Culture, misunderstanding, or just plain used?

[notredame 0]

Ok guys, I have an interesting story to tell concerning a friend of mine and his filipina fiancee. I am just going to give the facts as I know them relayed to me by my friend and what his ex fiancee had said to him vs what she told my filipina. He is an american and shortly after I met my baby online nearly one and a half years ago, he went to a dating site and met his now current ex fiancee. She was working and has 2 kids, never married. He visited her for 10 days and came back and announced to me he was engaged and was filing for K1. I sorta advise him to know her better, as I had spent time with my fiancee about two months before that for 21 days and returned, but not engaged yet. I wanted to see her on a longer time frame before I went that step. Shortly after that he filed the K1.

During the waiting for the NOA2, he revisited again but this time for 21 days. He was coming up on 7 months waiting and was approved while he was away. He came home and told me he was going to cancel the K1 and return in about 6 more months and marry and then revisit her every 3 months until she was approved and came to America. Now I could not understand the logic but the following was his explanation and where their breakup begins and I sorta cannot figure out if he is crazy or if she is just used him...

My friend is a truck driver and always on the road, sometimes week and a half before he gets home. His last marriage broke up because he was gone a lot and the wife cheated and left him. He is real concerned about that happening again. He wants a family, but also time with them as a normal working person and not sporadic as being a truck driver can be. His home was foreclosed due to his divorce and he had a chance to move to his parents rent home with 5 acres as long as he paid the note on it. Currently renters stay there, so his plan was to cancel the k1, stay on the road, make oodles of money driving and pay the principle on the rent home, and since renters are there now paying the mortgage, he will pay extra for 2 years and own a home debt free, he could quit being a driver, get a regular lower paying job and be able to live easy life with filipina wife and her kids without fear of another foreclosure and home taken away, and fear of being away and fear of infidelity as with last marriage. It sounded ok to me, but I questioned that if he knew the girl really well, then the fear of the cheating would not be there. But stuff like that happens, so I understood his motif for thinking like that.

He gave his fiancee the choice to come now on the k1 since it got approve or he could do as I said above and have a better future finacially. She chose the latter. After she made this decision he then returned home from 21 day trip, canceled the k1 and began his many days of driving. But now she has closed her phone and will not answer his emails. Now me and my fiancee were concerned so my fiancee called her at my friends request to talk to her. My fiancce had talked to her before so they knew each other by phone only but not really good friends. She told my baby that her pc was broken the last 3 days and was waiting for my friend to call, but he never has. She also expressed he was an indecisive guy and if he did not call soon to talk to her she would move on. She expressed how very hurt she was on him canceling the visa. But according to my friend, she decided to go that way and get married later and allow him to get finacially on his feet first.

It is sad they stop talking. My friend is devastated cuz he gave her a $3700 ring before he left and she seemed very ok with his new plan and now cannot understand if she used him or not. She never really ever soliciated money from him during their online time together, seemed sincere whenever my fiancee emailed and talked to her. But according to what she tells my fiancee, her decision was based on him not being decisive and wishy washy in his decisions.

Now, my fiancee and I have talked many times and I have come to the conclusion it is part of the filipino culture not to be too confrontational with anyone and say what you must to avoid trouble. If this is true, then she did that to my friend, even accepting his engagement ring. I really do not think she scammed or used him, but she did tell him it was ok for him to go the marriage route later, and if the k1 cancelation was a big hurt for her, she did not express it to him.

There are other factors involved, so if you want to ask questions, I can give more info but will just keep this post at a reasonable size for now. I would like to hear opinions, especially from those that are currently married to filipinas and maybe about some culture issues. I am waiting for an my fiancee's interview in July, so I, myself will be married soon and could use some insight too. Thanks guys...

edit... this was posted by me, uverseman, i was logged into my fiancee account and did not realize it. So the posters name is different..

Edited June 7, 2011 by notredame

[Psalm139 5]

Ok guys, I have an interesting story to tell concerning a friend of mine and his filipina fiancee. I am just going to give the facts as I know them relayed to me by my friend and what his ex fiancee had said to him vs what she told my filipina. He is an american and shortly after I met my baby online nearly one and a half years ago, he went to a dating site and met his now current ex fiancee. She was working and has 2 kids, never married. He visited her for 10 days and came back and announced to me he was engaged and was filing for K1. I sorta advise him to know her better, as I had spent time with my fiancee about two months before that for 21 days and returned, but not engaged yet. I wanted to see her on a longer time frame before I went that step. Shortly after that he filed the K1.

During the waiting for the NOA2, he revisited again but this time for 21 days. He was coming up on 7 months waiting and was approved while he was away. He came home and told me he was going to cancel the K1 and return in about 6 more months and marry and then revisit her every 3 months until she was approved and came to America. Now I could not understand the logic but the following was his explanation and where their breakup begins and I sorta cannot figure out if he is crazy or if she is just used him...

My friend is a truck driver and always on the road, sometimes week and a half before he gets home. His last marriage broke up because he was gone a lot and the wife cheated and left him. He is real concerned about that happening again. He wants a family, but also time with them as a normal working person and not sporadic as being a truck driver can be. His home was foreclosed due to his divorce and he had a chance to move to his parents rent home with 5 acres as long as he paid the note on it. Currently renters stay there, so his plan was to cancel the k1, stay on the road, make oodles of money driving and pay the principle on the rent home, and since renters are there now paying the mortgage, he will pay extra for 2 years and own a home debt free, he could quit being a driver, get a regular lower paying job and be able to live easy life with filipina wife and her kids without fear of another foreclosure and home taken away, and fear of being away and fear of infidelity as with last marriage. It sounded ok to me, but I questioned that if he knew the girl really well, then the fear of the cheating would not be there. But stuff like that happens, so I understood his motif for thinking like that.

He gave his fiancee the choice to come now on the k1 since it got approve or he could do as I said above and have a better future finacially. She chose the latter. After she made this decision he then returned home from 21 day trip, canceled the k1 and began his many days of driving. But now she has closed her phone and will not answer his emails. Now me and my fiancee were concerned so my fiancee called her at my friends request to talk to her. My fiancce had talked to her before so they knew each other by phone only but not really good friends. She told my baby that her pc was broken the last 3 days and was waiting for my friend to call, but he never has. She also expressed he was an indecisive guy and if he did not call soon to talk to her she would move on. She expressed how very hurt she was on him canceling the visa. But according to my friend, she decided to go that way and get married later and allow him to get finacially on his feet first.

It is sad they stop talking. My friend is devastated cuz he gave her a $3700 ring before he left and she seemed very ok with his new plan and now cannot understand if she used him or not. She never really ever soliciated money from him during their online time together, seemed sincere whenever my fiancee emailed and talked to her. But according to what she tells my fiancee, her decision was based on him not being decisive and wishy washy in his decisions.

Now, my fiancee and I have talked many times and I have come to the conclusion it is part of the filipino culture not to be too confrontational with anyone and say what you must to avoid trouble. If this is true, then she did that to my friend, even accepting his engagement ring. I really do not think she scammed or used him, but she did tell him it was ok for him to go the marriage route later, and if the k1 cancelation was a big hurt for her, she did not express it to him.

There are other factors involved, so if you want to ask questions, I can give more info but will just keep this post at a reasonable size for now. I would like to hear opinions, especially from those that are currently married to filipinas and maybe about some culture issues. I am waiting for an my fiancee's interview in July, so I, myself will be married soon and could use some insight too. Thanks guys...

edit... this was posted by me, uverseman, i was logged into my fiancee account and did not realize it. So the posters name is different..

If you dont mind, just want to know, how old is your friend and the girl... sometimes this vary on the age... but i am still trying to comprehend the story, for sure there is some miscommunication happened here.

[Darnell 8,478]

I don't think the girl used him, at all.

With an approved I-129F, and his 'other plan', I'm certain she's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too shocked to handle that other stress, even she's agreed to 'the plan' already when he was there.

[Messybrownhair 251]

I also don't think she used him.. If she did, it would have been more obvious and there would have been more blatant "I need money for this and this etc" Scenarios that are all too common and you would have picked up on it right away. Having said that, the whole situation is still very strange to me.. There are obviously things in this story that have either not been told or maybe only the couple knows about. Either way, they need to talk things through and have proper closure. I hope they work it out, and I'm sorry about your friend. I am sure the ring plus all the plane rides back and forth must have been a fortune for him, and it really does suck to be disappointed especially when you have invested so much both financially and emotionally already. I guess you're right, people really shouldn't jump the gun and file petitions when they have not really gotten to know the person too well.. I hope they work things out, and if they don't, I hope he will be able to recover from this both financially and emotionally. Goodluck to them!

[Tahoma 2,292]

Your buddy shot himself in the foot with his trust issue.

[Deputy Purple 1,294]

From reading the OP it sounds like she was blindsided and devastated by the sudden & drastic change of plans. I know he probably said that he asked her opinion but I'd bet he really emphasized his new plan (even if not intending to) so she felt pressured to agree.

My wife has done that and I've learned to read her well enough to know when she's just being agreeable versus giving me her opinion on the options.

[dindo and patty 20]

It doesn't sound like she used him at all. It sure sounds like a failure in communication though. I can understand the OP wanting to make a more stable relationship/situation for when she gets there with the kids. Imagine this...she gets there with the kids and he goes away for long periods as a truck driver...that will put a lot of stress and strain on both parties. I can also understand that she was upset about the approved I-129F being cancelled. I think in the long run, the OP's plan is a better plan as he wants to ensure that the relationship will be on better footing once he is better off financially and that he will actually be there for them instead of being away for long periods.

If they do care for each other very much, then they really need to talk things through and really buy into whatever plan they agree on and be prepared for the long haul. If either of the party isn't willing to do that, then they need not kid themselves and go their separate way. I really do hope they work things out.

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

I don't see her as using him. IF... she gives the ring back to him. Why would she need to keep it? Either A) She plans to marry him, or 2) She plans to sell it and keep the money.

The key here is communication. Why isn't she responding to him? If her computer is down, she could go to an internet cafe and check email. My fiancee goes WAY out of her way to communicate daily with me. On the other hand, when I told her we needed to push back our interview to align her visa with my re-deployment, she was very upset for a while. Fears of me not wanting to get married probably abounded. Being the one in a foreign land, counting on a guy (who is little more than a sweet stranger) to keep his promises to marry and take care of you... that's scary, at best. And risky. But talking about it is the best thing they can do.

He should try to call/email her, and she needs to respond. If nothing else, to tell him to pack sand, get lost, she's not gonna wait for him. And THEN she should give the ring back.

[TeddyHoney 42]

She may be a little too upset to communicate with him right now. Having been married to a filipina before and engaged to another now and known her for almost 3 years now, I can confirm that this is not unusual filipina behavior if she is upset. I hope the guy does not give up on her and gives this more time. I don't think she has used him. Sounds more like she may have not fully understood everything he told her (and yes, I understand he probably fully explained it all in explicit detail!), but no matter how good her english seems to be she still probably translates quite a bit. So a lot can be missed especially in a stressfull situation. And then the non-confrontational thing is very, very true.

I hope this is given time and works out in the end for both parties whatever they decide.

God bless to them both!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The question put to her by him (paraphasing) - "We can be together now, or you and the kids can stay there in the Philippines for a long time before coming over?" would have been so insulting and preposterous (if I were her), that I'd probably give him the same answer. He may have legitimate financial concerns about waiting, but he should have figured that out long before he started courting her. He sounds like he's putting her on layaway. Hopefully, this will be a lesson learned.

[Vi-Jay 218]

The question put to her by him (paraphasing) - "We can be together now, or you and the kids can stay there in the Philippines for a long time before coming over?" would have been so insulting and preposterous (if I were her), that I'd probably give him the same answer. He may have legitimate financial concerns about waiting, but he should have figured that out long before he started courting her. He sounds like he's putting her on layaway. Hopefully, this will be a lesson learned.

Our little talk helped. You're welcome.

Edited June 7, 2011 by Vi-Jay

[jrmejia 31]

From what I read, I doubt she is using him.

[gretchen_darren 67]

The biggest problem here is the culture. In the Philippines, saying you are doing something means you are going to do it. Do not say it, or even mention it. Once you promise it, it is expected. Him cancelling the K-1 and not bringing her over, is a big slap in the face to her. And also lowers her standing with her family and friends. This guy insulted her by doing what he did.

Now I am not saying what he did was wrong. Wanting to be secure before she came. However, I do not see any difference between her being here or her being there. His whole plan change makes absolutely no sense. Something is definitely wrong. Yes, she probably cares about him, and wants to be with him. But cancelling the K-1, not being married to her, and no even talking, maybe he is interested. or maybe there is cold feet on his end because of the "burn" he had before.

All I can say is, he broke his word to her. And her saying he is wishy-washy in his decisions should be a HUGE wake-up call to him. Whatever he is doing, only him and her know, but one thing filipinas do not like is "wishy-washy" men. Filipinas see enough "girly boys" over there, filipinas do not want to be married to one.

[adiiann 163]

In Filipino culture, one great factor of relationship falling apart is lack of stability whether financially or emotionally. Based on your story, I sensed instability on your friend's part. Most Filipinas don't want to deal with instability. I don't think she used him, all of his plans and decisions are just hard for her to understand. By asking her to wait for quite a time without firm assurance that everything will workout just fine probably made up her decisions.

It's like in Filipino saying "Kumuha ng batong ipukpok sa sarili nyang ulo"