"Gaza Island"

[Ban Hammer 13,334]

Watching COPS in the US I routinely see them jump on a guy that has his hands out laying sprawled out on the ground. Seems like excessive force to me. Kinda makes you think "why give up?" they're gonna kick your #### anyway.

[IR5FORMUMSIE 850]

And there it is. WoM admitting that killing Israelis is ok, and in fact, perfectly legal.

Nothing further, your honor.

Diversion and falsehoods take away from the issue at hand, I have yet to hear any condemnation about the MURDER of Palestinians from YOU. Asking for basic human rights makes someone an extremist? I forgot they are terrorists, bloody-thirsty savages who dare to live. We'll slaughter them in the streets, but since they don't believe in OUR peace, we'll preemptively slaughter them in the streets they way Pharaoh killed our first-born males. We'd drive them to the sea but that highway is only for our use.

[IR5FORMUMSIE 850]

You, WoM, are an extremist and there can be no common ground with extremists.

Nor can there be with those who refuse to see the truth, that would make you delusional and an extremist.

I will not rest my case until there is no more injustice.

Edited July 22, 2011 by IR5FORMUMSIE

[Karee 4,190]

My two cents. Mawilson has an indefensible position. We got sh!t on in the 30s and 40s, therefore we have the right to sh!t on everyone else that doesn't agree with the Israeli govt's attempt to take the small piece of the small pie that is left in the west bank. Anyone that that thinks Israel wants peace is seriously deluded. They want LAND. They are going to play that victim card from the 30s and 40s to the end. We get it.. The Nazis tried to exterminate you. That does not give you Carte Blanche to do the same thing.

I'm agnostic, so I don't give a shite either way. But this thing is pretty much blanket occupation with the US giving a:

[IR5FORMUMSIE 850]

My two cents. Mawilson has an indefensible position. We got sh!t on in the 30s and 40s, therefore we have the right to sh!t on everyone else that doesn't agree with the Israeli govt's attempt to take the small piece of the small pie that is left in the west bank. Anyone that that thinks Israel wants peace is seriously deluded. They want LAND. They are going to play that victim card from the 30s and 40s to the end. We get it.. The Nazis tried to exterminate you. That does not give you Carte Blanche to do the same thing.

I'm agnostic, so I don't give a shite either way. But this thing is pretty much blanket occupation with the US giving a:

QFT!!!!! Victims frequently become abusers themselves.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

This morning I only watched the first video and I watched it again twice and my opinion stands. I did garble the facts to a degree and stand corrected, the IDF officer pushed the man back who approached rapidly despite repeated warnings to get back, so my opinion doesn't change. Try behaving like that anywhere in the world during an arrest and see how it goes. Scary but not criminal on the IDF officers action is the best I can give you.

Your eyes are still not quite seeing. The Palestinian man did not "approach rapidly" - at :43, he standing in place - about 10 feet away from the soldier. The soldier is the one who rapidly approaches, shoving the Palestinian man and then sticking the gun in his face.

It is absolutely criminal, because the occupation is illegal - the Israeli soldiers have no right to even be there, much less abduct people, or even try to force people to "shut up" or "get out of here." The Palestinian is the one who is within his rights here, not that soldier.

I am starting to get the idea that you think the Palestinians should be kneeling at the Israelis' feet while they complete stealing what's left of Palestine - or better yet, just disappear. Well, it's not happening.

I just watched the 2nd and 3rd videos. Again not much to put either situation in context, but in the 3rd video the man getting arrested is resisting, is injured, and despite the obvious tension and chaos the cuffs are removed.

What are you watching ???? In the third video, the soldiers have a Palestinian protestor already in their hands - he is not resisting at all. He is not injured until they shove him on the ground and pull his arm behind his back where they proceed to break his hand - on purpose. Don't you hear him screaming as they do it ?

I know it is very hard to watch this video, and even more difficult for you because it is the IDF doing it - the military that you admire and respect. You keep trying to make it fit the framework of what you believe - that this is a normal situation, a normal "arrest," and the army is behaving in a normal way like any armed force in the world would behave. But it's not normal (at least in "Western democracies") to hold a person helpless on the ground while you intentionally break his bones.

And this is not some isolated incident - there is a long history of "the breaking of bones" of Palestinians, which reportedly was an order from Yitzhak Rabin on how to handle protestors during the First Intifada. At any rate, IDF soldiers do this sort of thing all the time to Palestinian civilians, and almost never are they punished in any way - even when it's caught on tape.

Most of what really goes on in the West Bank and Gaza is hidden from average Israelis, not to mention average Americans. They see only one tiny fraction of the story - the part that Israel wants them to see - and they believe they are fully "informed" because they've seen that side. I can tell you personally, it is quite a shock to find out that everything you were ever taught about something, and believed without question, is a complete lie.

These Palestinians are on their own land - they are not in Israel. They are in their own village, protesting the illegal seizure of their property - their homes, their farms, their village lands - by the Israeli army in order to expand illegal Israeli settlements in the West Bank. In this particular protest, the villagers of Beit Ummar are protesting their lands being sliced away by the settlement of Karmei Tzur.

As you can see, this illegal settlement is well within the West Bank. It is part of the attempt to separate Hebron from Palestine. Once a settlement is inserted between Palestinian villages and population centers, then additional land is systematically seized to expand these settlements, and to build the Israeli-only roads which connect settlements to each other and to Israel "proper." This is the mechanism which allows the Israelis to insert a wedge to divide Palestinians in one village from another, enclose them into separate "cantons," and control any travel or movement of goods between Palestinian areas.

What is hilarious is the reaction of some in this thread (not you - you have been very decent and willing to discuss, and have made your points in a reasonable way) who have gone completely off the rails because they've been confronted with this other side of the story. As if people don't get to hear enough of the official Israeli version of events every time they turn on CNN, Fox News, ABC, NBC, CBS, MSNBC, the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, and on and on and on....

But it seems any voice at all from the Palestinian side cannot be tolerated - you can see the bullying tactics used to try to silence it in this thread. I have been called a terrorist, an extremist, someone who calls for the "Death of Israel," who "doesn't think Jewish people should have a state," says "it's ok to kill Israelis," etc. etc. etc. - just because I've cited international law and the Geneva Convention, and posted alternate views from various reporters, including Israelis. Now that's an extremist mentality !

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

<< Palestinians dancing video >>

There are so many questions about this video. A German newspaper found out some rather fascinating details about how it was made. You're probably not interested, though.

But, since you like dancing and since you like Fox News, why don't you Google "Dancing Israelis + Carl Cameron + Fox News."

Cha cha cha !

[mawilson 2,133]

[_Simpson_ 250]

There are so many questions about this video. A German newspaper found out some rather fascinating details about how it was made. You're probably not interested, though.

But, since you like dancing and since you like Fox News, why don't you Google "Dancing Israelis + Carl Cameron + Fox News."

Cha cha cha !

It was reported by other agencies too. No need to keep making excuses for everything Palestine. There is a huge amount of extremists in Palestine and that is its biggest problem Palestine faces not Israel.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

It was reported by other agencies too. No need to keep making excuses for everything Palestine. There is a huge amount of extremists in Palestine and that is its biggest problem Palestine faces not Israel.

The extremists Palestine needs to worry about most are the ones running the Israeli Government.

[_Simpson_ 250]

The extremists Palestine needs to worry about most are the ones running the Israeli Government.

If only we could get all of Islam to quit painting them as freedom fighters and call them out as the thugs they are

Edited July 25, 2011 by _Simpson_

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

It was reported by other agencies too. No need to keep making excuses for everything Palestine.

Actually, this is what I said:

There are so many questions about this video. A German newspaper found out some rather fascinating details about how it was made. You're probably not interested, though.

But, since you like dancing and since you like Fox News, why don't you Google "Dancing Israelis + Carl Cameron + Fox News."

An "excuse" is saying "well, they were justified" or "they had reason to do that." There is nothing in my comment resembling that.

I noticed you didn't want to address the issue of the Israelis that were also reported by the very same news source to be celebrating on 9/11.

There is a huge amount of extremists in Palestine and that is its biggest problem Palestine faces not Israel.

Really ? Have you ever been to Palestine ? What is the source of your "knowledge" ?

[_Simpson_ 250]

Actually, this is what I said:

An "excuse" is saying "well, they were justified" or "they had reason to do that." There is nothing in my comment resembling that.

I noticed you didn't want to address the issue of the Israelis that were also reported by the very same news source to be celebrating on 9/11.

By excuses I mean your trying to downplay it. As far as Israelis dancing I have yet to see the video. I know that there was celebrating but it was not tolerated like it was in Palestine and the amount of people was nothing like Palestine. Are you really trying to equally compare the two in this manner?

Really ? Have you ever been to Palestine ? What is the source of your "knowledge" ?

You do know that they voted Hamas in???

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

You do know that they voted Hamas in???

And how many times has Israel voted in Likud?

[Sofiyya 1,687]

If only we could get all of Islam to quit painting them as freedom fighters and call them out as the thugs they are

Why not call for all of Judaism and Christianity to stop pretending Israel is an innocent victim instead of the colonialist ethnic cleansers they are? Is that too much reality, too much honesty for you to handle?