The state of the ME/NA forum

[Veiled Princess 1]

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[Together4ever 1]

VP.... ssshhh... let it go. You're still feeding.

[Veiled Princess 1]

VP.... ssshhh... let it go. You're still feeding.

Am I the only one not allowed to comment?

[chiquita 0]

Things are spinning out of control. it takes alot to appolize sometimes. but, I am trying my best

to do that. even if it means nothing right now to those I have treaded on and hurt. I am moving forward.

if somthing happend to me. I really dont want a reputation of something I am not. tears flow

when I type this this is all ####### i wish it could stop we all could be friends of not then at least be civil.

I weep because, I know full well this is not how you ladies are. you all enjoy nice things and have

loving hearts -please please let it shine...

Shon you are quite a woman!!!!

You have started a process that I hope leads to a better forum here.

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Many huggies}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}} to you my dear!!!

It can take time to heal, so we will give the time.

As it has been said time and time again, this immigration process is not easy on anyone going through it. I know the nightmare first hand. This is what bonds us together here. We all know how others may judge us. This is even more reason to stick together and not let outsiders destroy what was was here. Who knows the battle we go through but us? Who understands the dicrimination better than ourselves? We are our own worst enimies if we left others destroy what friendships and bonds that were made here.

If everyone wants that back, forgiveness must start here so healing can take place. Blame must go. Start afresh.

I so appreciate you Shon for the bold step you took today...bravo and much applause to you for your humbleness and humility this day.

chi

[~kiyah~ 14]

Shukran for starting this thread...these are the very reasons I do not come here very often anymore. I so do not want to be a part of something so negative...this process is negative enough without coming here to experience it.

I have been a member here for well over a year since we started our own visa process and we have lost so many great members not only of VJ, but this very forum because of this issue, and it is sad. I have seen many come and go...afraid to post for fear of being lashed at or someone just being plain mean to them. Some people did not get the information they needed because they could not bring themselves to post or even read anymore. Now that to me truly is the saddest part of this.

These are great people who have great experiences and information to share with others going through this process...the whole reason we are here to begin with.

I really do wish everyone could get along...if there is something nasty going on, take it offline and out of this forum where it does not belong. There have been a couple of issues I myself have taken offline and rightly so. I refuse to air it for the entire world to read, it's just not right.

Ignoring has worked for me in the past, but it really is sometimes hard to see what is going on and not respond to it...especially when you see it happening to someone you know and hold dear to your heart. I have bitten my own tongue many times, it has really tested my will to keep my own mouth shut on many occasions.

Shon, you really are a wonderful woman, I happen to know you truly are a sister...that to me is worth more than words. Stay true sister.

Thank you again for starting this thread, hopefully the wave will continue to grow and this forum can finally be reclaimed for it's intended purpose...helping those of us immigrating our loved ones from North Africa and the Middle East.

~Kiyah~

[Ban Hammer 13,293]

some of you can blame me for the dissent here within mena, that's all fine and wonderful. however, i'm not the one telling secrets between mena members am i? IMO trying to blame any problems on "outsiders" is just shifting the blame and removes the requirement of each member from owning up to their share of the blame pie. i don't cause shannon to bicker with icey. type2 does not cause icey to bicker with shannon, and so on and so forth. got the picture yet? so you can either continue to blame the "outsiders" or you can take a long hard look at your own interactions with other mena members, which IMO is the root cause of this latest round of drama.

i come to mena not just for the drama, unlike some other vj members. i've got quite a bit of respect for a few of it's members, primarily szsz and jmagayreh, and i've learned a few things about islam along the way. as for why mena is so interesting to "outsiders" perhaps the drama within its members causes that. no one can wreck mena but yourselves.........think about that.

i'm sure a few of you will barf that i've mentioned szsz as being worthy of respect. and you'll continue to blame me and other "outsiders" for the problems within mena. so be it. my advice: before you go off on a rampage at another mena member about some slight, real or imagined, consider how it looks to someone who is not muslim - it certainly does not reflect positively on the image of islam.

[Donna A 4]

i think all of vj needs a make over...not just the mena one. there are alot of crappy things going on. sure has changed since ive become a member.

[babybunny 2]

I dont know what an " outsider " is. maybe its me. my husband is not from the middle east. but, we are muslim family that is one reason why I came to this thread. I thought at somepoint to learn things from the ladies here. I have learned somethings. Rhama at one point was posting helpful links. pictures, DVD, fashion links, etc.... I hope she keep posting things like this for us all to share. .btw, I have ordered a few things such as the DVDs....

Edited September 9, 2006 by babybunny

[Together4ever 1]

some of you can blame me for the dissent here within mena, that's all fine and wonderful. however, i'm not the one telling secrets between mena members am i? IMO trying to blame any problems on "outsiders" is just shifting the blame and removes the requirement of each member from owning up to their share of the blame pie. i don't cause shannon to bicker with icey. type2 does not cause icey to bicker with shannon, and so on and so forth. got the picture yet? so you can either continue to blame the "outsiders" or you can take a long hard look at your own interactions with other mena members, which IMO is the root cause of this latest round of drama.

i come to mena not just for the drama, unlike some other vj members. i've got quite a bit of respect for a few of it's members, primarily szsz and jmagayreh, and i've learned a few things about islam along the way. as for why mena is so interesting to "outsiders" perhaps the drama within its members causes that. no one can wreck mena but yourselves.........think about that.

i'm sure a few of you will barf that i've mentioned szsz as being worthy of respect. and you'll continue to blame me and other "outsiders" for the problems within mena. so be it. my advice: before you go off on a rampage at another mena member about some slight, real or imagined, consider how it looks to someone who is not muslim - it certainly does not reflect positively on the image of islam.

Charles, I hope you didn't take what I said as anything personal. It wasn't my intention at all. As I said, many from here have messaged me today expressing their wishes for things to heal and to be okay again and I was trying, maybe wrongly, to just let the dust settle for them.

I will continue to refrain from naming names, but YES there are indeed some individuals from this forum that just simply do not "get it". You certainly aren't one of them. There are others, as you yourself mentioned, that are deserving of respect.

You didn't cause any of the problems here and I think anyone who would even being to imply such a thing has just plain been asleep at the wheel. Really, we all caused the problems. We just want to fix them.

The only thing I can offer that is sometimes when some people are obviously angry and in pain, it just adds fuel to the fire to ridiculed and mocked from the sidelines.

I rarely went outside of this forum because of the kindredship here. I hope we can get it back. Would be cool to include you too. Who knows, might add some needed balance.

[chiquita 0]

I dont know what an " outsider " is. maybe its me. my husband is not from the middle east. but, we are muslim family that is one reason why I came to this thread. I thought at somepoint to learn things from the ladies here. I have learned somethings. Rhama at one point was posting helpful links. pictures, DVD, fashion links, etc.... I hope she keep posting things like this for us all to share. .btw, I have ordered a few things such as the DVDs....

To me an outsider is someone who is here to cause trouble...ie the TROLLS. Otherwise no one else is an outsider. I mean who would want to come here and cause problems other than "outsiders" ie... TROLLS?

chi

[tnh9479 1]

What ever happened to the idea of living by the golden rule?

Saddened and perplexed by the lack of maturity of some,

Twila

[UmmSqueakster 54]

What ever happened to the idea of living by the golden rule?

Saddened and perplexed by the lack of maturity of some,

Twila

If I have a simple, non religious mantra that I try to live by, it's this - if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. There are plenty of religious sentiments that say the same thing, but that's the non-denom version.

I cringe from conflict, run away and hide under the bed covers. Ask my husband, he'll tell you how hard I avoid getting into even political debates anymore. It's a scary world out there, and we all need some calm.

That's my contribution to the thread. *waves*

Edited September 9, 2006 by rahma

[Fandango 1,439]

I wish you all the luck in the world....people can disagree and say as much without being downright spiteful or betraying each other.

Tensions run high cos we're all without our partners, and sometimes we all need a step back and a deep breath!

[Veiled Princess 1]

not posting it twice

[Sofiyya 1,687]

The moving finger writes and having writ, moves on. Not all your piety nor wit can call it back to cancel half a line, nor all your tears wipe out one word of it. From The Rubiyat of Omar Khayaam

i'm sure a few of you will barf that i've mentioned szsz as being worthy of respect.

I'm sure there will be too, but I've been spat on, shot at, jailed, and worse, so a little lip from someone on the net doesn't faze me at all. Personally, other than outsiders coming here to start trouble, I think that what adds to the tensions is how some folks like to dish it out, but don't like to take it. I can take it, I don't run from conflict, so I make no apologies for defending Islam or my own character when need be. I have no doubt that there are some who dislike me for that, but that's their problem, not mine.

As for the subject of trying to get everyone to be nice, forget it. There are cheering sections, and I have noticed that no matter how assinine a comment someone may make, there seems to always be someone who seconds it coz it's their buddy who says it. Frankly, I've lived long enough to know that one person's "not nice" is another's "simple, inpersonal statement of fact", and no more.

It's amazing how quickly some take personal offense to just about anything and expect you to acquiese to their unreasonable demands to stop the discussion because it bothers them rather than walking away if they dont want to participate. I even started a thread about that. There is a limit to taking responsibility for how another person interprets your statement or how easily their feelings are hurt. At some point, the responsibility is theirs for how they CHOOSE to react.

Not all of us post the same way or for the same reasons. Some of us like substance and others prefer niceities. And, yes, there is a lack of debating skills that those of us who like substance cannot be responsible for when a participant is lacking them. There is an old adage in law that when the facts are against you, argue the law; when the law's against you, argue the facts; when there both against you, just yell like hell! There's a lot of yelling like hell in the debates because some of us run out of substance but are loathe to let go.

Each of us indeed must take responsibility for what we post, but we also need to take responsibility for what we read.

"Morality is doing what is right, regardless of what we are told. Religious dogma is doing what we are told, no matter what is right."

Edited September 9, 2006 by szsz