CR1 Visa Denied at US Embassy

[El-Andalusi 7]

As an USC, you are welcome at the embassy at any time--no clue about who to address the letter to--someone else will ahve that answer.

CALL--don't write--both Senators as well as your congressman, and ask to speak to each of their people who specialize in immigration issues--it won't take long to figure out if they will be a help or not--don't be surprised if one or more of them give you a cold shoulder--there unfotunately are many who just won't extend themselves on immigration issues. You are fortunate to be in CA, however, since there is a huge immigrant population and virtually all your congressmen/senators have very active interactions with immigration issues.

I would be on the next plane !!!

My congressman already confirmed that he will be sending an e-mail to the embassy in 7-10 business days. I am working the senators.

I won't be able to fly until next month, and YES I am like on the next airplane already.

[trojam227 18]

El, you go and spend some time with your husband and try to get this off your mind for a little while. I know how gutting it is to get a denial at the embassy...we've been there. Just continue building your marriage as best you can from afar. Consider moving there for a bit if that's possible. I know I would drop everything over here and move to England if I could, but I have children, and they have a dad in the states...my conscience won't allow that. Take a breather and think later

[El-Andalusi 7]

El, you go and spend some time with your husband and try to get this off your mind for a little while. I know how gutting it is to get a denial at the embassy...we've been there. Just continue building your marriage as best you can from afar. Consider moving there for a bit if that's possible. I know I would drop everything over here and move to England if I could, but I have children, and they have a dad in the states...my conscience won't allow that. Take a breather and think later

Thank you so much, this is so kind of you to say, very encouraging. We can't wait to see each other, be together, breath, laugh, eat and just be. I wish I had to option to stay their for an extended period of time.

Wishing you all the best as well.

Blessings

[El-Andalusi 7]

I just said that, based on the facts, you have your work cut out for you. This is not an issue of evidence of a bona fide relationship, Having a bona fide relationship does not overcome fraud or misrepresentation. You have your work cut out for you avoiding one of those findings, IMO, not proving your relationship.

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Thank you for giving me a newer perspective to look at our case. I am trying to understand what it means in actuality that having a bona fide relationship does not overcome a fraud or misrepresentation. Although, I understand that the problem now lies in the matter of alledgedly having made a false statement on the application form, and now we must prove that we were not officially engaged at the time when my husband applied for the non-immigrant Visa. But this is all based on doing all of this for immigration purposes in their view, so the fundamental issue still goes back to a bona fide marriage. This is a twofold issue now, is it not?

[pushbrk 12,830]

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Thank you for giving me a newer perspective to look at our case. I am trying to understand what it means in actuality that having a bona fide relationship does not overcome a fraud or misrepresentation. Although, I understand that the problem now lies in the matter of alledgedly having made a false statement on the application form, and now we must prove that we were not officially engaged at the time when my husband applied for the non-immigrant Visa. But this is all based on doing all of this for immigration purposes in their view, so the fundamental issue still goes back to a bona fide marriage. This is a twofold issue now, is it not?

You've really got to get off this "officially engaged" business. You agreed to marry, so you are engaged. That's how the world works. That's as official as it needs to be. It isn't YOUR interpretation that matters but you might be able to avoid a finding of misrepresentation by convincingly explaining that you interpreted the question based on your own culture. Avoiding a finding of attempted visa fraud is another matter, as it appears fairly clear from your lack of either denial or explanation that he actually did attempt to circumvent the immigration laws by applying for a student visa. People improve their English skills abroad prior to immigrating all the time. Your explanation, so far, sounds like nothing more than an excuse to avoid a drawn out petition based visa process. How you address this will be critical.

When you think of a Consular officer, you'll be wise to avoid the assumption it's their first day in school or "on the job". They understand both how the world works and how the local culture works and they don't appreciate hair splitting.

Edited May 27, 2011 by pushbrk

[El-Andalusi 7]

You've really got to get off this "officially engaged" business. You agreed to marry, so you are engaged. That's how the world works. That's as official as it needs to be. It isn't YOUR interpretation that matters but you might be able to avoid a finding of misrepresentation by convincingly explaining that you interpreted the question based on your own culture. Avoiding a finding of attempted visa fraud is another matter, as it appears fairly clear from your lack of either denial or explanation that he actually did attempt to circumvent the immigration laws by applying for a student visa. People improve their English skills abroad prior to immigrating all the time. Your explanation, so far, sounds like nothing more than an excuse to avoid a drawn out petition based visa process. How you address this will be critical.

When you think of a Consular officer, you'll be wise to avoid the assumption it's their first day in school or "on the job". They understand both how the world works and how the local culture works and they don't appreciate hair splitting.

===========================

You are starting to sound bitter and harsh here. Of course our interpretation counts when fighting our case, how else can we explain, defend, and or possibly appeal? We are not just trying to avoid something here, we are proving, providing evidence, and renewing our declaration of our true intentions. We will attack any false allegations. Especially that of a fraud or misrepresentation.

As to the matter of the English language. I don't know where you live, but here in the US where I live, I see and witness people come from all over the world with very little to no English knowledge at all to study English, prepare for TOEFEL tests, for work purposes in their country or to enter a US University. And I speak my husbands language(s).

In any case, thank you for trying to help. Know that YOUR time and efforts are very appreciated.

Edited May 27, 2011 by El-Andalusi

[pushbrk 12,830]

===========================

You are starting to sound bitter and harsh here. Of course our interpretation counts when fighting our case, how else can we explain, defend, and or possibly appeal? We are not just trying to avoid something here, we are proving, providing evidence, and renewing our declaration of our true intentions. We will attack any false allegations. Especially that of a fraud or misrepresentation.

As to the matter of the English language. I don't know where you live, but here in the US where I live, I see and witness people come from all over the world with very little to no English knowledge at all to study English, prepare for TOEFEL tests, for work purposes in their country or to enter a US University. And I speak my husbands language(s).

In any case, thank you for trying to help. Know that YOUR time and efforts are very appreciated.

Trying to get your attention. If you are noting my replies seem more harsh, it is because I'm not getting through to you. You are still grasping at straws. Of course your argument with regard to studying English is plausible. Unfortunately, the argument that you two were attempting to circumvent immigration laws is even more plausible. You see, they expect your spouse to deal with improving his English AFTER he properly immigrates to the USA. Your husband had immigrant intent. The reason the DS156 asks about a fiancee in the USA is to assist in determining the likelihood the applicant has immigrant intent. Your husband DID have immigrant intent when he applied for the student visa. It was turned down for lack of ties to his home country. Had he been truthful about your relationship, it would have been turned down as well and for essentially the same reason. However, the difference is that, in their eyes, he would have accurately and truthfully answered the questions on the application instead of parsing the meaning of "fiancee".

For perspective, many fiancees and spouses of US Citizens immigrate to the USA with little to no English skills. We see it every day. It wouldn't surprise me if your husband's English skill TODAY exceeds that of my own wife who immigrated in 2006.

Yes, I'm familiar with students coming to the USA to study English for the purposes you mention. I'm am SO familiar with it that our niece from China has been here with us since December doing exactly that, with the hopes of attending a University here in the Fall. Her brother should arrive for the same purpose in August. The difference is that they are respectively 20 and 18, you know, the age and circumstance of a "student". They haven't agreed to marry anybody in the USA.

Given all of the above, you should be aware that even if you convince them there was neither fraud or misrepresentation in the student visa application, they may still conclude that the failed attempt was then followed by marriage and this immigration attempt, was exclusively to immigrate rather than a bona fide relationship. So yes, you'll want to be prepared to convince them your relationship is genuine. The problem is that this is a two-edged sword. The more you convince them you have a history of a serious relationship, the more it looks like he fraudulently applied for a student visa.

[Done--Really 331]

pushbrk is correct--sometimes we have to be more forceful to get someone's attention--you have a tough situation, and you have to have a clear head--seems like you are close, but not quite there since the bad news is so fresh--we'll keep leaning on you until you are mentally prepared to look at things ONLY thru the eyes of a CO, and then you can honestly look at your options.

For example, maybe you are harboring a fair amount of guilt over the student visa thing since it was your idea, and you need to face that before you can move ahead--just face it, and tell hubby you are sorry, and then get on with your life and see if you can get thru this without too much damage.

Edited May 27, 2011 by magical

[saleem maria 6]

1 where is ur pregnancy report ?

2 how much time u spent together?

3 y ur husband filed a student visa instead of k1 finance visa?

U BATTER GO TO IMMIGRATION LAWYER TO SAVE UR TIME AND MONEY.

WISH U BEST OF LUCK...

[Done--Really 331]

Saleem has a point to be sure--most of the cases on VJ are do it yourself, but this one may require a lawyer--if you do contact a lawyer, ask how many times they have handled something like this--way too many lawyers who do standard immigration law have no idea when it comes to something off the beaten path, so you need to be 100% sure that you aren't the first time they have gone down this path--worst thing in the world to use your $$ to pay them to learn about a new part of the law

[El-Andalusi 7]

Trying to get your attention. If you are noting my replies seem more harsh, it is because I'm not getting through to you. You are still grasping at straws. Of course your argument with regard to studying English is plausible. Unfortunately, the argument that you two were attempting to circumvent immigration laws is even more plausible. You see, they expect your spouse to deal with improving his English AFTER he properly immigrates to the USA. Your husband had immigrant intent. The reason the DS156 asks about a fiancee in the USA is to assist in determining the likelihood the applicant has immigrant intent. Your husband DID have immigrant intent when he applied for the student visa. It was turned down for lack of ties to his home country. Had he been truthful about your relationship, it would have been turned down as well and for essentially the same reason. However, the difference is that, in their eyes, he would have accurately and truthfully answered the questions on the application instead of parsing the meaning of "fiancee".

For perspective, many fiancees and spouses of US Citizens immigrate to the USA with little to no English skills. We see it every day. It wouldn't surprise me if your husband's English skill TODAY exceeds that of my own wife who immigrated in 2006.

Yes, I'm familiar with students coming to the USA to study English for the purposes you mention. I'm am SO familiar with it that our niece from China has been here with us since December doing exactly that, with the hopes of attending a University here in the Fall. Her brother should arrive for the same purpose in August. The difference is that they are respectively 20 and 18, you know, the age and circumstance of a "student". They haven't agreed to marry anybody in the USA.

Given all of the above, you should be aware that even if you convince them there was neither fraud or misrepresentation in the student visa application, they may still conclude that the failed attempt was then followed by marriage and this immigration attempt, was exclusively to immigrate rather than a bona fide relationship. So yes, you'll want to be prepared to convince them your relationship is genuine. The problem is that this is a two-edged sword. The more you convince them you have a history of a serious relationship, the more it looks like he fraudulently applied for a student visa.

==================================

We know we have not misrepresented anything. Alright now, let's just say you are getting through to me with your explanation, what would you suggest I (USC) do immediately?

[El-Andalusi 7]

1 where is ur pregnancy report ?

2 how much time u spent together?

3 y ur husband filed a student visa instead of k1 finance visa?

U BATTER GO TO IMMIGRATION LAWYER TO SAVE UR TIME AND MONEY.

WISH U BEST OF LUCK...

1) Pregnancy report? What do you mean???

He field a student visa before because the plan was to have him improve his English for the summer and return home. We Did not file a K1 Visa at that time because he was NOT my fiance, neither in our eyes, nor in the eyes of his parents or mine (that's how it is in our culture).

Saleem has a point to be sure--most of the cases on VJ are do it yourself, but this one may require a lawyer--if you do contact a lawyer, ask how many times they have handled something like this--way too many lawyers who do standard immigration law have no idea when it comes to something off the beaten path, so you need to be 100% sure that you aren't the first time they have gone down this path--worst thing in the world to use your $ to pay them to learn about a new part of the law

=====================

It just beats me up reading our case is off the beaten path... outchy! Definitely looking for a lawyer who specializes in these issues.

[El-Andalusi 7]

pushbrk is correct--sometimes we have to be more forceful to get someone's attention--you have a tough situation, and you have to have a clear head--seems like you are close, but not quite there since the bad news is so fresh--we'll keep leaning on you until you are mentally prepared to look at things ONLY thru the eyes of a CO, and then you can honestly look at your options.

For example, maybe you are harboring a fair amount of guilt over the student visa thing since it was your idea, and you need to face that before you can move ahead--just face it, and tell hubby you are sorry, and then get on with your life and see if you can get thru this without too much damage.

===========================

Yes, you got that right. I have been feeling (still) very guilty in talking him into coming here to work on his English in a proper way by going to a summer school. My husband is a classical musician and had concerts coming up in so many places in the fall of that year, so he was definitely going back. He has such a good life living right on the Mediterranean coast, with his fishing boat parked outside, plus he is very family oriented the whole family lives there, best friends, his music studio, his students,... I had to convince him to live in the US when we got married... because of my kind of life here.... Anyyyywayyyyyy, we talked about it, of course I apologized like a million of times and he can't hear it anymore he does not see it that way at all. But I do and I am digesting it slowly and moving on as quickly as possible... Just trying to put together a good plan a much better one now!

[Done--Really 331]

Misrep cases can be devastating, and they are off the beaten path relative to eeverything else you see on VJ--if you want to see cases that are heart breakers, go to www.immigrate2us.net and you will see how plain vanilla things are here. But even misrep cases can be handled without a lawyer, and at the other site, cases that seem impossible at first are oftentimes solved.

Now, no one here is suggesting you misrep'd anything, and I think you are getting the hang of it that what you and we think matters little--it's all in the eye of the CO. Zip over to the other site and post everything about your case and see if someone who has had direct expereicne can help. There is also a list of lawyers over there that you can absolutely trust, and some of them do free or very inexpensive consults

[pushbrk 12,830]

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We know we have not misrepresented anything. Alright now, let's just say you are getting through to me with your explanation, what would you suggest I (USC) do immediately?

What you need to do immediately is stop already with the denial phase. It doesn't matter what you know. It matters what a Consular officer thinks of the facts before them. I would hire an immigration lawyer with specific experience with your kind of case (dealing with findings of misrepresentation) share ALL the facts candidly with them and follow their advice. You have a very serious situation on your hands.