Change in willingness to bear arms ...

[Szilvia74 3]

Hi All,

Finally I have the date of my oath ceremony (YEESS and I can even make it)!

I am just wondering if anyone here answered yes to this question: "Has there been any change in your willingness to bear arms on behalf of the

United States;"

As far as I understand it is not a big issue but I would like to hear from anyone who has any experience with this.

Thanks a lot!

[DeeBee 1]

Hi All,

Finally I have the date of my oath ceremony (YEESS and I can even make it)!

I am just wondering if anyone here answered yes to this question: "Has there been any change in your willingness to bear arms on behalf of the

United States;"

As far as I understand it is not a big issue but I would like to hear from anyone who has any experience with this.

Thanks a lot!

You'd be unwilling to bear arms if the United States was under attack?

[NickD 202]

Sure was a big issue with my wife, neighbor army major came over and we had a round table discussion on this issue. During WW II, draft age was increased to 35 years of age, but strictly for males, females were exempt, she is a female. And don't tell her I told you this, she is over 35 years of age. During the Viet Nam "police action", never was a declared war, maximum age for males was 26 years of age.

In our nuclear age, handing her a musket to shoot down a missile is not much protection, but at least its something, and no longer discrimination between "innocent civilians and military. If an enemy does come here, anyone will be shot. If that happens, wouldn't be nice to have a single shot 22? She did agree to that, but as far as putting her in a remote front line, extremely unlikely. Even at that, if in the military, less than 10% of the troops are actually involved in combat. My neighbors wife was shipped to Iraq, she is a physicians assistant, but served in a well guard compound, she is in the national guard.

My stepdaughter has no issue with this, but she likes to kick butt, but again the odds are so thin, will never be called. If she was, the rest of us will volunteer to defend, maybe not our country, nor our president, but certainly our family.

I really don't feel this is an issue, but over 60 million people were killed during WW II and practically none of them had weapons to defend themselves. If we were in that situation, all of us will be glad to have some kind of weapon. I would like to have an F-22 loaded with nuclear bombs, how about you?

[Szilvia74 3]

I just asked if anyone has any experience with this (I still don't know how I want to answer).

To answer your question: I think I need to know more information on the attack/situation before I bear those arms. Politics is complicated ya' know.

You'd be unwilling to bear arms if the United States was under attack?

[Szilvia74 3]

Thanks Nick. I have no problem with using a weapon but I would only bear arms if I agree with the cause. I would like to have a choice. If I say I have a "willingness to bear arms on behalf of the United States" I take it it means I need to help defend the country whatever the reason is.

I am a woman and also probably would be over the age limit for drafting. But in a way it doesn't matter. To me the question is more theoretical: Am I really willing to bear arms on behalf of the United States in any circumstances?

Sure was a big issue with my wife, neighbor army major came over and we had a round table discussion on this issue. During WW II, draft age was increased to 35 years of age, but strictly for males, females were exempt, she is a female. And don't tell her I told you this, she is over 35 years of age. During the Viet Nam "police action", never was a declared war, maximum age for males was 26 years of age.

In our nuclear age, handing her a musket to shoot down a missile is not much protection, but at least its something, and no longer discrimination between "innocent civilians and military. If an enemy does come here, anyone will be shot. If that happens, wouldn't be nice to have a single shot 22? She did agree to that, but as far as putting her in a remote front line, extremely unlikely. Even at that, if in the military, less than 10% of the troops are actually involved in combat. My neighbors wife was shipped to Iraq, she is a physicians assistant, but served in a well guard compound, she is in the national guard.

My stepdaughter has no issue with this, but she likes to kick butt, but again the odds are so thin, will never be called. If she was, the rest of us will volunteer to defend, maybe not our country, nor our president, but certainly our family.

I really don't feel this is an issue, but over 60 million people were killed during WW II and practically none of them had weapons to defend themselves. If we were in that situation, all of us will be glad to have some kind of weapon. I would like to have an F-22 loaded with nuclear bombs, how about you?

[DeeBee 1]

I think you might be over thinking it... Besides, if you already have your oath scheduled, then you already told an immigration officer that you'd be willing to bear arms when you were interviewed.

Edited May 4, 2011 by DeeBee

[Szilvia74 3]

That is why the question "Has there been any change in your willingness to bear arms on behalf of the

United States".

Again I am just wondering if anyone here has any experience with this...

I think you might be over thinking it... Besides, if you already have your oath scheduled, then you already told an immigration officer that you'd be willing to bear arms when you were interviewed.

[DeeBee 1]

OK... lol

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

I like the way you think. But . . .

part of the Oath of Allegiance is to give up any loyalty to your former country of residence. So, taken seriously, and it should be taken seriously, if the US and Italy were at war with one another (as it was the case not too long ago when Hitler and Mussolini were big buddies), would you be willing to go to Italy and place an atomic bomb (happened in Japan, not too long ago) in your former home town?

You have to swear that you'd be willing to do that, if your country asks you to do that, you understand that, don't you? And as somebody with perfect Italian skills, knowledge of Italy and the Italian life, you are a perfect candidate for such an important mission!

Now keep on talking about bearing arms. Talk all you want. Discuss it with your family, your priest, Rabbi or Imam. At the end it comes down to this: either you take the Oath of Allegiance, and do that in a way that you can sleep at night, or you are not really committed on being a US citizen, come hell or high water. Nobody can look inside your head, but what they can do is point out what you did, and what you signed, under oath (sorry, but I have to point that out again).

Let's just hope that we never have a war again. Doesn't mean it can't happen though . . .

[spookyturtle 9,465]

I like the way you think. But . . .

part of the Oath of Allegiance is to give up any loyalty to your former country of residence. So, taken seriously, and it should be taken seriously, if the US and Italy were at war with one another (as it was the case not too long ago when Hitler and Mussolini were big buddies), would you be willing to go to Italy and place an atomic bomb (happened in Japan, not too long ago) in your former home town?

You have to swear that you'd be willing to do that, if your country asks you to do that, you understand that, don't you? And as somebody with perfect Italian skills, knowledge of Italy and the Italian life, you are a perfect candidate for such an important mission!

Now keep on talking about bearing arms. Talk all you want. Discuss it with your family, your priest, Rabbi or Imam. At the end it comes down to this: either you take the Oath of Allegiance, and do that in a way that you can sleep at night, or you are not really committed on being a US citizen, come hell or high water. Nobody can look inside your head, but what they can do is point out what you did, and what you signed, under oath (sorry, but I have to point that out again).

Let's just hope that we never have a war again. Doesn't mean it can't happen though . . .

Isn't she from Hungary?

Edited May 5, 2011 by spookyturtle

[NickD 202]

Thanks Nick. I have no problem with using a weapon but I would only bear arms if I agree with the cause. I would like to have a choice. If I say I have a "willingness to bear arms on behalf of the United States" I take it it means I need to help defend the country whatever the reason is.

I am a woman and also probably would be over the age limit for drafting. But in a way it doesn't matter. To me the question is more theoretical: Am I really willing to bear arms on behalf of the United States in any circumstances?

Certainly makes you wonder about the leadership of this country, was a very anti-war country before WW II, that war really changed our leadership to where we now possess 46% of the worlds weaponry and enough nuclear power to blow the entire world apart ten time over.

I was born when we had a draft in this country, but ways to get around that, like about 70% of my high school class got married, even before graduation and knocked up their wifes'. Guess the military doesn't want the extra burden of providing additional money to dependents, so they were exempt. Didn't have a rich old man or even an old man for that matter to send me to Harvard, a good way for the likes of Clinton and Bush to avoid the draft, but yet these AH's were running this country. Can say the same thing about the guy running this country today and sending our kids to a war I feel very strongly against. Other choices was to run up to Canada, but I gather you need a passport to do that today. My choice was simple, didn't have the couple of bucks to get married, but could decline and go to jail. So I wonder how legal my oath was when I was forced to say it.

Then we were brainwashed, one reason why they like young stupid kids that are easy to brainwash, that we were fighting communism. That was a load of #######, we were fighting dictatorships. Today, claim we are fighting for democracy for countries that don't even want it, can only question our own democracy. This doesn't make me a traitor to this country, I was born here and had to fight for it. I feel the real traitors to this country is our leadership, they can go to hell as far as I am concerned. Not only the wars they got us involved in where history tells us they didn't accomplished a single damn thing, but loaded up our overcrowded VA hospitals for those unlucky enough not to get killed. With a firm believe our government contractors are running this country.

Never thought our country would be sold out to countries that caused us a lot of damage and killed two of my uncles, but that is exactly what is happening. Plus exporting our jobs and our communications industry to foreigners, what a bunch of hypocrites we have running this country and Obama is no exception. And he getting us involved in another war without even consulting congress first. Thought we had a constitution to stop things like this.

Was sure an outrage during the Viet Nam era where many Americans spoke out against things like this, but mainly because of the draft. So they killed that, but no or very little Americans are speaking up about what is going on today.

There was one exception back then that I think still exists today, and that was to become a conscientious objector. This doesn't mean you would be free of the draft, will still have to serve, but not be directly involved with the actual killing. I wasn't one of those, but met many guys that were. Maybe they had more sense than me.

I cringe whenever I rent a DVD and see Sony's name plastered all over the place, even more when shopping with my wife seeing clothes made in Viet Nam. Even more after many of our men were killed defending China when the Japanese killed over 25 million of them, then they shortly joined up with Stalin, another terrible dictator.

So you want to be an American? Go for it, and speak your voice against these atrocities, your fellow Americans aren't doing it, too busy trying to make ends meet or watching a football game. Ironic that we have a congress that all votes the way their party wants them to, would think at least one guy would deviate from his party. A democracy can only succeed if its citizens take an active part in it, that sure went down the toilet.

Then we have become a country of greed where only 400 of the richest families own over half of this country. And a dictatorship with the creation of over 1,500 agencies over the last 40 years that have full dictatorial power my congressman is not even aware of. We don't need change, we merely have to go back to the way we were.

our country is involved in.

[Udella&Wiz 325]

To the original OP - I think you've established that there is no one with experience but everyone certainly has an opinion!

Here's how I will think of it - I will take the oath, but I have no intention of ever picking up a gun (unless someone breaks into my house,sets it on fire & is raping my daughter and my husband doesn't have the gun already ) I also don't think it will ever be necessary...I can be involved in defending the country without holding a gun in my hand in some other capacity. Trust me - I am the least competent person to be holding a gun defending anything - they'll recognize that I am not their candidate.

Considering that US born citizens never had to promise this - why am I worried about it? Remind me to join an anti-gun group the day after I get citizenship

Enough said - don't anyone even bother to get riled up about what I've said please

[Helen Louise Pile 80]

I like the way you think. But . . .

part of the Oath of Allegiance is to give up any loyalty to your former country of residence. So, taken seriously, and it should be taken seriously......

.........At the end it comes down to this: either you take the Oath of Allegiance, and do that in a way that you can sleep at night, or you are not really committed on being a US citizen, come hell or high water. Nobody can look inside your head, but what they can do is point out what you did, and what you signed, under oath (sorry, but I have to point that out again).

Let's just hope that we never have a war again. Doesn't mean it can't happen though . . .

Couldn't agree more. I have had people tell me 'You can have dual nationality' but when I argue that the 'Oath of Allegiance states...' they shake their head and say it doesn't matter.

It does matter. Why promise something and commit to a country if you are not actually committing to that country. Madness.

I have no idea if I will become a US citizen in the future, I have only been here 6 months. I am happy to have my PR status and to remain a citizen of the UK. If I ever DO decide to become a citizen though....it will be wholeheartedly, not just for paperwork.

Thanks for posting this Bob.

[Harsh_77 718]

To the original OP - I think you've established that there is no one with experience but everyone certainly has an opinion!

Here's how I will think of it - I will take the oath, but I have no intention of ever picking up a gun (unless someone breaks into my house,sets it on fire & is raping my daughter and my husband doesn't have the gun already ) I also don't think it will ever be necessary...I can be involved in defending the country without holding a gun in my hand in some other capacity. Trust me - I am the least competent person to be holding a gun defending anything - they'll recognize that I am not their candidate.

Considering that US born citizens never had to promise this - why am I worried about it? Remind me to join an anti-gun group the day after I get citizenship

Enough said - don't anyone even bother to get riled up about what I've said please

In case of the US born citizen this is their home country, for lot of immigrants who were born in other country and then moved here and decided to be Citizen of US, they still have some affiliation to the country of their birth.

This clause is more like in case if US was in need – you as an individual would be willing to do everything for US.

I don’t see it as bear arms means you literally have to hold a gun and shoot someone…..lol

I see it more of you would be doing everything in your capacity to protect US.

[Casprd 167]

Certainly makes you wonder about the leadership of this country, was a very anti-war country before WW II, that war really changed our leadership to where we now possess 46% of the worlds weaponry and enough nuclear power to blow the entire world apart ten time over.

Completely off topic, but in the almost 70 years since WW2, we have been in 5 wars. In the 90 or so years preceding WW2, we (the US) were in 4 wars. Neither count includes all the small actions where we sent troops but no war was declared. Hasn't changed a whole lot.

Back on topic now. As for the willingness to bare arms question, I think you would have to have a good explanation as to why it has changed also. Otherwise the impression will be that the beneficiary just gave the answer that the IO wanted to hear previously so to speak. If the willingness has in fact changed, then best to answer honestly and be prepared to explain why.