Why liberals love trains.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

For fifty bucks, I can take a 50 minute flight. Besides, who would want to go to the center of Los Angeles or San Francisco?

the cheapest flight you will find between SF and LA is about $120 (not for early morning or evening flights though), not including transport to the airport, baggage fees etc. It will involve not only a 50 minute flight but a trip to the airport (SFO is not near town) and 1 1/2 - 2 hours on each side of waiting around the airport.

[^_^ 5,021]

the cheapest flight you will find between SF and LA is about $120 (not for early morning or evening flights though), not including transport to the airport, baggage fees etc. It will involve not only a 50 minute flight but a trip to the airport (SFO is not near town) and 1 1/2 - 2 hours on each side of waiting around the airport.

Put another way - air travel is freakin' inconvenient.

Not to mention tiring. And it plays havoc on my sinuses

Edited February 28, 2011 by \

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I have driven I-5 north of the Grapevine many, many times - often 2 lanes of slow moving traffic. Driving it to SF makes the case for a high speed link better than anything I can think of.

I think you will find the Central Valley and rural France to be pretty similar in terms of population density. And even if it was completely desolate instead of home to several medium sized like Fresno and Bakersfield it is still 300 miles between the 2 largest cities in a state that is the equivalent to the world's 7th largest economy.

That is why I take 101, and just sight-see along the way. Why be in a hurry? Getting to and from I-5 is a pain sometimes, and like you said, you can't always drive the average 90 mph between Tracy and Bakersfield. I missed the 90 car Thanksgiving pile-up about twenty years ago by minutes, and almost got caught in a brush fire crossing the highway at the I-580 turn off about five years ago.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

That is why I take 101, and just sight-see along the way. Why be in a hurry? Getting to and from I-5 is a pain sometimes, and like you said, you can't always drive the average 90 mph between Tracy and Bakersfield. I missed the 90 car Thanksgiving pile-up about twenty years ago by minutes, and almost got caught in a brush fire crossing the highway at the I-580 turn off about five years ago.

Sight seeing on the 101. Yeah, that's it.

[rika60607 215]

And TSA might try to pat you down! Would you rather risk a pat down by TSA or sitting in a chair next to a stranger? Hmmm...

Put another way - air travel is freakin' inconvenient.

Not to mention tiring. And it plays havoc on my sinuses

Edited February 28, 2011 by rika60607

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Sight seeing on the 101. Yeah, that's it.

Yep. The wife likes seeing all the missions. I think we have been to about six so far.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

And TSA might try to pat you down! Would you rather risk a pat down by TSA or sitting on in a chair next to a stranger? Hmmm...

:lol:

[^_^ 5,021]

And TSA might try to pat you down! Would you rather risk a pat down by TSA or sitting on in a chair next to a stranger? Hmmm...

Amtrak seats on the Northeast Regional (I've never been on the Acela - too pricey for my taste) are large enough where I don't really mind sitting next to someone.

But sit next to someone on NJ Transit? Forget about it.

[Zero Sum 305]

Sorry, I don't do that bougi #######. Give me a Dunkin Donuts coffee and bagel any day.

Any idea who caters the snack cars on Amtrak? I have no idea come to think of it. The guy who serves you wears an Amtrak uniform so I guess Amtrak runs it? A possible outsourcing opportunity.

Its great coffee. Not sure about Amtrak catering. Last time I was on a train in the US was about 10 years ago. Have you been on Acela trains?

[rika60607 215]

Yes, missions are charming.

So have you EVER traveled by a high speed train? Where? When?

Yep. The wife likes seeing all the missions. I think we have been to about six so far.

[Zero Sum 305]

Oh you just answered it.

[^_^ 5,021]

Its great coffee. Not sure about Amtrak catering. Last time I was on a train in the US was about 10 years ago. Have you been on Acela trains?

No. More expensive than the Northeast Regional and the reduction in travel time isn't enough to be worth it (to me).

[^_^ 5,021]

Oh you just answered it.

I know many IT sales people who travel between NY/NJ and DC who only use the Acela. The Acela gives them free wifi (the northeast regional is supposed to get that soon) and is faster (just not by much). I have traveled to DC on Amtrak for business only once - every other time it's been for pleasure. My wife and I are Smithsonian geeks and like going there from time to time, especially in the summer. It's a great little trip if you're into that sort of thing. We even stay at a hotel which has a DC metro stop in the basement and is right by the museums so you never really need a car at all.

[Zero Sum 305]

No. More expensive than the Northeast Regional and the reduction in travel time isn't enough to be worth it (to me).

I'd be concerned as well with the cost:benefit ratio. Now if you said Acela from NYC to Chicago or Houston. That would be different. But the cost would have to make the trip worth it, compared to driving or flying.

I don't get it why silly people that call themselves capitalist fans of market competition have such a hard time swallowing the truth that HSR would increase competition. It sounds like they are either lying about being pro-market or they work for the airlines and have something to lose.

[^_^ 5,021]

I'd be concerned as well with the cost:benefit ratio. Now if you said Acela from NYC to Chicago or Houston. That would be different. But the cost would have to make the trip worth it, compared to driving or flying.

I don't get it why silly people that call themselves capitalist fans of market competition have such a hard time swallowing the truth that HSR would increase competition. It sounds like they are either lying about being pro-market or they work for the airlines and have something to lose.

Their general argument is that if train service was feasible, why is it subsidized? It's subsidized because it's a national network in a nation that does not need a national network. Look at the Amtrak map - there are routes through some very sparsely populated areas. What's the point? Decommission everything but the Northeast Corridor. The NEC is the only Amtrak line that makes money.

Edited February 28, 2011 by \