Anyone wish they were back in the UK

[^_^ 5,021]

I have switched to a high-ded plan for 2012. I am paying a fuckton right now for everything But my premiums are low so it's ok.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

I'm not enjoying paying for all 3 of us. But I am doing it because i'm doing what's best for my family in 2012 living in America.

Kudos to being alive and making babies 20+ years ago. I'm making babies in 2012, tho.

I understand your passion and I don't think it's a bad thing. I pray it does get more affordable for all of us. But arguing with me about what i'm doing now so that I can afford to care for my family, calling it lacking in empathy, hating on the fact that I have a job that gives me good benefits, and assuming I think life is dandy in America today is uncalled for.

If i'm not getting my topics mixed up the whole reason I joined this convo was because I was surprised at what you all WEREN'T being offered at your jobs. Not because I don't care, rather because I do.

I'm not arguing with you or hating on you. If I earlier misunderstood some of your comments, I apologize.

[DiZZyLoX 114]

I have switched to a high-ded plan for 2012. I am paying a fuckton right now for everything But my premiums are low so it's ok.

Hey! It's totally worth it sometimes! We get choices of 3 different carriers. They were all $$$ the diff was out of pocket at point of care. Guess which one I picked!!! Lol!!!

[TracyTN 237]

Neither did I state the NHS was perfect - my posts states that there are faults in each, so your comment about fans of the NHS 'hardly ever' noticing faults with it does not appear reflective of this thread upto this post (as I have not read the rest as yet). I would still defend it, as I think the ideology of it is worth upholding.

I should have been more clear. I meant this in general where I've had this 'argument' in the past - not just in this thread, and not only on the interwebs ( ). For the most part, NHS foibles are rarely brought up. The conversation is usually dominated by how the US system sucks.

I actually think the ideology of it is great, too. I maintain that if we could find a halfway house between the US and UK systems, we'd be golden.

What scares me about the NHS in particular is the inequities in the standards of care from trust to trust. In my experience (sitting for 4 days in an NHS hospital trying to get my husband treatment - god help us) and my husband's over his lifetime in the UK, you're treated like an interruption of someone's day as opposed to someone who needs care - IF you can actually get someone to pay attention to you, that is.

I actually lost it on the ward one day - the third day of us sitting in an NHS hospital with no AC (during an unusually hot July in England), and my husband couldn't eat or drink as he MIGHT have surgery - and I screamed 'Even prisoners of war under the Geneva Convention get food and water once a day!!!' After this, we were offered our first cup of tea in three days (gee thanks). I mean it was abysmal. And a joke. There were 3 people in line after us and one of them finally broke down in tears at the frustration of not being seen after 3 days. We went home that third day having been seen - she was told to go home and wait again. An hour journey on the train each way, no food and water for her either. And that's the tip of the iceberg of what we experienced. The thought of that even possibly happening here makes my blood run cold.

[DiZZyLoX 114]

I 2nd the halfway house

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

My daughter was born last summer. My wife and I were in the hospital 3 or 4 days. Our daughter was in the NICU for 10 additional days.

My out of pocket was around $300.

The most interesting part of it all was that Blue Cross didn't consider the last 2 days of NICU stay "medically necessary" and refused to pay for it... but also said I am not liable for it. The hospital had to eat the cost.

One of the arguments against single payer is the method in which Medicare negotiates rates. Which is essentially what your insurance carrier did with your hospital. In other words, I the funding source, am only gonna pay you (the provider) so much for what you do. I don't think most people realize their insurance companies do this kind of thing.

Do you have any idea what you paid in premiums during the course of the pregnancy?

[Ellesse 11]

I should have been more clear. I meant this in general where I've had this 'argument' in the past - not just in this thread, and not only on the interwebs ( ). For the most part, NHS foibles are rarely brought up. The conversation is usually dominated by how the US system sucks.

Ah, ok. Gotcha! I think it's a shame that people don't admit the faults because, yeah, it does have them..not least of all the experiences you mention (which sound horrendous). I think that if people don't have a basic level of empathy for the patient then they shouldn't be IN the NHS in the first place, but I've seen some shocking behaviour from both nurses and doctors towards patients they're meant to be caring for. No way should patients be treated like they're an inconvenience. On the other hand, I've also met some fantastic nurses and doctors who I'd want to be treating my family if they were ever ill (so, yes, I get the concern re: postcode lottery, etc). With the cost cutting measures now in place for the NHS, (with the resultant increased pressure on staff and the possible impact on patient care), goodness knows what the future NHS will look like! Similar to the US, what some of the staff at executive level in the NHS earn is a crime, considering how many nurses they could employ for the same cost!

I actually think the ideology of it is great, too. I maintain that if we could find a halfway house between the US and UK systems, we'd be golden.

Your mouth to Obama's ear? Not quite sure how that would happen, but that would be great!

L

Edited January 9, 2012 by Ellesse

[ScottnIzabela 25]

not one mention of the "benefit" of the tax deduction of all medical expenses. that comes right off the top of your taxable income and also makes your taxes less.or mention of mortgage interest deduction.

this is a family friendly country. even if you are working poor ....

and for those of you in your 20's.... stop worrying about getting sick. if you are in good health for sure. i gave up on insurance after my first wife died. me and my 3 kids made it thru. 1000 a month or the odd trip to the dr for 60 to 100 a month. i cant afford insurance but as needed for the usual minor ####### at the dr...well i can afford this and i get tax deductions on it all.

i think this country can afford to do better on covering the poor and the sick. but commie obammie and his way is not the solution.

[Robert&Karen 264]

not one mention of the "benefit" of the tax deduction of all medical expenses. that comes right off the top of your taxable income and also makes your taxes less.or mention of mortgage interest deduction.

this is a family friendly country. even if you are working poor ....

Who does your taxes??? You may deduct only the amount by which your total medical care expenses for the year exceed 7.5% of your adjusted gross income. If you make $50,000 a year you can deduct anything over $3,750. So if you have medical bills totaling $4,000 then you can deduct $250 and probably save $50 on what you owe for taxes.

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc502.html

[TracyTN 237]

Ah, ok. Gotcha! I think it's a shame that people don't admit the faults because, yeah, it does have them..not least of all the experiences you mention (which sound horrendous). I think that if people don't have a basic level of empathy for the patient then they shouldn't be IN the NHS in the first place, but I've seen some shocking behaviour from both nurses and doctors towards patients they're meant to be caring for. No way should patients be treated like they're an inconvenience. On the other hand, I've also met some fantastic nurses and doctors who I'd want to be treating my family if they were ever ill (so, yes, I get the concern re: postcode lottery, etc). With the cost cutting measures now in place for the NHS, (with the resultant increased pressure on staff and the possible impact on patient care), goodness knows what the future NHS will look like! Similar to the US, what some of the staff at executive level in the NHS earn is a crime, considering how many nurses they could employ for the same cost!

Your mouth to Obama's ear? Not quite sure how that would happen, but that would be great!

L

I am SO envious of those who had good experiences with their NHS trusts - yet glad to hear the stories. My husband and his family certainly did not have a decent trust, and it sucks. Not to mention that more and more dentists aren't taking NHS - or so I was told. Maybe that's changed since hubby moved here, dunno. It will be interesting to see where the NHS ends up. It didn't seem to be moving in a good direction when he left, but that was going on 5 years ago now. A lot can change in that time.

HA! I'm not sure that's what Obama has in mind, but I wish it were. I think some of the ideas behind what he wanted to do are good - I'm just skeptical about how they're going to be implemented. As is the case with anything our govt is involved in.

[Susita 175]

Says who? Have you been to Africa lately? Are the dying people suing doctors for infringing on their right to healthcare?

Health Care as a Human Right

I'm merely using this link for the quotes included, not arguing for or against universal health care. The U.N. considers it a human right, and so does common international human rights law. The fact that African nations are not taking care of their citizens is in violation of the U.N. Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Is it due to lack of resources? Most likely. Does the U.S. lack resources to provide their citizens with adequate health care? No. Priorities, priorities.

Article 25 of the U.N. Universal Declaration of Human Rights (1948) reads (emphasis mine):

Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.

Likewise, Article 12 of the U.N. International Covenant on Economic, Social, and Cultural Rights (1966) reads:

1. The States Parties to the present Covenant recognize the right of everyone to the enjoyment of the highest attainable standard of physical and mental health.

2. The steps to be taken by the States Parties to the present Covenant to achieve the full realization of this right shall include those necessary for:

(a) The provision for the reduction of the stillbirth-rate and of infant mortality and for the healthy development of the child;

(b) The improvement of all aspects of environmental and industrial hygiene;

© The prevention, treatment and control of epidemic, endemic, occupational and other diseases;

(d) The creation of conditions which would assure to all medical service and medical attention in the event of sickness.

But international human rights law is unambiguous on the matter: Universal health care is a right, and the government must step in and provide it if the private sector fails to do so. If there are such things as human rights, under the international framework, then health care is definitely among them.

[jingo 38]

4 months since moving to the states with my k1.

Yep, I wish I was back in the UK.

[Robert&Karen 264]

Health Care as a Human Right

I'm merely using this link for the quotes included, not arguing for or against universal health care. The U.N. considers it a human right, and so does common international human rights law. The fact that African nations are not taking care of their citizens is in violation of the U.N. Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Is it due to lack of resources? Most likely. Does the U.S. lack resources to provide their citizens with adequate health care? No. Priorities, priorities.

Who cares about what the UN thinks? Not America that's for sure, see link:

http://mainfo.blogspot.com/2010/02/face-it-un-hates-us.html

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Who cares about what the UN thinks? Not America that's for sure, see link:

http://mainfo.blogsp...n-hates-us.html

Yeah! Let's be proud of living in an economic powerhouse that shafts its vulnerable citizens!

Woooooohoooooooo! I got mine so suck it, losers!

Oh, was I reading that wrong?

[Susita 175]

Yeah! Let's be proud of living in an economic powerhouse that shafts its vulnerable citizens!

Woooooohoooooooo! I got mine so suck it, losers!

Oh, was I reading that wrong?