The Greatest Story Ever Told:

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

Oh, so it's not the Republicans that have happily sold treasuries to the SS trust fund and spent that money. The Republicans wouldn't ever think of any such thing. Maybe you need to go back and look more closely at the fiscal conservatism practiced - not preached - over there on the right.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Think about that for awhile. Your argument is essentially that SS excess contributions went into general revenue - i.e. they were used to boost federal revenues. Think back 10 years when these revenues suddenly came in line with the expenditures. What happened? Yes, other revenues were decreased and that decrease was very top-heavy. Naturally, as these excesses dry up and actually turn into a funding requirement, rather than saying that the funds are not recoverable (which is what Krauthammer suggests here), I'd say what was true then ought to be true now. They need to be recovered with other revenues and I'd like to see those revenues being raised in the very same manner as they were decreased a decade ago.

So, you think we should raise taxes. See, it wasn't that hard to admit, was it?

Edited March 14, 2011 by Some Old Guy

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

So, you think we should raise taxes. See, it wasn't that hard to admit, was it?

Well, yes. There isn't going to be any way around it. We'll keep pretending for a few more years that there is but eventually, the numbers will speak so loud that nobody can ignore it. Not that they're not speaking loud enough already but apparently there national hearing is in pretty bad shape.

[SMR 368]

Certainly it's not honest and straightforward to declare that the SS trust-fund is worthless. It is owed money by the general treasury and that can be redeemed. At the same time, it's not honest and straightforward to ignore the fact that the redemption of those bonds will be a significant sink for tax dollars in the coming years. And in a time when serious cuts or serious tax hikes or probably both are on the table, it doesn't make sense for SS to get a pass. There are no easy answers but we shouldn't start by making huge chunks off limits.

I also think it's misleading to point to how we should get rid of Warren Buffet's check. Maybe we should, but it's not really going to put much of a dent in anything. How many ridiculously rich people are really out there? Add it up and you'll get a couple million (maybe $10 or $20 million) in SS checks a year. That doesn't account for much in a game of hundreds of billions.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Certainly it's not honest and straightforward to declare that the SS trust-fund is worthless. It is owed money by the general treasury and that can be redeemed. At the same time, it's not honest and straightforward to ignore the fact that the redemption of those bonds will be a significant sink for tax dollars in the coming years. And in a time when serious cuts or serious tax hikes or probably both are on the table, it doesn't make sense for SS to get a pass. There are no easy answers but we shouldn't start by making huge chunks off limits.

Decades of hidden borrowing are coming to an end. We'll see more clearly what the real gap between revenues and expenditures is now that there isn't any excess SS contributions to be had - rising deficits show clearly that some revenue source is not keeping up. All the illusions that have been built on this ficticous "revenue" are coming down. The policies enacted on the basis of these "revenues" which were really borrowed funds all along need to be revisited. As major tax cuts were bulit on the supposition that funds borrowed from SS aren't really loans should be taken back - voila, 3.7 trillion dollars raised over 10 years. More than we owe the SS trust fund. Then there need to be discussions on contributions and benefits of the program to stabilize it for decades to come. We've done this in the 80's and it was no other than the Gipper who did not shy away from raising contribution levels (taxes) and the retirement age in order to ensure that SS would be around and solvent for many more decades.