Preventative health care services for women now covered by Health Care Bill

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Social responsibility is not absurd, Paul. It's the cornerstone value of a lot of countries with far more effective and efficient health systems than the USA.

The insurance industry is about as useful as intestinal parasites.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Social responsibility is not absurd, Paul. It's the cornerstone value of a lot of countries with far more effective and efficient health systems than the USA.

The insurance industry is about as useful as intestinal parasites.

I agree on the insurance industry. Insurance should not be necessary and I've said that until I'm blue in the face before, but people feel this 'need' to throw money away all the time.....

As far as 'social responsibility' goes, screw that. I'm no more responsible for you, than you are for me. If I leave you alone, don't touch you, don't interact with you, then no one should demand anything from me.

If I go to a store and buy a product, I pay a tax on that product and that's my 'duty' to 'society' and the government. As long as I don't harass or bother anyone else on the street, then that's all that should matter.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

You live in a society Paul, not a mountain cave. You can't pick and choose what parts of civilised life you get to adhere to.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

You live in a society Paul, not a mountain cave. You can't pick and choose what parts of civilised life you get to adhere to.

Actually, yes you can. Until now, there are no 'demands' on individuals to do/purchase anything that they don't choose to partake in.

[rika60607 215]

A few points:

1. "If you can't afford healthcare - sucks to be you?" Interesting. If I have infectious disease and I can not afford treatment, I am going to spread it. Pretty soon it will suck to be anyone. Your kids will get it from my kids at school. And you will get it from your kids. Hepatitis anyone?

2. Yes, I remember that thread where you explained that cash customers bear the burden for the non-payers. I also remember that someone explained to you that you were wrong about it.

3. Young and healthy do not need health insurance? Huh? May be if you are young, healthy and live in a bubble. Infectious diseases and accidents do not care if you are young and healthy. Young and healthy can break their leg while skiing, get HIV while dating, get tuberculosis while riding a bus, lose their arm to a shark while surfing in Florida or have their lungs pierced in a car accident.

Now, if health services were cheap, then of course, young and healthy would not need insurance. But as it is, healthcare is expensive in the US and young tend to be poor.

Vaccination laws get questioned all the time. Kids today are over-vaccinated if anything.

The problem with health care is people have the entitlement mentality when it comes to it. It's a service. It does cost money. If you can't afford it? Tough luck. Sucks to be you. The idea that I should have to pay for you or you pay for me is absurd. Also "premiums" have little to nothing to do with who pays and who doesn't at the hospital. Anyone who tells you that is lying out their butt and I explained this in a thread last week. Anyone who understands how medical billing works knows this as well. It's the cash customers that get screwed in the end (i/e the "wealthiest of Americans" who don't carry insurance and pay out of pocket in most cases). Seriously, if a hospital knows you have money and are paying cash, the bill will be ridiculous. That's not the point though... Insurance is a choice, a choice to help you pay for something you might need. You understand the rules of insurance when you make that choice to purchase it.... You could just as easily put back $300 a month on your own into an account that gains interest, but people would rather throw money away.... If you're young and healthy, there is no need for you to have health insurance when you could be saving that money instead of throwing it away.

[jundp 191]

As far as 'social responsibility' goes, screw that. I'm no more responsible for you, than you are for me. If I leave you alone, don't touch you, don't interact with you, then no one should demand anything from me.

You seem like a very bitter person who has an unrealistic view of the world if you truly believe that we, as global citizens, bear no social responsibility.

Do you live in a cave in the wilderness? You keep talking about "choice" but what you fail to understand that living in America is a choice as well. Living in ANY society is a choice. And every single action you take has a reaction that affects other people. Whether you like it or not.

But back to the OP: why is preventative health care an issue?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Liberty - every heard of it?

Liberty does not require the absence of government.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Actually, yes you can. Until now, there are no 'demands' on individuals to do/purchase anything that they don't choose to partake in.

You dont have to piss on people if they're on fire. Unfortunately what that represents is an introverted society where noone gives a toss about anyone else.

[tmma 467]

Vaccination laws get questioned all the time. Kids today are over-vaccinated if anything.

The problem with health care is people have the entitlement mentality when it comes to it. It's a service. It does cost money. If you can't afford it? Tough luck. Sucks to be you. The idea that I should have to pay for you or you pay for me is absurd. Also "premiums" have little to nothing to do with who pays and who doesn't at the hospital. Anyone who tells you that is lying out their butt and I explained this in a thread last week. Anyone who understands how medical billing works knows this as well. It's the cash customers that get screwed in the end (i/e the "wealthiest of Americans" who don't carry insurance and pay out of pocket in most cases). Seriously, if a hospital knows you have money and are paying cash, the bill will be ridiculous. That's not the point though... Insurance is a choice, a choice to help you pay for something you might need. You understand the rules of insurance when you make that choice to purchase it.... You could just as easily put back $300 a month on your own into an account that gains interest, but people would rather throw money away.... If you're young and healthy, there is no need for you to have health insurance when you could be saving that money instead of throwing it away.

The .00000000375% pa interest is really going to be handy when that mega bill comes in for the brain tumor you didn't know you had because you are young and look ' healthy'.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Actually, yes you can. Until now, there are no 'demands' on individuals to do/purchase anything that they don't choose to partake in.

Yes, you can? Man, you sound like Obama. Can you provide a rough outline of what you can actually do without being subject to government demands relative to such activity? Where would you live? What would you consume? How would you support yourself?

[Obama 2012 1,714]

You seem like a very bitter person who has an unrealistic view of the world if you truly believe that we, as global citizens, bear no social responsibility.

Do you live in a cave in the wilderness? You keep talking about "choice" but what you fail to understand that living in America is a choice as well. Living in ANY society is a choice. And every single action you take has a reaction that affects other people. Whether you like it or not.

But back to the OP: why is preventative health care an issue?

Global citizens? What you are an NWO rep or something?

Living in America gives you choices, let us not forget that. The constitution was written so we wouldn't bear responsibility for the entire nation outside of her defense. That was our common law together. Everything else was supposed to be left up to the states (see: mini countries in a sense). However through power, greed, etc. we live in this idea that we are all one state and not fifty of them.

People try and justify forcing others to do things for the "greater good." However it's that exact "greater good" that causes turmoil in society. Forcing someone in Virginia to pay for the health care of someone in Montana is absurd. Let Virginia handle Virginia. They are two complete opposites. Trying to justify something, no matter what the intentions are, is proof enough that it's not what it's cracked up to be. We abandoned slavery because we demanded liberty for all citizens. We demanded that no citizen could hold another citizen hostage, against his/her will. Now we are demanding that citizens pay for other citizens, we are demanding now as slaves to the government that a citizen, who may or may not take part of a system, be forced to pay for other citizens on a NATIONAL level. That is a dangerous prescedent to have.

As I've stated, many act like this is OK, because it's about health. I mean who doesn't want to be healthy right? It goes far beyond that though. Health care is the gateway to owning and controlling a society. What you can eat, what you can drink, what you can do, what you cannot do, what activities are 'safe' for you to do, etc...

Totalitarian governments don't occur overnight. It takes time, it take constant changes in law all for the "greater good" and eventually once the people are under the wing of the government, then there is no escaping the grasp that slowly but surely builds an obedient society. A slave to the government, and anyone who disagrees is punished.

What's wrong with preventative care you asked? Absolutely nothing. Unless it's forced upon you.

You dont have to piss on people if they're on fire. Unfortunately what that represents is an introverted society where noone gives a toss about anyone else.

Local government is a lot different than Federal. That's always my point in any of this.

When you eliminate freedom all around, you're creating tyranny.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Actually, yes you can. Until now, there are no 'demands' on individuals to do/purchase anything that they don't choose to partake in.

That's like saying you're not sharing the same roads or breathing the same air as anyone else. Communicable diseases are not something you can choose to partake in or not.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Global citizens? What you are an NWO rep or something?

Living in America gives you choices, let us not forget that. The constitution was written so we wouldn't bear responsibility for the entire nation outside of her defense. That was our common law together. Everything else was supposed to be left up to the states (see: mini countries in a sense). However through power, greed, etc. we live in this idea that we are all one state and not fifty of them.

People try and justify forcing others to do things for the "greater good." However it's that exact "greater good" that causes turmoil in society. Forcing someone in Virginia to pay for the health care of someone in Montana is absurd. Let Virginia handle Virginia. They are two complete opposites. Trying to justify something, no matter what the intentions are, is proof enough that it's not what it's cracked up to be. We abandoned slavery because we demanded liberty for all citizens. We demanded that no citizen could hold another citizen hostage, against his/her will. Now we are demanding that citizens pay for other citizens, we are demanding now as slaves to the government that a citizen, who may or may not take part of a system, be forced to pay for other citizens on a NATIONAL level. That is a dangerous prescedent to have.

As I've stated, many act like this is OK, because it's about health. I mean who doesn't want to be healthy right? It goes far beyond that though. Health care is the gateway to owning and controlling a society. What you can eat, what you can drink, what you can do, what you cannot do, what activities are 'safe' for you to do, etc...

Totalitarian governments don't occur overnight. It takes time, it take constant changes in law all for the "greater good" and eventually once the people are under the wing of the government, then there is no escaping the grasp that slowly but surely builds an obedient society. A slave to the government, and anyone who disagrees is punished.

What's wrong with preventative care you asked? Absolutely nothing. Unless it's forced upon you.

Local government is a lot different than Federal. That's always my point in any of this.

When you eliminate freedom all around, you're creating tyranny.

Free markets don't equate to "freedom". That's a common misperception.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

That's like saying you're not sharing the same roads or breathing the same air as anyone else. Communicable diseases are not something you can choose to partake in or not.

Not everyone is going to get sick because one person has a virus.

Some will, some won't. Some have better 'genes' than others.

[Marilyn. 340]

why take that chance??

I would like to have insurance just in case I am one of those people without good genes...