Saudis sound warning on blocking Palestinian statehood

[slim 1,525]

Are you trying to be funny, or just lying?

The Saudis have long poked a stick in our eye and will continue to do so because it helps THEM. Not us. Them. They're the ones making the point.

[Pooky 3,786]

Looks like there's more than just the USA looking to vote against ...

14 September 2011 Last updated at 19:25 ET

Mid-East shuttle dipomacy ahead of Palestinian UN bid

Senior US and international envoys have begun a fresh round of shuttle diplomacy to try to head off a Palestinian bid for UN membership.

US diplomats Dennis Ross and David Hale, as well as EU foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton and Middle-East envoy Tony Blair are in the region to try to revive stalled peace talks.

Palestinians are preparing a bid for UN membership later this month.

Israel has warned of "harsh and grave consequences" if the move goes ahead.

Mr Ross and Mr Hale arrived in Israel on Wednesday and held talks with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Defence Minister Ehud Barak, the US State Department said.

They were due to travel to the West Bank on Thursday for talks with Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas.

Baroness Ashton also held talks with Mr Netanyahu on Wednesday morning, and announced she was extending her visit for further talks in the evening.

"I hope that in the coming days what we will be able to achieve together will be something that enables the negotiations to start," she said.

Analysts say the 27-member EU could split over the issue of Palestinian statehood if it comes to a vote at the UN, with some states backing the effort and others likely to oppose it.

US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on Wednesday spoke to Mr Blair - who represents the Quartet of international Middle East negotiators - and to Baroness Ashton, state department spokesman Mark Toner said.

"This is part of our intensive effort here to find a way forward," he added.

The last round of peace talks between Israel and the Palestinians broke down a year ago.

Since then, the Palestinians have launched a campaign to join the UN as a full member state with international recognition based on their 1967 borders with East Jerusalem as a capital.

The UN begins its annual General Assembly general debate in New York on 21 September.

Israeli Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman, speaking on Wednesday, warned of dire consequences if the Palestinians went ahead.

"From the moment they pass a unilateral decision there will be harsh and grave consequences," he said.

"I hope that we shall not come to those harsh and grave consequences, and that common sense will prevail in all decisions taken," he added.

Some hardline Israeli politicians have called for Israel to annex sections of the West Bank if the Palestinians go ahead.

BBC link

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Tony Blair's in on it, like the Brits didn't f*** up the region enough with their BS.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Neither have.

Calling upon both parties to fulfil their obligations under relevant provisions of the road map, the Palestinian Authority to undertake visible efforts on the ground to arrest, disrupt and restrain individuals and groups conducting and planning violent attacks,

Done.

and the Government of Israel to take no actions undermining trust, including deportations and attacks on civilians and extrajudicial killings

Not done.

[The_Dude 1,142]

Done.

Not done.

So are you being disingenuous, or just lying? If that is what passes for fulfilling an obligation, I think you might be delusional. They have made meaningless arrests and symbolic detentions, but nothing substantive. If they wanted to decrease the terrorism in the region, I think Hamas could actually pull that off, you know, them being terrorists and all.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

So are you being disingenuous, or just lying? If that is what passes for fulfilling an obligation, I think you might be delusional. They have made meaningless arrests and symbolic detentions, but nothing substantive. If they wanted to decrease the terrorism in the region, I think Hamas could actually pull that off, you know, them being terrorists and all.

Your uninformed opinion is rather at odds with the IDF's official assessment:

Terrorist activity in the West Bank (Central Command) decreased by 97% in 2009 compared to the recent peak year in 2002. These numbers have decreased every year since 2002, with the exception of 2006, the year of the Second Lebanon War.

Significant reduction in terror activity occurred in the West Bank between the years 2002-2003, after Operation Defensive Shield, and again in 2007. When Hamas violently seized power in the Gaza Strip in the summer of 2007, the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank took measures to prevent a similar situation in the West Bank. The PA began to coordinate more closely with the IDF than before, and the number of terror attacks has decreased ever since.

2010 has been a relatively quiet year with the exception of the past few weeks when violence has flared up again, due to recent developments in the political realm. For the past several years, most terror attacks in the West Bank have been carried out by an isolated individual or individuals. In general these attacks have been characterized by ‘cold weapons’ (i.e. knives), light weapons fire, and/or vehicular assaults.

http://idfspokesperson.com/2010/10/07/statistics-number-and-type-of-terror-attacks-in-the-west-bank-12-sept-2010/

[The_Dude 1,142]

Your uninformed opinion is rather at odds with the IDF's official assessment:

Maybe it's because I have lived most of my life in the U.S., but 64 terrorist attacks is still not a good thing, especially when the elected government of Palestine are terrorists.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Maybe it's because I have lived most of my life in the U.S., but 64 terrorist attacks is still not a good thing, especially when the elected government of Palestine are terrorists.

Israel has the same history. Its founders and early government leaders were terrorist murderers. Apparently, that doesn't take long for that to become a non-issue.

Edited September 16, 2011 by Sofiyya

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Maybe it's because I have lived most of my life in the U.S., but 64 terrorist attacks is still not a good thing, especially when the elected government of Palestine are terrorists.

I think there are some points that need to be clarified which may not be readily apparent to casual observers:

#1. Hamas was publicly encouraged by then-President George W. Bush to participate in the Palestinian elections of January 2006, and (as all knowledgeable observers had predicted on all sides) swept to power into the government.

#2. After a perplexed pause from W. and then a vague but rather positive statement about the great achievement of democracy in action, the U.S. and Israel agreed that they would not accept the results of this election. First, Israel launched a number of operations to kidnap and imprison dozens of Hamas legislators in the West Bank. Then the U.S. and Israel funded and supported the losers of the election (Fatah) to arm a Fatah warlord in Gaza to try to stage a coup against the elected government (Hamas.) This failed miserably, and separated the West Bank and Gaza into two political camps.

#3. The U.S. and Israel announced they would recognize the losers of the elections (Fatah under Abbas) as the new legitimate government of the Palestinian Authority.

#4. Under Abbas, the Fatah-controlled PA continued with various agreements under the Road Map.

#5. However, since Israel had always insisted that Hamas be excluded from the government and excluded from any negotiations, Hamas is not a part of those agreements.

So, as the IDF assessment shows, the Palestinian government that Israel recognizes and has an agreement with - the PA - is complying and continues to comply with its obligations under the road map.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

So are you being disingenuous, or just lying?

Is this your generic response now to every post you disagree with? I guess you failed Argumentation and Debate.

Are you trying to be funny, or just lying?

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Is the assembly vote going to be a majority vote or 2/3?

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Is the assembly vote going to be a majority vote or 2/3?

Voting in the General Assembly on important questions – recommendations on peace and security; election of members to organs; admission, suspension, and expulsion of members; budgetary matters – is by a two-thirds majority of those present and voting.

Wikipedia, so it's unverified.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

So its a tight vote, given almost exactly 2/3 of members support a new state.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

So its a tight vote, given almost exactly 2/3 of members support a new state.

Not that close. The Palestinians expect to get 140 of the 192 nations. That is about a 12 vote cushion.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Not that close. The Palestinians expect to get 140 of the 192 nations. That is about a 12 vote cushion.

I only see 120...but that is a number from this spring.