Case going back to USCIS, who do I contact?

[Love is Magic 5]

I agree. Just the one visit is what gave them 'just cause'! Casa wants many visits for long periods of time. Its tough but thats what they want to see. Speaking from experience....visit again, your K1 will probably expire before it reaches USCIS, so plan a trip and marry. As much as it seems that Casa dictates our lives and what we do, we do it for the one we love, NOT THEM!!!! Good luck, regroup, make a plan, keep on loving each other and all will work out.

[kristen_maroc 126]

I'm pretty new here, so take whatever I say with that grain of salt...

But you have to look at it through the consulate officer's eyes. Morocco is a country known for rampant visa fraud. If you look even through the last few pages, you will see that it has happened to people here who knew their partners for years and then, suddenly, they divorce and he brings over a young Moroccan wife. It sucks (and that is an understatement) that there are people out there who do this, it sucks that it has given Morocco a reputation, and nobody on the forum, myself included, is looking at your relationship and saying that's what it is. But the consular officers have a duty to do their best to prevent this from happening.

There is no formula for when this is most likely to happen, so what people go off of are red flags, because, honestly, that's the best measure that they have: the only measure they have. Watch this video:

. It's hard to hear, but it is, unfortunately, done for a reason. Especially listen to around 2:00 in...

Unfortunately, not only do you have the age barrier (which can be beat!), but the lack of time together would be a warning sign to most people in the US when you talk about marriage, even without the element of cross-cultural conflict. I can tell you (as can most people here, most likely) that online is very different than being together in person, and the more time, physical time, that you spend together, more things come up.

I don't want to get too much in my personal story, but even though we've been together for a year, and physically together for 5+ months, I'm still learning things about my fiance. Big things. Hard things, sometimes. I spent this weekend in tears for hours because of some cultural differences that keep getting in the way. It took 5 months of being together for this to come out. It's big, and it hurts... and I had no idea about it a few months in, or even after a few months of being together. Neither of us are right or wrong, we are just sticking to our own cultural norms, and in this case, they are incompatible. We'll work through it-- we always do... but there was awhile when I wondered.

(This constant learning about each other isn't unique to cross-cultural relationships, but I certainly think it brings a level of intensity that is different.)

All of that being said, you have all my compassion. I'm terrified that this will happen to us. Our lives are up in the air (his being Moroccan, he's taking it easier than I am!), and I cannot imagine the pain, the feelings of being let down, and all that that I would (may?) feel if our application is denied. But the anger has to be directed at the right place-- at the people who have given Morocco a bad reputation, who have trampled over peoples' emotions, and the people who have forced the consular agents into having to "play God." It's those people's faults: the people who don't understand or don't care how emotionally invested, how much time, emotion, love, money, sweat, tears, etc. people have lost by believing in their fake marriage. This is the place to direct your anger.

From where I am sitting (again-- not even as close to as far along in the process as you), it looks like the consular agents' hands were tied. Based on an unfortunate trend in the region, your history did not qualify. I sincerely hope you can find a way to come over to Morocco, get to spend more time with him, and try again with a spousal visa.

*hugs*

[Lisamarie 79]

This was a great post. You gave us an opportunity to look at it from a completely different perspective, in a positive way, rather than negatively, and it wasn't directed at the OP.

Whatever cultural differences you are going through I hope you will be able to work them out.

That would actually be a good topic to start here, because I (among many others I'm sure that aren't living with their SO's yet) would like to know what kinds of cultural differences may come up that we haven't heard or though of......maybe I'll start a new post.

I'm pretty new here, so take whatever I say with that grain of salt...

But you have to look at it through the consulate officer's eyes. Morocco is a country known for rampant visa fraud. If you look even through the last few pages, you will see that it has happened to people here who knew their partners for years and then, suddenly, they divorce and he brings over a young Moroccan wife. It sucks (and that is an understatement) that there are people out there who do this, it sucks that it has given Morocco a reputation, and nobody on the forum, myself included, is looking at your relationship and saying that's what it is. But the consular officers have a duty to do their best to prevent this from happening.

There is no formula for when this is most likely to happen, so what people go off of are red flags, because, honestly, that's the best measure that they have: the only measure they have. Watch this video:

. It's hard to hear, but it is, unfortunately, done for a reason. Especially listen to around 2:00 in...

Unfortunately, not only do you have the age barrier (which can be beat!), but the lack of time together would be a warning sign to most people in the US when you talk about marriage, even without the element of cross-cultural conflict. I can tell you (as can most people here, most likely) that online is very different than being together in person, and the more time, physical time, that you spend together, more things come up.

I don't want to get too much in my personal story, but even though we've been together for a year, and physically together for 5+ months, I'm still learning things about my fiance. Big things. Hard things, sometimes. I spent this weekend in tears for hours because of some cultural differences that keep getting in the way. It took 5 months of being together for this to come out. It's big, and it hurts... and I had no idea about it a few months in, or even after a few months of being together. Neither of us are right or wrong, we are just sticking to our own cultural norms, and in this case, they are incompatible. We'll work through it-- we always do... but there was awhile when I wondered.

(This constant learning about each other isn't unique to cross-cultural relationships, but I certainly think it brings a level of intensity that is different.)

All of that being said, you have all my compassion. I'm terrified that this will happen to us. Our lives are up in the air (his being Moroccan, he's taking it easier than I am!), and I cannot imagine the pain, the feelings of being let down, and all that that I would (may?) feel if our application is denied. But the anger has to be directed at the right place-- at the people who have given Morocco a bad reputation, who have trampled over peoples' emotions, and the people who have forced the consular agents into having to "play God." It's those people's faults: the people who don't understand or don't care how emotionally invested, how much time, emotion, love, money, sweat, tears, etc. people have lost by believing in their fake marriage. This is the place to direct your anger.

From where I am sitting (again-- not even as close to as far along in the process as you), it looks like the consular agents' hands were tied. Based on an unfortunate trend in the region, your history did not qualify. I sincerely hope you can find a way to come over to Morocco, get to spend more time with him, and try again with a spousal visa.

*hugs*

[KittyPollitt 284]

This was a great post. You gave us an opportunity to look at it from a completely different perspective, in a positive way, rather than negatively, and it wasn't directed at the OP.

Whatever cultural differences you are going through I hope you will be able to work them out.

That would actually be a good topic to start here, because I (among many others I'm sure that aren't living with their SO's yet) would like to know what kinds of cultural differences may come up that we haven't heard or though of......maybe I'll start a new post.

I know I'm Buddhist, and we're constantly on about religion. We can't have a rational conversation about it- we've agreed not to discuss it except in how it relates to our daughter. His sometime laziness and constantly needing to be pushed to do everyday things around the house is a huge issue too. I work 3 jobs, and I work HARD. To me, I am offended and hurt when I come home after working for 12-14 hours and have to clean up a mess around the house- when he's been blogging or writing music all day. I do understand that he comes from a culture where his mom took care of him until the day he stepped on the plane, but man, it's frustrating. I get a barrage of excuses. I gotta say tho, those are our only major issues. He takes great care of our daughter, and we still have so much in common- it works itself out.

Sarah

[sussemadel 16]

I know I'm Buddhist, and we're constantly on about religion. We can't have a rational conversation about it- we've agreed not to discuss it except in how it relates to our daughter. His sometime laziness and constantly needing to be pushed to do everyday things around the house is a huge issue too. I work 3 jobs, and I work HARD. To me, I am offended and hurt when I come home after working for 12-14 hours and have to clean up a mess around the house- when he's been blogging or writing music all day. I do understand that he comes from a culture where his mom took care of him until the day he stepped on the plane, but man, it's frustrating. I get a barrage of excuses. I gotta say tho, those are our only major issues. He takes great care of our daughter, and we still have so much in common- it works itself out.

Sarah

If you don't mind me asking, are you raising your daughter as a buddhist or muslim?

[KittyPollitt 284]

If you don't mind me asking, are you raising your daughter as a buddhist or muslim?

We're raising her Muslim. I don't consider Buddhism a religion, more of a way of thinking- and I feel that practicing Buddhism requires understanding and needs to be a choice. My husband feels very strongly about raising her Muslim, and I respect that. I respect Islam, it's just not for me. I have educated myself about Islam a great deal, so that I can help him teach her in the future. The irony of his arguing with me about religion is that he is not a practising Muslim, other than not eating haram and fasting at Ramadan. I have never seen him pray. But that's his issues, and I stay out of it. AND of course my Catholic family thinks I'm batty from all angles It's all good, though.

Edited March 9, 2011 by squeaky580

[sandinista! 1,816]

Even sharing the same religious beliefs, we still find plenty

to discuss and argue about that topic, sometimes quite adamantly. Which works for us, as neither one of us was interested in marrying a clone of ourselves. But I have to give props to those who make it work despite having profound differences in their belief systems. Many try, and far less succeed.

[Crossed_fingers 128]

Even sharing the same religious beliefs, we still find plenty

to discuss and argue about that topic, sometimes quite adamantly. Which works for us, as neither one of us was interested in marrying a clone of ourselves. But I have to give props to those who make it work despite having profound differences in their belief systems. Many try, and far less succeed.

You raise an important issue. I see posts all the time on various forums from women asking if other women have converted and whether they have issues in their relationships if they don't. I always found myself thinking that just because a woman converts, it doesn't mean she suddenly agrees with every single spiritual belief her SO holds. Just because two people self-identify as Muslim doesn't mean they belong to the same school, that they are the same level of conservative or progressive, that they have the same strength of faith, that they have all the same religious habits and practices, and so on and so on. Glad to see someone pointed that out.

[kristen_maroc 126]

I am most in love with my fiance when he talks about religion.

Seriously. The way he takes it so seriously, the way it shapes his actions and thoughts. His faith is humbling and inspiring to me all at once. It's not perfect-- he has his flaws and sins, as we all do, but I love it.

I'm Christian. He's Muslim. I'm very open to Islam.

I think what sort of summarizes it best is what both my mom and my fiance have told me at differing tines during our relationship.

A post about a week ago about how so many marriages end up fraudulent made me call my mother in almost tears, especially since someone close to me said something nasty about it at the same time. She, who has never met my fiance before, said over the phone, "I know this isn't true, but I'm more worried about other things than him using you for a visa. You say he is a man of God. You talk about his faith and strength in beliefs, how he treats people around him, and how much that is important in his life. A man of God wouldn't have the capacity to marry someone for a visa."

A few weeks earlier, fiance and I were talking about my mom. She's... rough around the edges sometimes, is going through menopause, and can be... crazy... sometimes. Fiance and I were talking about her, and he looked me in the eye and said, "You know, I don't really worry that much about her. You know why? Because she is such a strong Christian. I think when she sees that I am a good guy, she will be fine and we will be fine."

The fact that my mother and fiance have never met, but have faith that they will have a good relationship because of their relationships with/to God, even through a different religion sort of accentuates how I see us. We love talking about religion. We're making it a goal to read the Bible and Koran together several times a week once we live together. I'm much more likely to convert than he is, that's for sure (but Islam has been on my radar for a decade)... but if we don't, it still somehow makes us stronger most of the time. It brings us together, because religion plays the same role in both of our lives: a powerful, guiding force that inspires behavior, thoughts, and action, but not something that inspires a dogmatic crusade.

[Lisamarie 79]

I feel exactly the same way and that describes my husband to a "t". We are both Muslim but he is way beyond me in knowledge about the religion. I love how he tells me about the religion and then says, "I tell you this because I want you to win"..........We will also read the Koran a few times a week together if not daily once he is here.

It sounds like your mom and your fiance will have a great relationship when he gets here:)

I am most in love with my fiance when he talks about religion.

Seriously. The way he takes it so seriously, the way it shapes his actions and thoughts. His faith is humbling and inspiring to me all at once. It's not perfect-- he has his flaws and sins, as we all do, but I love it.

I'm Christian. He's Muslim. I'm very open to Islam.

I think what sort of summarizes it best is what both my mom and my fiance have told me at differing tines during our relationship.

A post about a week ago about how so many marriages end up fraudulent made me call my mother in almost tears, especially since someone close to me said something nasty about it at the same time. She, who has never met my fiance before, said over the phone, "I know this isn't true, but I'm more worried about other things than him using you for a visa. You say he is a man of God. You talk about his faith and strength in beliefs, how he treats people around him, and how much that is important in his life. A man of God wouldn't have the capacity to marry someone for a visa."

A few weeks earlier, fiance and I were talking about my mom. She's... rough around the edges sometimes, is going through menopause, and can be... crazy... sometimes. Fiance and I were talking about her, and he looked me in the eye and said, "You know, I don't really worry that much about her. You know why? Because she is such a strong Christian. I think when she sees that I am a good guy, she will be fine and we will be fine."

The fact that my mother and fiance have never met, but have faith that they will have a good relationship because of their relationships with/to God, even through a different religion sort of accentuates how I see us. We love talking about religion. We're making it a goal to read the Bible and Koran together several times a week once we live together. I'm much more likely to convert than he is, that's for sure (but Islam has been on my radar for a decade)... but if we don't, it still somehow makes us stronger most of the time. It brings us together, because religion plays the same role in both of our lives: a powerful, guiding force that inspires behavior, thoughts, and action, but not something that inspires a dogmatic crusade.

[princess apple 4]

<< I'm sick of people asking for advice/help and then bit$hing because they don't like the reality of the help that is given.

Did you really mean to refer to yourself as "not pretty" >>

I wasn't griping at you, just at the idea that that's all people seem to notice is our age difference. So, sorry if I offended you. I knew it was a red flag, but I didn't think that it would be as big of an idea as it has been. I figured if his family accepted me, why can't the consulate?

I meant "petty," as marked by narrowness of mind, ideas, or views. That's how Salah sees most women his age, so he prefers older women. I see that quite a bit with educated people his age. The "average" 20 something year old woman isn't after a partnership with equality but often wishes for one where she is treated like the princess she feels she is. Not many men anywhere in their 20s can support princesses.

I believe the time spent there is a factor also. i was only there 2 weeks because of my vacation time allowed me. working in hospitals can give a person lots of time limitations. but i will be there for a months since i begged my boss for that. we will also do a cr1 to go from there. i was told by my lawyer that the consolates take their time on appeals and before you know it, they are expired. my expires in april. so hang in there and go on to the next step. i am willing to give you the forward from my lawyer on the process the uscis and the consolate for the appeals and what he says about it. i have my email available to you. as i was toldbefore by another.. dont bemad at her, she is very cautious about her desicions. my fiance says he was never mad at her, but rather hurt over the outcome because so much was invested for the process. our families were hurt as well. my mother is a civil rights activist and she went to town with the race thing and i had to calm her down. so believe me i understand your hurt and dissappointment. you have to focus and go to the next costly step. i had to try and get my money back from many places for my wedding and reception party. a lot had to be undone for now. we were ready to go with it all on april 30th. but the right time will be the right time.

[princess apple 4]

I know I'm Buddhist, and we're constantly on about religion. We can't have a rational conversation about it- we've agreed not to discuss it except in how it relates to our daughter. His sometime laziness and constantly needing to be pushed to do everyday things around the house is a huge issue too. I work 3 jobs, and I work HARD. To me, I am offended and hurt when I come home after working for 12-14 hours and have to clean up a mess around the house- when he's been blogging or writing music all day. I do understand that he comes from a culture where his mom took care of him until the day he stepped on the plane, but man, it's frustrating. I get a barrage of excuses. I gotta say tho, those are our only major issues. He takes great care of our daughter, and we still have so much in common- it works itself out.

Sarah

wow,

you are just simply awsome with your responses. i was just talking to my fiance Said about house hold responsibilities here in the usa . I reminded him of how he would be eating a couple of meals alone. we laughed about getting him a oversized stuffed animal to keep him company at breakfast and lunch.lol. but the reality has to be broken down about the busy life styels we have here. life can be crazy in the US. most people have work and other activites. I do alot in my community and I see home late and at bed time. so to discuss that express the need for involvment in some areas can be helpful if this is done before marraige. i teach a singles group and i meet people from many backgrounds. I see the hardship that people of different backgrounds can face when the communication fell short of some things from the beginning of the relationship. in fact i have a few projects waiting for him right now, that is more of a man thing to do. lol.

[thelastpetitioner 218]

i think the difference between middle eastern Muslims and American Muslims is that middle eastern live with large groups of Muslims,so they practice it on a daily basis,to a degree that its not longer a matter of religion,its a matter of morals and culture,I'm a none traditional Muslim and label myself as spiritual and nothing more,but when i look at my daily life,i have so much of islam going on that to a christian or a person of any other faith i might look overly religious.

i think thats what USC partners need to understand,that religion ( whatever it may be,Islam,Christianity or Judaism,after all most of the religions hailed from middle east ) to some degree is in a middle easterns culture and blood

[Jenn! 918]

You raise an important issue. I see posts all the time on various forums from women asking if other women have converted and whether they have issues in their relationships if they don't. I always found myself thinking that just because a woman converts, it doesn't mean she suddenly agrees with every single spiritual belief her SO holds. Just because two people self-identify as Muslim doesn't mean they belong to the same school, that they are the same level of conservative or progressive, that they have the same strength of faith, that they have all the same religious habits and practices, and so on and so on. Glad to see someone pointed that out.

This is true, but I would say there is far less to disagree on if both are Muslim. Even a strong Christian and a strong Muslim are likely to agree on more fronts than a loosey-goosey agnostic and a "less-than-strict" Muslim. I speak from experience!

[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

Adam and I are one in the same in Christianity. Cant think of anything we disagree on in nearly any subject. We both study the Bible and our morals are based on it. Now cultural differences we do have some odds and ends on various things. We both know that when we do have a child, he or she will be raised in a christian home and we will do our best to blend in both cultures fairly.

My sister is married to an Indian muslim. They have been married almost 7yrs and they have 2 daughters.One is 5 the other almost 2. They both have respect towards one another that they believe differently in religion. They both have high morals and raise their daughters that way as well. The biggest cultural difference that stands out for them though is on discipline. He chooses not to discipline saying that its bcz he didnt have to be when he was a child and that culturally its not the "norm" and my sister does believe in discipline but would prefer to have her husband help.