OK, here's my situation.

[Xinh_Will 1]

Hi guys! I introduced myself on the new members page(come say hi), but now I'm ready for a serious musing.

This is going to be a long post, with both relevant and irrelevant information. I want to tell you guys EVERYTHING and get your feedback. If it's too long, my apologies. But I've read through all 50 some odd pages of threads in the new Vietnam forum--plus the old one, plus plus. And I think I've learned what I'm gonna without some personal interaction. And Scott, Jerome, Huong, Chim, Kevin and his nightmare--I feel like I know so many of ya that I'm going to be a lot more comfortable here at VJ than with an attorney. When the time comes, we'll see--but my case is going to take some time before I'm ready for that. Now--jes' set a spell and let me tell you my story.

I was born in West Germany while my dad was in the service(Certificate of US citizen born abroad--which brings up question 10 on I-129F). My ex-wife is American born. We are both USC by birth.

My ex-wife and I separated (long expected)on November 1st, 2009 her sleeping at a friend's house while keeping up appearances with the kids(then 9,14,16). She announced to the assembled family that she was divorcing me with no chance of reconciliation on Valentine's Day 2010. My house burned to the ground May 23. I filed for Divorce (with a date of separation in the filing) May 28. The divorce will be final June 15, 2011. We are still taking each other's name off of everything. No biggie, but I am really worried about our student loan. The Federal servicer of the loan will not separate the two nor take my name off the loan. In the decree, she takes it over and I owe her the small bit that is mine. So I don't know how to handle that.

My ex and I are capable of speaking (coffee's probably better than dinner) and she wishes me well. Says, "you'll make a great husband-just not mine". The kids are all enamored with Xinh, though they have really only mostly talked to her on the phone. But they all seem VERY happy with the new addition--especially my youngest. This pleases the ex, so she is willing to help in any way showing our physical separation and real dissolution of the relationship, including DL with new address (which has the issue date), the rental agreement at her old apartment showing the move in date if she can find it, or any affadavit that might be helpful. She is an IRS employee well versed in necessary government documentation. In addition, she has attempted unsuccessfully to get a marriage based visa in the past. After our first child was born, we were not married and she moved 1500 miles away. She got pregnant by a man in the US illegally. They decided to pursue an attempt to get him citizenship. She miscarried and she lost interest in him. By then it was a sham marriage. The attempt lasted two years, though I don't really know any details--but it was abandoned. They divorced when I came back into the picture several years later.

The day after my wife made her announcement, I started a new job (you should see the pic on that badge!). There I met a man that was married to a Viet Kieu. She was here when he married her. After knowing him for most of a year I agreed to go on a vacation to Vietnam with them for two weeks. This fulfilled a lifelong dream of going to Cambodia and visiting Angkor Wat--wanted to do more than anything since I was SIX. It did not disappoint. After a few days of this I met them in Hue. The Vietnamese wife (we'll call her Minh) had been a cab driver before she came to America to open her nail salon. So she rents a private driver by the day and we toodle all over. That Thursday, my friends were busy and I went out alone. We drove a bit and after an hour I asked if he could hire somebody to translate. He called Xinh, his niece...though that took a while to figure out. You know, when a Viet introduces his/her "brother" my mind just inserts "generic relative" til I hear more.

At the end of the tombs, I asked for her number. "WHAT FOR?" "just in case I need someone to translate again".

I asked her out the next day after buying a phone specifically for that purpose. We did the "Good Morning Vietnam" dates for most of the rest of that trip. Always at least a brother or two, a sister-in-law, and a nephew in attendance. Got a couple of evenings alone together, but always in public. Coffee, dinner and the like. And I wasn't allowed to pay very often. She's an accountant with 10 years at the same company. Pension, four weeks vacation. Just built a new house for her parents. Quite comfortable for VN.

Xinh was born in mid 1982, making 12 and a half years difference--BUT her DL/ID/School records all record exactly one year later. She says her father changed her birth certificate because she was sickly and not ready for school. He did the same for an older brother. I'm guessing I find an original copy and give an explanation for discrepancies. And if the original shows the later date, that's just when she was born no matter what the family says? She didn't know my age at the time, it was just idle conversation at first--but I'm thinking about it a lot.

Once my friends found out how much I was enjoying being with this girl, Minh IMMEDIATELY introduced me to her niece, 19 years my junior and still in college. Minimal english. Would hum "dum dum DA dum" when we walked together. I hated it, and it has caused a great deal of damage to my friendship with her husband because she's PISSED I don't want to get involved with this girl.

I extended my visit for a week (HOURS in internet cafes on hold with American)to see more of Xinh. She invited me to her house three or four times that last week. It took a while for her father to warm to me, though the rest of the family all knew me by then. It's a great family and we all love each other.

Since my house burned down, I am currently living out of boxes. Had a lease for a while under insurance, and when that ran out I moved in with a friend while I await the interior being done. I don't know what documentary evidence I have of the first trip. Some, I'm sure--but I don't know how much. Pictures--a few, but some clothing issues, too. Had PLENTY of clothes the second trip--just didn't wear them. I'm wearing COMPLETELY DIFFERENT but IDENTICALLY COLORED t-shirts over four days that time. But, ya know--who thinks about that stuff.

Xinh's mother has been to America twice. Both times while I was in VN. I have only talked to her over the phone. I think it's a visitor's visa-Xinh has an uncle and an aunt in California that came over in the early eighties and a cousin (of some sort, don't know the exact relation) that married an American man a few years ago. It seems to be a successful marriage. Xinh has never been out of the country and has never applied for a US visa. When we talk of America, she quickly changes the subject to the two of us together and has often mentioned how easily she could get me a job. She's from outside of Hue and her ideas about America are based almost solely on old Hollywood movies. Seems every time I turn on a TV in VN it's Rocky IV and other documentaries about the US. But she seems a little scared of the idea even at this early stage.

I came back. We talked every day. We still do. I haven't changed to a phone card that logs calls, (I've been using the prepaid V247 card with a scratch off pin).

After only few weeks, introductions to the kids, etc. I started to talk about marriage. Told my mom I was thinking of proposing. Mom started talking to her. They talked most days--almost as much as I did. My dad has always refused to travel, but within another number of weeks my mom and I planned a trip to VN in February. She was looking for her passport when she had the stroke. She died three weeks later, I spent my birthday by her side. Consoling Xinh was one of the hardest things I've ever had to do-she didn't work for a week, wanted to know EVERYTHING about how funerals work here. It was a month before she got her spring back. Reading their email exchanges(which I had already been doing before the stroke--At one point Xinh nearly broke up with me over a misinterpreted joke between the two of them. I had to sort it out) are heart wrenching. They clearly loved each other. Mom was learning Vietnamese, and the two of them talked more about any wedding than I ever did(not that I wasn't on board). The last voicemail I have from my mother is last Christmas day, "Hi Bill, this is mom. I just got an email from Xinh, and (giggle) IF YOU DON'T MARRY THAT GIRL I'M GONNA DIVORCE YOU".

I left my job(I largely do IT consulting) in November. 2010 didn't look great with my dependent load and 2011 won't either. That said, I make plenty of money when I work. So, I'll be in a bit of I-864 trouble too. When the divorce is finalized the house will be transferred into my sole name with about 50K or so in equity. But I don't have much else. I've taken most of the last year and a half traveling, and so the cash stores are a bit bare, though I'm sure they'll build a bit before I'm ready to file. That said, my three years aren't going to look good. I know that most co-signers are binned, but if I had a CR-1 might it help? I've never been on any sort of assistance and of course neither would she. Man, that woman can find ways to make money!

Went back in April, stayed for two weeks. Met even more family--spent most of the time at her house and a few days traveling. Didn't plan well and had to take a 21 hour bus ride to Da Lat. Even though I thought to take more clothes, I didn't wear a lot of them. Many of the pictures are inside her house with her family. Have the boarding passes, etc. Saved a lot more stuff.

I had previously read the USCIS and State Department sites and figured I was A-OK. By this point I was sure this was what I wanted to do. Figured, wait a month for the divorce to be final and "bing" get the visa. Go over there for a big wedding to satisfy the family, come back and have a small one to satisfy the legal requirements. Live happily ever after.

Then I stumbled onto VJ.

Current plan is to wait for the divorce to be final, wait six months, go there with the kids and three friends but probably not my sedentary father for a reasonable Dam Hoi. Professional photographer, hundreds of guests. Then, if it's gonna be advantageous, start the proceedings for Vietnamese marriage. The VN marriage seems to be a pain in the #### and I'm not sure how long I'll be able to get off from work. Only a couple of weeks, so I'd probably have to go back to sign the book. Not sure. If we go that route, we'll have a marriage ceremony there in VN a couple of days after the Dam Hoi.

I haven't even really talked about her--but THANKS for letting me unload. I love her, she loves me. We are just fine with waiting--the getting to know each other is nice. But then again--after promising to go in Feb and not getting there til April--I could hear the tears in her goodbyes.

So--ask me again in a year or two.

Will

[Jerry & Fiona 1]

Hi guys! I introduced.................

So--ask me again in a year or two.

Will

Please don't take offense to this Will. And hello by the way. After staring at lines of HTML code all day, I'm home now and too lazy to read anything more than a few sentences. Though I am interested in many topics on VJ, is there any way you can sum it up? If not, please ignore this.

[Xinh_Will 1]

Sure thing Jerry. I've been there.

The TL;DR version:

Met in November, visited twice.

Separated from ex in 09, divorce final in a few weeks.

Age difference 12.5-13.5 years.

Met through taxi driver I hired for english translation.

Three relatives in US in different states, far flung from me-one married USC to get here. Viet Kieu that introduced me to driver NOT HAPPY about our relationship.

Low income, decent house equity.

Only pics and email. Phone card calling has not yet been logged.

For the coming Dam Hoi-mom died but loved Xinh, dad not likely to come, kids and friends will.

Can't get my name off of Student Consolidation loan with my ex-wife.

More or less.

[Nicole-N-Nattoy 24]

Hi welcome to VJ. Sounds to me u should be A-OK. Just wait awhile so they don't red flag you for jumping into a relationship to soon after divorce, but you say you can show proof of the two of you living apart and everything. You didn't know each other for that long but I've seen people all the time who have no problem and not a lot of time together. You should grab a co-sponsor if china allows that. That way you won't have to worry about ur work history. If you don't want to marry in China you could go the k-1 fiance visa route and just do a ceramony for her family there. If she has money or can transfer assests into cash maybe you could use some of her assests or savings. You definatly have a few hiccups in your case with the soon divorcing, meeting her while your technically married, kids, age, length of time you have been together, but I don't think it's a cause for denial. To be really safe you could wait a year to start the visa process and do not start offically "being her man" until a while after your divorce. I doubt you want to do that though. I have never heard of it being ok as long as you can show separation before divorce. I'm not sure if that will be sufficient enough.

I'm not sure if you wanted any feedback because you didn't really ask any questions or if you were just introducing yourself. Anyway nice to meet you!! This website rockx

[decker 1]

Buddy, first get the divorce thing sorted out. Second fix the house thing. Then get on stable footing with the finances. Then start on the visa deal.

Birthdays are interesting. Linh lived in Cambodia for a while and when the family came back, VN guvmint assigned her a new birthday and her sister a new country of birth. People like to assign themselves new birthdays as well. New Years and Christmas being top choices. Just make sure the paperwork is consistent across the board.

Linh and I have 14 yrs between us. Look at the photo gallery on this site and see the age differences.

My mother in law didn't really like me at first but she thinks I walk on water now. Dad will come around when he sees you are serious. Like any other Dad.

Keep all boarding passes, itineraries, hotel receipts, phone records etc. An expanding accordion file is awesome.

Make more visits if you can.

enjoy the ride.

[Xinh_Will 1]

Buddy, first get the divorce thing sorted out. Second fix the house thing. Then get on stable footing with the finances. Then start on the visa deal.

Fair. Divorce and house are nearly finished and can't really go much faster. Got an agreement in place and just waiting in line. The house is nearly done and fully funded. I figure a month left on that--and it's gonna be FAR better than it was. Funny thing about finances--I've been doing what I've always done. Save, then travel. Repeat. But the biggest slice was the divorce. Had that house paid off. I'm comfortable--And I never figured on proving income for an alien fiancee!

Birthdays are interesting. Linh lived in Cambodia for a while and when the family came back, VN guvmint assigned her a new birthday and her sister a new country of birth. People like to assign themselves new birthdays as well. New Years and Christmas being top choices. Just make sure the paperwork is consistent across the board.

Linh and I have 14 yrs between us. Look at the photo gallery on this site and see the age differences.

Yeah, hers is Lunar new year. That's when she changes her age--but she celebrates her birthday on her birthday. Takes a while to get used to.

My mother in law didn't really like me at first but she thinks I walk on water now. Dad will come around when he sees you are serious. Like any other Dad.

Oh, dad's on board now. I've even seen him smile once or twice.

Keep all boarding passes, itineraries, hotel receipts, phone records etc. An expanding accordion file is awesome.

Make more visits if you can.

Oh, the FF miles are piling up. I'll see her every chance I can get away from work.

enjoy the ride.

[luckytxn 2,264]

You say you have a lot of red but you actually don't at the moment unless you file right away. Decker gave the best advice. Take more time and get the ducks in a row for the best possible outcome. Even with a CR1 you CAN use a cosigner but be honest and think if having a cosigner looks optimal. Since you have not filed yet and the relationship is still young then take the time to get to really know each other and in that time get the past behind and the future looking rosier.

[Xinh_Will 1]

Great to hear! We're more than willing to take time. Just want it all to go as smoothly as yours.

You say you have a lot of red but you actually don't at the moment unless you file right away. Decker gave the best advice. Take more time and get the ducks in a row for the best possible outcome. Even with a CR1 you CAN use a cosigner but be honest and think if having a cosigner looks optimal. Since you have not filed yet and the relationship is still young then take the time to get to really know each other and in that time get the past behind and the future looking rosier.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

Great to hear! We're more than willing to take time. Just want it all to go as smoothly as yours.

The only way yours would be smoother than Lucky's (comparatively) is if a CO showed up at Xinh's house and said "I heard you might be interested in a visa. I just happened to have a spare one here..."

Decker's advice sounds spot on.

The consulate in HCMC doesn't usually accept joint sponsors for K visas, but they have no choice with CR1's. That's if you decide to marry her first. Some people aren't comfortable with having to be separated after marriage while waiting out the visa process, and getting married in Vietnam is more of a pain in the rear than in the US.

Don't mean to rub any salt into your wounds, but the flight from HCMC to Da Lat is only 20 minutes. After that, it's another 20 minutes in a cab from the airport to downtown Da Lat.

My wife and step kids are also from a village outside Hue, though my wife's house is in Hue. I like Hue much more than Saigon. Less crowded, and more relaxing.

And please... don't call me Chim!

[pholy 0]

you should wait...get more evidence. mail her a homemade card if you're cheap once a month. save the receipts. get a better financial footing. get your divorce thing totally taken care of. once again, save every piece of paper, date them, put them in order. do this for a year, visit her, marry her, bang her. go apply for vietnam marriage cert while you're not banging her. go on vacation, bang her, save receipts to everything. go home to the states, begin visa process. better have a good job.

[Xinh_Will 1]

The only way yours would be smoother than Lucky's (comparatively) is if a CO showed up at Xinh's house and said "I heard you might be interested in a visa. I just happened to have a spare one here..."

Decker's advice sounds spot on.

Spot on and about what we expected. No worries there--again, it's a matter of taking time--we know that and we're prepared for it. Better than blue, blue, AP/AR, white, resubmit, etc. Wanna do it right. Seems like it'd be quicker anyway.

The consulate in HCMC doesn't usually accept joint sponsors for K visas, but they have no choice with CR1's. That's if you decide to marry her first. Some people aren't comfortable with having to be separated after marriage while waiting out the visa process, and getting married in Vietnam is more of a pain in the rear than in the US.

I think I want to get married there--I KNOW her family would appreciate it. It does look like a pain. I'll probably be doing a lot more research to make sure I can cross all the t's. Money is easy to make, but I'm worried about the three years of tax transcripts. Willing to wait, but not THAT long.

Don't mean to rub any salt into your wounds, but the flight from HCMC to Da Lat is only 20 minutes. After that, it's another 20 minutes in a cab from the airport to downtown Da Lat.

Oh, I am well aware! Did it that way on the way back. But we started in Hue, which would have *that day* required driving to Da Nang, flying to HCMC, then to Da Lat. An all day affair regardless. I figured, what's a few more hours? I was wrong. Back to Saigon by air from Da Lat was something else. Emptiest airport EVER. Got there an hour early for the flight and we were the ONLY passengers there. About 20 showed up total. Then came the announcement "Air Mekong flight #XXX is now available for boarding. Please proceed outside to the airplane immediately." Went outside-there it was-THE airplane. Bus was packed to the gills--21 hours, one meal stop, one restroom stop. But I was the most popular guy there, with a handful of old Economists, other similar mags, and...a giant bottle of dramamine. They thought I was a god for that one. I'd think it'd be more available given that it seems everybody in VN gets motion sickness.

My wife and step kids are also from a village outside Hue, though my wife's house is in Hue. I like Hue much more than Saigon. Less crowded, and more relaxing.

Saigon is just a big city. Seen 'em all over the world. Hue is a slice of heaven. Love it.

And please... don't call me Chim!

Jim, I'll never do it again. But since it's not me, it's so funny. ONCE.

[Xinh_Will 1]

you should wait...get more evidence. mail her a homemade card if you're cheap once a month. save the receipts. get a better financial footing. get your divorce thing totally taken care of. once again, save every piece of paper, date them, put them in order. do this for a year, visit her, marry her, bang her. go apply for vietnam marriage cert while you're not banging her. go on vacation, bang her, save receipts to everything. go home to the states, begin visa process. better have a good job.

I like the way you think.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

Why would you go to Da Nang? The airport in Phu Bai is much closer.

We went through Da Nang airport when we went to Da Lat, but that's because we were already in Da Nang. We went to Ba Na Hills the day before, and spent the night in Da Nang. We went to Da Nang airport around noon, flew to HCMC, and then flew to Da Lat. We were settled into our hotel and ready to hit the down before dinner time.

[san diego 407]

Student loan: I have exact same situation. My ex-wife was in Dental School taking 90% of student loan while I was doing PhD, taking here and there student loans to supplement my fellowship for living expenses. Loans were consolidated. Out of $300K, $30K where mine and $270 where hers. There is no way to separate them. You are stuck for the next 20 years wit paying your wife your portion. I have the same deal. However, what I did: I calculated my portion of the remaining principle ($25K) and just paid her up upfront. This becomes her problem if you do this and you are not stuck with monthly interaction with your ex. Just a thought.

[Dau Que 6]

Now that I've read all of your Danielle Steel style romantic novel, I'll chime in my bell. (by the way, love your story. At least if a person like you spending that much time sharing personal info with strangers on the net, I'd think you're a passionate and caring person. I can't say the same about Xinh though since I haven't heard from her.....yet)

Aren't you supposed to be financially responsible to your existing 3 kids? (child support). When Xinh finally comes over here, she might ask for her own baby. Get ready for that now. You're assuming your X would be the same nice person forever. You do realize that people are just like the weather right? One day sunshine but the next an EF5 tornado! The same thing can be applied to Xinh as well. You said Minh was angry at you for NOT complying her request to get to know her relative (meaning Minh's family won't benefit from you, a potential Visa and chance to immigrate to the US. Gee what a surprise there). Xinh has lots of relatives here (you have to assume there might be some relatives her family hasn't informed you just yet). Plus the fact her Mom was here twice. Xinh's family knows how to play the system! Sure, she makes a decent living there but that's actually scary for you. She will eventually one day in the future ask you to sell your 401K, house, whatever else and move to VN to live with her and/or family. What will you respond then? Saying no? Then you're back to square one like right now, except a few years or decades older.

Whatever you do Will, please take my 2cent advice which I learnt from one of relative "Earning/Making money is actually quite easy. Keeping what you already have is a lot harder than thought." You understand me Will?