections or inclilnations. Upon his return to Canada he told his story and the Canadian people were outraged which led to the establishment of the commission and its investigation. His crime? Talking in a public place to a man of middle eastern heritage who was on a list of potential terrorist suspects. What were they talking about? a source for cheap inkjet printer refill cartridges! Mr. Arar has sued the Canadian government and is trying to sue the US government for their actions. I sure hope he wins.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I am very glad Mr. Arar has been vindicated. His case has been a miscarriage of justice from beginning to end. I remember very well when this story broke and the consternation surrounding the events. Basically, Mr. Arar was a Canadian citizen who had immigrated to Canada from Syria as a child with his family. He and his family were returning from a vacation in Tunisia and the plane landed first in the US before its final stop in Canada. When it touched down in the States, US security forces boarded the plane, hauled him off and he disappeared into some sort of security void. US authorities refused to deal with Canadian authorties in their investigation, refused to let Mr. Arar contact Canadian authorities, refused to deport him to Canada, and refused to acknowledge his whereabouts or his supposed crime until faced with evidence of their actions when they then took an attitude of high arrogance stating it was their right to detain him and deport him to Syria even though he was a Canadian in the name of national security. He was kept imprisoned in Syria , if I remember, for about a year and repeatedly tortured before the Syrian officials released him saying they were satisfied he had no terrorist connections or inclilnations. Upon his return to Canada he told his story and the Canadian people were outraged which led to the establishment of the commission and its investigation. His crime? Talking in a public place to a man of middle eastern heritage who was on a list of potential terrorist suspects. What were they talking about? a source for cheap inkjet printer refill cartridges! Mr. Arar has sued the Canadian government and is trying to sue the US government for their actions. I sure hope he wins.

I hope those here in OT who keep ranting that we need to be tough with these detainees are reading this. Without due process travesties like this will continue - be thankful it doesn't happen to you or your loved one.

Since when did the U.S. start working with the Syrian's on combating terrorism? Doesn't that kind of throw out Rumsfeld's theory that Saddam transported his WMD's into Syria? Are they our allies or foes?

Edited September 20, 2006 by Steven_and_Jinky

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

It's called "torture by proxy". You want to get around laws in your own country that prohibit such behaviour - so you send them to other countries where they have fewer legal protections and even fewer scruples. There they are tortured while you have deniability. This is also the murky arena of CIA affiliated "private contractors".

[one...two...tree 2,762]

It's called "torture by proxy". You want to get around laws in your own country that prohibit such behaviour - so you send them to other countries where they have fewer legal protections and even fewer scruples. There they are tortured while you have deniability. This is also the murky arena of CIA affiliated "private contractors".

Where's the 'We Don't Torture' brigade?' ...chirp, chirp.

[Marc and Olga 0]

It's called "torture by proxy". You want to get around laws in your own country that prohibit such behaviour - so you send them to other countries where they have fewer legal protections and even fewer scruples. There they are tortured while you have deniability. This is also the murky arena of CIA affiliated "private contractors".

Where's the 'We Don't Torture' brigade?' ...chirp, chirp.

I honestly thought it was the "torture the 'suspected' terrorist" brigade!

note: I added the suspected part since there is no "judicial process" allowed on these guys!

[Fuzzness 2]

He had a canadian f'ing passport and no longer had any ties to Syria. This was a major f-up.

[Reba 2]

and sadly, he's not the only one. There have been other Canadian citizens deported to their birth country in the past 5 years. And like Mr. Arar, they've not even been to their birth country since they were children, and have no ties. AFAIK however, Mr. Arar was the only one tortured, tho others have been horrified by their experiences.

All of this happens usually without Canadian knowledge until much later. The US is supposed to first notify Canada of anything regarding their own citizens, as would Canada in a similar situation. But they don't, they just ship them off to whereever and then later say "oops, not a terrorist? My bad"

[Saddle Bronc 124]

Do any other counties in the world kidnap civilians who are citizens of other countries and torture them?

More common than we think. I bet.

You've heard of the Sidney Jaffe case about 25 years ago?

Jaffe, wanted for "questionable real-estate deals" in Florida, was arrested by US bounty-hunters while he was jogging in Toronto. Bundled onto a flight to a Miami jail, not even taken home to get a change of clothes.

All because FL was too-much-in-a-hurry to file formal extradition request with ON.

[Saddle Bronc 124]

and sadly, he's not the only one. There have been other Canadian citizens deported to their birth country in the past 5 years. And like Mr. Arar, they've not even been to their birth country since they were children, and have no ties. AFAIK however, Mr. Arar was the only one tortured, tho others have been horrified by their experiences.

(bolded part should probably read "and some of them have not been")

(italics -- if the person is a dual-national, birth country plus Canada, then the passport of the birth country can be considered by US as a "tie")

All of this happens usually without Canadian knowledge until much later. The US is supposed to first notify Canada of anything regarding their own citizens, as would Canada in a similar situation. But they don't, they just ship them off to whereever and then later say "oops, not a terrorist? My bad"

Also, is it not up to the individual to inform the US DHS of being a Canadian? If DHS sees the other passport and decides to give consular access on that basis, unfortunately Canada doesn't have a leg to stand on when it comes to protesting it.

On one of the cases you mentioned, that of Shakir Baloch (entered as "Canadian visitor" and then worked without permit as taxi driver) fitted exactly such scenario (DHS saw his Pak passport, not the Canuck--and gave access to Pak Embassy/Consulate).

[mmmbop1976 1]

Jaffe, wanted for "questionable real-estate deals" in Florida, was arrested by US bounty-hunters while he was jogging in Toronto. Bundled onto a flight to a Miami jail, not even taken home to get a change of clothes.

All because FL was too-much-in-a-hurry to file formal extradition request with ON.

bounty hunters have no affiliation to the US Govt, they are private citizens looking to make a living by collecting bounties on bail jumpers. So obviously Mr Jaffe must have jumped bail for their to be a bounty on him.

as for the original topic, yeah, kind of funny that Syria would help us in this regard. do you really think they would keep something like this a secret from the muslim world as they try to defeat us? i think this casts doubt on the whole story. and it does state that he had his case against the US Govt dismissed by a federal judge in new york. i know i know, that federal judge is on the bush payroll, right? there are 2 sides to every story. sounds like mr arar had his due process.

[Marc and Olga 0]

Jaffe, wanted for "questionable real-estate deals" in Florida, was arrested by US bounty-hunters while he was jogging in Toronto. Bundled onto a flight to a Miami jail, not even taken home to get a change of clothes.

All because FL was too-much-in-a-hurry to file formal extradition request with ON.

bounty hunters have no affiliation to the US Govt, they are private citizens looking to make a living by collecting bounties on bail jumpers. So obviously Mr Jaffe must have jumped bail for their to be a bounty on him.

as for the original topic, yeah, kind of funny that Syria would help us in this regard. do you really think they would keep something like this a secret from the muslim world as they try to defeat us? i think this casts doubt on the whole story. and it does state that he had his case against the US Govt dismissed by a federal judge in new york. i know i know, that federal judge is on the bush payroll, right? there are 2 sides to every story. sounds like mr arar had his due process.

It was dismissed because the "evidence" would breach "National Security" not because it was unfounded.

From this article:

Arar filed a lawsuit in U.S. federal court, but the case was dismissed by a judge citing "national security" issues.