Sidewalks pit neighbor against neighbor

[Obama 2012 1,714]

That's your problem. You are a deviant among inherently social animals. May I suggest a cave or perhaps an isolated island somewhere?

my misanthropy has nothing to do with being anti-social.

I just don't see a reason to help people who won't help themselves or those who use/abuse the help they are given.

See the idea of socialism and a socialist society is great. It's the idea that everyone pulls his or her own weight for an overall common cause. This only works though however when it's voluntary and between a specific group of people who want to participate.

By forcing everyone to participate into certain things, you create a situation where some do their fair share, some work harder than others, and then some take advantage of the benefits, but don't ever lift a finger.

I have no intention of worrying about helping people outside of my own close group of family/friends for that precise reason.

[^_^ 5,021]

Right, but family is immediate and close. Society is not.

I don't giving a flying rats ####### about the moron next to me in the checkout line at the grocery store.

I care about him a little. If he appeared to have a heart attack, I'd call 9-1-1 for him. If he's carrying his young daughter and drops something, I'd pick it up for him. But if he asks me for a dollar I'll pretend I didn't hear him. If he smells bad, I may even change checkout lanes.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

my misanthropy has nothing to do with being anti-social.

I just don't see a reason to help people who won't help themselves or those who use/abuse the help they are given.

See the idea of socialism and a socialist society is great. It's the idea that everyone pulls his or her own weight for an overall common cause. This only works though however when it's voluntary and between a specific group of people who want to participate.

By forcing everyone to participate into certain things, you create a situation where some do their fair share, some work harder than others, and then some take advantage of the benefits, but don't ever lift a finger.

I have no intention of worrying about helping people outside of my own close group of family/friends for that precise reason.

Your Rando-Libertarian mind tricks don't work on me. No one forces you to be a USC (that I'm aware of). You are free to find a better arrangement somewhere else, but don't expect to enjoy the benefit of being a USC and not paying taxes.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Your Rando-Libertarian mind tricks don't work on me. No one forces you to be a USC (that I'm aware of). You are free to find a better arrangement somewhere else, but don't expect to enjoy the benefit of being a USC and not paying taxes.

We're not talking 'federal' taxes here when it comes to sidewalks/local streets....

I care about him a little. If he appeared to have a heart attack, I'd call 9-1-1 for him. If he's carrying his young daughter and drops something, I'd pick it up for him. But if he asks me for a dollar I'll pretend I didn't hear him. If he smells bad, I may even change checkout lanes.

yeah and most people including myself would as well, we're not talking about 'that' kind of 'caring' though.

[^_^ 5,021]

No one forces you to be a USC (that I'm aware of).

Is that honest? When you are born in the U.S., the Federal Government automatically considers you a USC. By merely bring born (which you had no choice in) you are suddenly on the hook for taxes, selective service registration, etc.

And yes, one could simply move but that simply makes the point. If you wishe to escape obligations being imposed on you, you have to leave. That's the whole point Paul is (I believe) trying to make.

yeah and most people including myself would as well, we're not talking about 'that' kind of 'caring' though.

There are many kinds of caring and sometimes it's those little things that matter a lot. When you say you don't care at all, you come off sounding like an a-hole which you clearly are not.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

We're not talking 'federal' taxes here when it comes to sidewalks/local streets....

Same logic applies. You are not being forced to live in your locale against your will. If you don't agree with terms, simply move elsewhere.

[^_^ 5,021]

Same logic applies. You are not being forced to live in your locale against your will. If you don't agree with terms, simply move elsewhere.

Thought experiment: Aliens invade earth tonight and take a liking to your town. You wake up tomorrow morning and you live in alien occupied territory and you are now required by law to do sexual favors for the aliens (who you are not attracted to in the least) as a condition of continuing to live where you do. You are, however, free to leave.

Coercion or no coercion?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Is that honest? When you are born in the U.S., the Federal Government automatically considers you a USC. By merely bring born (which you had no choice in) you are suddenly on the hook for taxes, selective service registration, etc.

And yes, one could simply move but that simply makes the point. If you wishe to escape obligations being imposed on you, you have to leave. That's the whole point Paul is (I believe) trying to make.

Same limitations of true choice then applies to children born in poverty. At some point, everyone must accept a certain degree of personal responsibility. As to what degree, that can be argued, but I imagine Paul, being of sound mind and body, is capable of accepting personal responsibility for where he lives.

[^_^ 5,021]

Same limitations of true choice then applies to children born in poverty.

Elaborate.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Thought experiment: Aliens invade earth tonight and take a liking to your town. You wake up tomorrow morning and you live in alien occupied territory and you are now required by law to do sexual favors for the aliens (who you are not attracted to in the least) as a condition of continuing to live where you do. You are, however, free to leave.

Coercion or no coercion?

It would depend on whether I recognized their sovereignty. I suppose if I always thought that sovereignty was null and void to begin with, even if the takeover happened centuries ago, I'd resist their authority. But even in that case, it would be either fight or flight, not sit and b!tch.

[^_^ 5,021]

It would depend on whether I recognized their sovereignty. I suppose if I always thought that sovereignty was null and void to begin with, even if the takeover happened centuries ago, I'd resist their authority. But even in that case, it would be either fight or flight, not sit and b!tch.

In your opinion, is it legitimate on your part to deny their authority?

If you answer in the affirmative, then why is it illegitimate for Paul to deny the authority of Washington DC?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Elaborate.

I mean in the context of assigning personal responsibility for ones economic status - a child born into poverty hasn't any more of choice than Paul had in being born a USC.

[^_^ 5,021]

I mean in the context of assigning personal responsibility for ones economic status - a child born into poverty hasn't any more of choice than Paul had in being born a USC.

Unless you think your right to not have your body be used by your alien overlords for sexual pleasure without remuneration is somehow the equivalent of the right of a poor inner city child to have a TV set in his room.... I don't see your point.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

I mean in the context of assigning personal responsibility for ones economic status - a child born into poverty hasn't any more of choice than Paul had in being born a USC.

Sure they do. I didn't have much growing up at all. We didn't have money for me to get what I wanted/when I wanted. I was fed and clothed, but outside of that, I was very very lucky if I ever got anything outside of a few things at Christmas.

I realized what others had and what I wanted at a young age and I actually went business to business when I was 12 years old trying to get them to hire me (even though the law wouldn't allow me to be hired until I was 14.) - I got my first job finally when I was 14 and didn't look back, because I had a choice. I could live with the hand I was dealt or I could start doing some things on my own.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

In your opinion, is it legitimate on your part to deny their authority?

If you answer in the affirmative, then why is it illegitimate for Paul to deny the authority of Washington DC?

I can actually see his point, however, like I said, it's fight or flight, not sit and b!tch. I'd hate myself if I didn't do anything about it and if I truly believed their sovereignty was null and void.