Senate GOP in Wisconsin Order Police to Take AWOL Dems Into Custody

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Compelling an elected official to do his sworn duty. What a concept. Yeah, real police state to insist that someone do the job they were elected to do and are paid to do.

What are you talking about? These Senators are doing the people's business. Even the Weekly Standard can't deny that the people of Wisconsin do not support the measure Hosni Walker and the Republicans are trying to shove down their throats. They instead support the Democratic Senators who are pursuing the only route available to prevent this bill from passing.

Rasmussen Polls Wisconsin: 52% Support Democrats, 44% Support Walker

So, since the people are against them, they engage the police to rule over their subjects. That's what a police state does.

[JohnSmith2007 353]

What are you talking about? These Senators are doing the people's business. Even the Weekly Standard can't deny that the people of Wisconsin do not support the measure Hosni Walker and the Republicans are trying to shove down their throats. They instead support the Democratic Senators who are pursuing the only route available to prevent this bill from passing.

Rasmussen Polls Wisconsin: 52% Support Democrats, 44% Support Walker

So, since the people are against them, they engage the police to rule over their subjects. That's what a police state does.

So not showing up is doing the peoples business? Right. They are paid to be in session, not running off like some child that can't get his way. I wonder, how would you have reacted if during the Obamacare votes if all the reps walked out? All polls showed that the people didn't want that bill. Would you have supported them?

[Zero Sum 305]

So not showing up is doing the peoples business? Right. They are paid to be in session, not running off like some child that can't get his way. I wonder, how would you have reacted if during the Obamacare votes if all the reps walked out? All polls showed that the people didn't want that bill. Would you have supported them?

Actually, ask the Democratic legislators' constituents. You know, those that vote in Wisconsin. They are not exactly demanding for their representatives to return, although its obvious they will have to.

The argument can be expanded to make the GOP seem more greedy: GOP legislators purposefully used the filibuster to obstruct Obamacare as much as possible, and plenty of other pieces of legislation. And they billed the US Taxpayer for this. Your reliance on polling is not only inconclusive, but weak.

Perhaps it should be the good Governor Walker to acquiesce to not lying about what he campaigned on, since its still unclear where exactly it was that he campaigned on stripping union rights as a method to control a budget hole. A hint, though, is that that campaign platform never existed. Therefore, there is no 'mandate' to do such thing. Claiming there is, and claiming Wisconsin voters want that, is dishonest.

The heavy-handedness needs to stop- on all sides. The pre-teen back and forth needs to stop- on all sides. Democracy does not work when legislative bodies cannot discuss the issues as adults, and this includes the crossing of arms that refuse to consider all arguments.

Drawing parallels to the health care legislation as one that shut out the GOP to justify what is seen in the GOP actions in Wisconsin as 'expected' and 'acceptable' by election results is also being severely amnesic, as it is quite clear that the health care legislation included quite a large amount of GOP proposals. But let not that reality interfere with incomplete rationalizations.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

So not showing up is doing the peoples business? Right. They are paid to be in session, not running off like some child that can't get his way. I wonder, how would you have reacted if during the Obamacare votes if all the reps walked out? All polls showed that the people didn't want that bill. Would you have supported them?

Actually, much of the content of "Obamacare" is, has been and remains largely popular. Would have been great if the GOP would have just walked out. No filibuster. Good. We may have ended up with a better bill.

[Ban Hammer 13,334]

before people complained about the party of no - now we have the party of no show.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

before people complained about the party of no - now we have the party of no show

How do you like them apples?

[Obama 2012 1,714]

arrested? nah. they should just hold special elections to replace their arses!

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

But how will they find the cowardly Democrats? Send the National Guard to invade Illinois?

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Actually, much of the content of "Obamacare" is, has been and remains largely popular. Would have been great if the GOP would have just walked out. No filibuster. Good. We may have ended up with a better bill.

There was no filibuster, they didn't have enough votes to maintain a filibuster. When they DID get enough votes (by losing Kennedy's seat!) they found a way to avoid it going back to the Senate. The ONLY thing that delayed the healthcare bill was other Democrats.

Amozing how Dems are already changing history. In a couple months they will be telling us it was the Republicans that fled the state in Wisconsin.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

There was no filibuster, they didn't have enough votes to maintain a filibuster. When they DID get enough votes (by losing Kennedy's seat!) they found a way to avoid it going back to the Senate. The ONLY thing that delayed the healthcare bill was other Democrats.

Amozing how Dems are already changing history. In a couple months they will be telling us it was the Republicans that fled the state in Wisconsin.

I'm not changing history. Historically, sweeping legislation was achieved in a bi-partisan fashion. Times have changed, however. I have criticized the Democrats time and again for not passing what's right and rather water down the effort in the unfounded hopes to gain any GOP support for the measure. Heck, they ended up passing the 1993 GOP health care reform proposal w/o a single GOP vote. Trying to get GOP buy-in was a futile exercise from the start that cost the country dearly. I've said this over and over again while the health care debate was going on. And I still believe that the Democrats are responsible for passing up this unique opportunity to do the right thing. They deserve the blame for this. No argument from my end.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

I'm not changing history. Historically, sweeping legislation was achieved in a bi-partisan fashion. Times have changed, however. I have criticized the Democrats time and again for not passing what's right and rather water down the effort in the unfounded hopes to gain any GOP support for the measure. Heck, they ended up passing the 1993 GOP health care reform proposal w/o a single GOP vote. Trying to get GOP buy-in was a futile exercise from the start that cost the country dearly. I've said this over and over again while the health care debate was going on. And I still believe that the Democrats are responsible for passing up this unique opportunity to do the right thing. They deserve the blame for this. No argument from my end.

Then why did you say the Repubs filibustered Obamacare? They did not.

AND the DEMs in Wisconsin do not even have the NADS to filibuster. Would you think it was good if ALL the Republicans fled the country to prevent a vote (the Wisconsin constitution requires not only a "quorum" but that "at least one member of each political party elected to the Senate" to be present)

The PEOPLE of Wisconsin elected the Governor and the Legislature. If they do not agree with what they do, then NEXT TIME they can UN-elect them and the NEW legislature can reenact what the unions want.

RUNNING away for the express purpose to PREVENT the democratic process is nothing short of treason.

[Zero Sum 305]

Wisconsin Senate Dems threatened with police roundup, worker layoffs if they fail to return

MADISON, Wis. (AP) — Wisconsin's governor threatened Thursday to issue thousands of layoff notices within 24 hours if Senate Democrats who fled to Illinois fail to return for a vote on a measure that would cripple public unions, and their Republican colleagues also stepped up the pressure by authorizing police to round up the missing lawmakers.

The efforts marked the most drastic steps in the standoff that has extended more than two weeks, halting action on Gov. Scott Walker's plan to end most collective bargaining for state workers, which he says is critical to solving the state's budget crisis.

On Thursday night, a judge ordered around 100 protesters who had been spending the night there for weeks to leave, although he said they could return during regular business hours. During a hearing over access to the Capitol, police said they found 41 rounds of .22-caliber rifle ammunition scattered at several locations outside the building.

In an interview with The Associated Press, Walker said he will issue layoff notices to 1,500 state workers on Friday if his proposal, which also would force the workers to pay more for benefits, isn't passed. Because the Senate Democrats left, the chamber doesn't have a quorum.

While Walker said he is actively working with some of the Democrats in hopes of striking a deal, he told the AP he won't compromise on the collective bargaining issue or anything that saves the state money.

"I can't take any of that off the table," he said. "We cannot tear apart this budget. We cannot put this burden on local governments. But if there are other ways they are willing to work with us to find a pathway back, I think that's what people want."

Democratic Senate Minority Leader Mark Miller confirmed there were talks with Walker, but he did not think they were close to reaching a deal.

The Republican leader of the state Senate signed orders finding the 14 AWOL Democrats in contempt and allowing the chamber's sergeant at arms to use police force to detain them if necessary. Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald says his orders are only binding should the senators return to Wisconsin.

The Senate passed a resolution earlier in the day setting a 4 p.m. deadline for the senators to appear at the chamber. When none of them did, Fitzgerald signed the orders in dramatic fashion — in the center of the Senate chamber. State patrol officers watched silently from the gallery as Fitzgerald signed the orders executing the order. The Democrats left in protest over an anti-union bill.

Senate Democrats disagreed with Fitzgerald about what's allowed under the chamber's rules. Sen. Chris Larson said they hadn't done anything illegal and couldn't be arrested.

"There are so many police supporting us, they might have a hard time finding one to bring us back," said Miller, one of the AWOL Democrats.

Fitzgerald called on any Wisconsin citizens who see the senators to contact police. He argued the resolution is about restoring order to the Senate and not the issues surrounding the union bill, which has led to three weeks of demonstrations by tens of thousands of protesters at the state Capitol.

Walker's budget proposal hinges on the state saving $330 million over two years from forcing state workers to pay more for their benefits. He's also cutting aid to schools and local governments by about $1 billion, reductions he says they can't handle without the freedom he gives them through eliminating nearly all collective bargaining with public workers.

Walker said he has to issue the layoff notices starting Friday so the state can start to realize the $30 million savings he had assumed would come from the state worker concessions contained in the bill. The layoffs wouldn't be effective for 31 days, and Walker said he could rescind them if the bill passed in the meantime.

All state workers, except those at prisons, state hospitals and other facilities open around the clock, would be potential layoff targets, he said.

"I pushed it off as long as I could because I do not want to have layoffs," Walker said.

Walker said he was talking with some of the "more reasonable members" of the missing Democrats, sometimes multiple times a day, about a deal that could get them to come back.

"I'm still cautiously optimistic we can get this done," Walker said. "I think we're close, but the problem is we thought we were close the past couple days."

Walker refused to say what issues they were discussing.

"We've laid out a path that we think gives them certainly not everything they wanted but some things they're interested in and some things we found to be reasonable that we could accommodate," he said.

The Wisconsin Professional Police Association, a union representing 11,000 law enforcement officials from across the state, released a statement from its director Jim Palmer slamming the Senate Republicans' resolution to go after the Democrats.

"The thought of using law enforcement officers to exercise force in order to achieve a political objective is insanely wrong and Wisconsin sorely needs reasonable solutions and not potentially dangerous political theatrics," Palmer said.

Marquette University Law School professor Dan Blinka said no matter how it's described, the resolution calls for what amounts to an arrest that would have to be justified under the law. If it's found unconstitutional, any action taken by the senators after they were forced to return could be invalidated, Blinka said.

Howard Schweber, an associate political science and law professor at the University of Wisconsin-Madison, said Senate Republicans can properly order police to enforce their rules, as long as they don't try to impose criminal sanctions on the Democrats.

A memo provided by private attorney Jim Troupis, who was hired by the Senate Republicans and often works with the GOP, said the state Constitution gives them authority to act to compel attendance under its rules.

Once the senators do return, Fitzgerald said they could face reprimand, censure or even expulsion.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Shoot the hostages!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The Wisconsin Professional Police Association, a union representing 11,000 law enforcement officials from across the state, released a statement from its director Jim Palmer slamming the Senate Republicans' resolution to go after the Democrats.

"The thought of using law enforcement officers to exercise force in order to achieve a political objective is insanely wrong and Wisconsin sorely needs reasonable solutions and not potentially dangerous political theatrics," Palmer said.

The Republicans have really drawn a line in the sand on this one and Gov. Walker rejecting the unions' concessions demonstrates which side is the one who is playing hardball. If the GOP wants an all out battle with working Americans, they've got it now.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Zero Sum, on 03 March 2011 - 06:32 PM, said:

The Wisconsin Professional Police Association, a union representing 11,000 law enforcement officials from across the state, released a statement from its director Jim Palmer slamming the Senate Republicans' resolution to go after the Democrats.

"The thought of using law enforcement officers to exercise force in order to achieve a political objective is insanely wrong and Wisconsin sorely needs reasonable solutions and not potentially dangerous political theatrics," Palmer said.

The Republicans have really drawn a line in the sand on this one and Gov. Walker rejecting the unions' concessions demonstrates which side is the one who is playing hardball. If the GOP wants an all out battle with working Americans Communists, they've got it now.

Would you expect a Communist union hack to say anything less, Comrade?