Got RFE for "divorce decree" but I already included it

[Hiker 9]

The documents I have:

- Original stuff brought to the hearing... these are just things entered into a computer by my lawyer and signed by myself and ex-wife. They don't really prove anything.

- One page letter created after the hearing saying what the "Findings" are, that there has been a total breakdown in the marriage, etc.

- A month later, a Divorce Nisi letter entered into the records.

- 4 months later, the Divorce Decree that I originally included, saying it is absolute.

[Tim/Mav 305]

That is exactly the document that I got. It costs $20. My lawyer told me this is the one to get, and there is no other I can get.

I can include the original documents that we created for the hearing, but they don't really prove anything other than what it is we were agreeing to WRT property.

If you had a good immigration Attorney, this would not even be needed. If you have other documents about property, etc. Send those with the RFE and have a talk with your Attorney

[Hiker 9]

If you had a good immigration Attorney, this would not even be needed. If you have other documents about property, etc. Send those with the RFE and have a talk with your Attorney

Everyone always says there's no need for a lawyer for the K1 visa. Besides, what would a lawyer do in my case? They still want the divorce decree. My lawyer doesn't do immigration, so having a talk with him about this won't do much good. He's great at divorces and criminal stuff though.

What would documents about property show? They asked for a divorce decree, not details on property. I have a quitclaim deed that shows she gave her ownership in the house over to me, that's about it. I could include it, but it is not the divorce decree they asked for.

Am I correct that I only have one shot at sending in the correct info, and if it is still deemed incomplete, that I'm screwed?

Was the copy issued within 90 days of the divorce? maybe getting a new copy won't have the 90 day divorce nisi written at the bottom.

No, and that doesn't matter. The divorce only has to be absolute... I could have filed I-129F one day after (but I didn't). And the "divorce nisi" in the document isn't saying it is the divorce nisi... it is referencing it from 3 months earlier.

It should have been her Maiden Name but I don't have ther form in front of me. Date of birth, where born.

Also, I seen the ABSOLUTE . That is a questional document and though I'm not familiar with your State, that is not a Divorce Decree in Oregon.

It is the only document they issue... really nice seal embedded on it, from the court, that I paid a whole $20 for. I'm aware other states are different, but I am in MA and cannot retroactively change my state to one that issues a better divorce decree.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

That is exactly the document that I got. It costs $20. My lawyer told me this is the one to get, and there is no other I can get.

I can include the original documents that we created for the hearing, but they don't really prove anything other than what it is we were agreeing to WRT property.

No, what you got was an affirmation from the county registrar that a divorce was granted. (Sorry, I said court clerk in my previous post.) The county registrar doesn't grant divorces. The certificate from the county registrar just confirms that a divorce decree exists. They want a copy of the document signed by the judge that declares your divorce final, and spells out the terms of the divorce.

Edited September 1, 2011 by JimVaPhuong

[Hiker 9]

I also sent in the 23 page Divorce Settlement Agreement that details the actual terms of the divorce. I think its what they are looking for. If you have it I would send it in.

We have no such document here. We write what we agreed upon ourselves (well, lawyer did that), and brought that to court. The court issues a ruling that they agree to it. The court doesn't write any more papers on the details of the agreement... it just takes a copy of those papers I submitted, and they testify that they agree all is well with it. If the divorce had been complicated, maybe such documents exist, but we just had the documents all signed, walked in, said here they are, and answered a few questions. 5 minutes later, done.

No, what you got was an affirmation from the county registrar that a divorce was granted. (Sorry, I said court clerk in my previous post.) The county registrar doesn't grant divorces. The certificate from the county registrar just confirms that a divorce decree exists. They want a copy of the document signed by the judge that declares your divorce final, and spells out the terms of the divorce.

But there is no such document. If there is, how do I get it? Surely someone in MA who has been divorced has applied for a K1 before... what did they do?

[Tim/Mav 305]

Everyone always says there's no need for a lawyer for the K1 visa. Besides, what would a lawyer do in my case? They still want the divorce decree. My lawyer doesn't do immigration, so having a talk with him about this won't do much good. He's great at divorces and criminal stuff though.

What would documents about property show? They asked for a divorce decree, not details on property. I have a quitclaim deed that shows she gave her ownership in the house over to me, that's about it. I could include it, but it is not the divorce decree they asked for.

Am I correct that I only have one shot at sending in the correct info, and if it is still deemed incomplete, that I'm screwed?

No, and that doesn't matter. The divorce only has to be absolute... I could have filed I-129F one day after (but I didn't). And the "divorce nisi" in the document isn't saying it is the divorce nisi... it is referencing it from 3 months earlier.

It is the only document they issue... really nice seal embedded on it, from the court, that I paid a whole $20 for. I'm aware other states are different, but I am in MA and cannot retroactively change my state to one that issues a better divorce decree.

Hiker, read Jim's reply You are not dealing with a divorce Attorney anymore, you are dealing with immigration law now.

Edited September 1, 2011 by Tim/Mav

[Hiker 9]

Yes, I read "No, what you got was an affirmation from the county registrar that a divorce was granted. (Sorry, I said court clerk in my previous post.) The county registrar doesn't grant divorces. The certificate from the county registrar just confirms that a divorce decree exists. They want a copy of the document signed by the judge that declares your divorce final, and spells out the terms of the divorce. "

but how does that help me? I can't make a court give me something they don't give out.

[Tim/Mav 305]

Get ahold of your divorce attorney and ask for legal disollution of the marridge to include who got what, who pays what, who got the big screen tv and signed by the judge. Thats your divorce decree. If your divorce attourney does not have this when you just recently divorced then your attorney has an addiction to his/her paper shreder.

[Hiker 9]

And it isn't from the "county registrar"... I was at the court, very big old building in Cambridge, MA... this is the same building I requested the document from. It is the court "copy office"... they literally call it that... I wasn't just being loose with my terms when I said this earlier. Their job is to make copies of COURT documents for a fee. They sent me a copy of the COURT document that they call "certificate of divorce absolute"... it is not merely saying that document exists... it IS the document.

[Hiker 9]

I think I need an immigration attorney. How do I find a good one, and find one fast?

[NoneYa 73]

I would pay someone to go there and sit and retrieve it if you can't go there. I also had trouble getting to the courthouse and I was looking up college kids until I figured I could get there by 8 AM and be back by 9 AM before work.

Call a business near buy the court house and tell them you will pay someone to go stand in line and retrieve this document for you. Maybe a lawyer near by the court house will have a secretary due it for a reasonable fee. My lawyer could have walked there in 5 minutes so they can't charge you more than $ 100.

I got the highest court proof they had and they called it an exemplified copy, and it had a few pages of the the agreement. A couple of judges signed it. I might still get an RFE but I think I am okay.

[Jamie and Shirley 2]

Reading posts like this makes me really happy that I paid a good lawyer to field these issues for me. Maybe you can take ALL of your divorce paperwork and send it - highlighting the any place where it decrees the final divorce.

[Tim/Mav 305]

I think I need an immigration attorney. How do I find a good one, and find one fast?

Get a free consultation and/or $100.00 bucks for 45 minutes. no need to hire them. (Just to get past this first Loop-Hole) Bring every piece of papers (documents) you have and some KY Jelly because thats going to be a screw. Your goal here is to aquire the NOA2. You won't need an attorney after that (Maybe) Get every document posible from your divorce attorney to present to the immigration attorney. I wish there was a better way than this but there is to much confusion.

[Eruditional 5]

And here is the divorce decree with my personal info blacked out:

Hey Hiker, don't know if anyone else pointed this out, but that document alludes to another document that is the actual decree.

"I, Tara E. DeCristofar, ...... certify that, a Judgement of Divorce Nisi was entered by the Court in the above mentioned case for cause which is fully set forth in the decree on file in the Court."

Which to me would seem like there is an actual "Decree" that you could also provide.

Forgive me if this has already been mentioned, I've sort of skimmed this topic.

I've just requested my decree from my divorce (9 years ago) from the court. Hopefully it's the correct document O.o

Edited September 1, 2011 by pcload1etter

[Hiker 9]

I would pay someone to go there and sit and retrieve it if you can't go there. I also had trouble getting to the courthouse and I was looking up college kids until I figured I could get there by 8 AM and be back by 9 AM before work.

Call a business near buy the court house and tell them you will pay someone to go stand in line and retrieve this document for you. Maybe a lawyer near by the court house will have a secretary due it for a reasonable fee. My lawyer could have walked there in 5 minutes so they can't charge you more than $ 100.

I got the highest court proof they had and they called it an exemplified copy, and it had a few pages of the the agreement. A couple of judges signed it. I might still get an RFE but I think I am okay.

I have no problem going to the court, nor paying large amounts of money to make this problem go away. I do not need to pay someone to get it for me, unless they have special skills that only allow them to get the document. It is just a train ride in there, and I've obviously been there before since I was able to get divorced there. That's not the problem. The problem is what the heck am I supposed to ask for?? I can't ask for something that doesn't exist, and if I ask for a divorce decree, they are going to give me what I already have.

I feel like I'm in a Monty Python skit, except I'm not laughing.

If you worked in a restaurant and a customer ordered a ham sandwich, and you brought them a ham sandwich, and they said "No I said a ham sandwich, take this back and bring me one", you'd think they are insane. Are you supposed to bring them back the same ham sandwich, a different ham sandwich that basically looks the same, or does the ham sandwich need to be improved upon in some unspecified way even though the customer is not making that complaint, but is instead saying he wants a ham sandwich.

Make sense?

Hey Hiker, don't know if anyone else pointed this out, but that document alludes to another document that is the actual decree.

"I, Tara E. DeCristofar, ...... certify that, a Judgement of Divorce Nisi was entered by the Court in the above mentioned case for cause which is fully set forth in the decree on file in the Court."

Which to me would seem like there is an actual "Decree" that you could also provide.

Forgive me if this has already been mentioned, I've sort of skimmed this topic.

I've just requested my decree from my divorce (9 years ago) from the court. Hopefully it's the correct document O.o

But the divorce nisi happens before the decree. A decree would not set forth anything about a judgment of divorce nisi.

Reading posts like this makes me really happy that I paid a good lawyer to field these issues for me. Maybe you can take ALL of your divorce paperwork and send it - highlighting the any place where it decrees the final divorce.

I can certainly do that, but I expect that will end in failure. The only document that is actually a divorce decree is what I already sent them, so sending them other stuff is not giving them specifically what they asked for. I need them to explain what they think a divorce decree actually is, if it isn't the divorce decree.