I have a question for you gals

[Henia 11]

Even if you were previously a Christian that doesn't mean you can know everything about the religion. When you get down to it, alot of what we hear and see about religion is a matter of opinion and translation. Neither Christianity or Islam is 100% clear.

The fact is there are many translations out there and many "scholors" of both religions teaching what their understanding is of that religion. I also get irritated when a question is asked and answered with a website. I have read books about Islam, some of which challenge Christianity. I can also read books about Christianity where is Islam is challenged. Depends on whose point of view it is. I would not expect a Muslim Scholor to write a book about Christianity that would agree with the view points of Christians and vice-versa.

There are 2 women here, SZSZ and Lostinlove, whose posts I take the most seriously. Not only because they were born Muslim, but it is also a part of the history. Learning the Quran in English is not the same as learning it in Arabic, which is the only form it should be in.

The funny part about it, is when ever a question is asked about Islam, all the converts or reverts, jump to answer right away without looking at all view points and alot of the time those answers seem snippy and condecending. I have never felt that by looking at posts from SZSZ or Lostinlove. Actually if you look at the original post, you will notice the first handful of answers are all different. I was actually impressed and relieved when Lostinlove posted that she would research it and come back to answer.

Some poeple think this is some kind of fighting thread. Not every thread needs to be about well-wishing and countdowns. There is alot of concrete information that comes out of threads like this and I for one appreciate them alot. We definitly don't have to agree and I can always agree to disagee. I think its great when we talk about stuff that has some acutal content.

As i stated I am NOT a scholar (in any religion) or a historian...so all my thoughts are based on what I have learned from people and reading.Also as I said, when I have resources to post, I will post them... to be more clear and precise.Thank you.

Even a sholor or priest is teaching their understanding of it. If you post a resouce that says A, I can post one that says B. Please don't take it the wrong way, but what you consider to be a valid and trusted source of information can also be considered otherwise by someone else.

You are right, sorry for adding my 2 cents..

[Sofiyya 1,687]

oh no not the K word again!

The k word is in the Quran and, when properly used, it conveys a proper meaning, not as I have seen some throw it around out of context and without understanding what it means.

Samir_shannon, there is a difference in not believing and disrespecting, that is what you don't seem to understand. Christians are our brothers and sisters before God, and Allah tells us that He created us as nations and tribes so that we can know each other, not despise each other. Those of us who can create unity despite our differences are the most righteous among us.

I was married to a Christian, and I know mixed faith marriages are not the easiest unions to be in. You will have many obstacles to overcome. You have chosen a way that is not the most unencumbered. Look for ways to make your way smooth between your man and yourself. That will be blessing to you; marriage should be full of blessings.

[jordanianprincess 0]

well sorry you feel that way.. i was just being honest in comparison. that is honestly how i looked at it when i studied it. i dont understand why you would say something about my fiances soul. that is up to God. are you saying because i dont believe in muhammed being a true prophet that my fiances soul goes to hell? if that is the case add that to my list of why i would never become a muslim. when u think about it... it is no different than a muslim saying that Jesus isnt the son of God. i have had muslims say that to me but no hard feelings. they have to answer for that to God one day not to me. so sorry and no hard feelings.

Am I saying because you dont believe in muhammed being a true prophet that your fiances soul goes to hell?

No, I know I made it clear in my post that you are nore required to believe, but you are not allowed to demean the faith either, if you do so, then, yes, your husband may well answer for marriage to someone who dislikes Islam. It is not the same as Muslims saying to you that Jesus is not the sone of God; no Muslim would demean Jesus. We respect and revere Jesus. You are obviously repulsed by the Prophet Muhammad, and your attitude reeks of kafir tendencies, one who is hostile to Islam.

. . . But hold not to the guardianship of kafir women: Ask for what you have spent on their dowers, and let the kufar ask for what they have spent on the dowers of women who come over to you. Such is the command of God. He judges with justice between you. And God is Full of Knowledge and Wisdom. 60:10

He will answer to that, not to us. Unless you are a very selfish and self-centered woman, you should see that you have a responsibilty to accept and uplift his faith in Islam as he has a responsibility to accept you as a Christian. Your posts don't demonstrate an ability to do so.

first of all i think you are gong way overboard when you say that i am repulsed by muhammed. i think you are twisting it maybe not on purpose but, because have upset you. i am not repulsed by muhammed. and hostile towards islam? i dont understand how you can say i am hostile? dont you think you are going a little overboard? i would never be hostile towards islam.

Your original post was very hostile. You can speak your opinion without offending others. In your original post you spoke of "false prophets" and at the same time said you don't want to offend any muslims. I think you should really read your posts before hitting enter.

Hi JP!

kissies.

Mwaa!

[iceyspots 0]

oh no not the K word again!

The k word is in the Quran and, when properly used, it conveys a proper meaning, not as I have seen some throw it around out of context and without understanding what it means.

Samir_shannon, there is a difference in not believing and disrespecting, that is what you don't seem to understand. Christians are our brothers and sisters before God, and Allah tells us that He created us as nations and tribes so that we can know each other, not despise each other. Those of us who can create unity despite our differences are the most righteous among us.

I was married to a Christian, and I know mixed faith marriages are not the easiest unions to be in. You will have many obstacles to overcome. You have chosen a way that is not the most unencumbered. Look for ways to make your way smooth between your man and yourself. That will be blessing to you; marriage should be full of blessings.

I know I know.. I understand how you used it in context..

[Sofiyya 1,687]

first of all i think you are gong way overboard when you say that i am repulsed by muhammed. i think you are twisting it maybe not on purpose but, because have upset you. i am not repulsed by muhammed. and hostile towards islam? i dont understand how you can say i am hostile? dont you think you are going a little overboard? i would never be hostile towards islam.

Nothing I say is from being upset. I mean only to advise you out of caring and compassion. But, as far as your views go, I can only go by what I read, and that is what I got from your posts:

. . . Muhammed was a man. . . . Any man who claims to be perfect and sinless is a deceiver. Dont look to muhammed and read abut Jesus Christ.

I dont believe in what muhammed says because Jesus warned us of false prophets who would lead us away from him. Jesus stated specifically of false prophets. I dont want to offend any muslims but i dont understand why you have not looked at this when you look at your religion.

You go on to say that you respect Muslims, but that is a very empty statement after the fact. It's like telling someone you like their garden while you pull out their flowers. Think about it.

Edited August 30, 2006 by szsz

[samir_shannon 0]

i am sorry for offending. i really feel bad for samir because i think alot of people are going to feel he is bad because of me. i really want to appologize. i am not feeling well and am going to lay down. i will go ahead and stay out of your forum since so many people have been offended by me. i wish everone good luck in this process and hope and pray all of you who are not united with your loved one are united soon. may god bless all of you. this process can be so tough. take care.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

There is no need for you to leave. I'm sure no one wants that, sis. If you have learned anything that will help you in your relationship, I hope you will stay. It can only get better!

[SirLancelot 1]

When answering any question in Islam, you have to answer it from a trusted source. There is no "in your opinion" because you can lead people astray there. Becarful which site you learn from because not all are legit.

Excellent point

Always always always -I can not stress this engough- ALWAYS ask for proof and not opinions!

You're kidding right? You're talking about God and you're asking for proof? I'm atheist for a reason, because theres NO solid proof at all there's God. Everything said here is opinion--albeit perhaps opinions from learned professors and scholarly researchers, but nevertheless opinions.

Yes, the ability to be critical of everything one reads, hears or learns is quite important, but when the discussion centers on religion, everything is thrown out. All rationale ceases to exist and we enter the realm of blind faith.

[samir_shannon 0]

i totally agree with you and i have to say Samir has been wonderful in not trying to force anything on me. I know it is hard for him sometimes to deal with the fact i dont believe in his religion but, he has been nothing but kind to me about it. in my opinion, he would make an awesome christian oh well wishful thinking. i love him no matter what. and i know God loves him too

I have to say this. Samir_shannon, I see little tolerance in your posts. You not only do not believe in Islam, you show no respect for Islam or our Prophet in your posts, both of which you sneer at. I have no problem with your insistance on keeping your faith, that is a right that Islam grants to you as the spouse of a Muslim, but if your tone of disrespect doesn't soften, I fear for your marriage and your husband's soul if he is any kind of Muslim at all, for while we are allowed to marry among the ahl al kitab, rejectors are strictly forbidden to us.

Perhaps I am wrong, but that is what I see.

I think we may have all noticed a little intolerence with Islam from Shannon. I myself wonder how it can work if the wife or husband is so against the other's religion.

uh oh let's get ready for the "you dont know me and how can you judge my relationship" thing all over again

?? what is this? what did i do to you Jamie? cos i dont recall being mean to you or anything.

[Together4ever 1]

There are 2 women here, SZSZ and Lostinlove, whose posts I take the most seriously. Not only because they were born Muslim, but it is also a part of the history. Learning the Quran in English is not the same as learning it in Arabic, which is the only form it should be in.

The funny part about it, is when ever a question is asked about Islam, all the converts or reverts, jump to answer right away without looking at all view points and alot of the time those answers seem snippy and condecending. I have never felt that by looking at posts from SZSZ or Lostinlove. Actually if you look at the original post, you will notice the first handful of answers are all different. I was actually impressed and relieved when Lostinlove posted that she would research it and come back to answer.

This exemplifies why I don't usually say much in religious discussion. Because I am a "revert" I will always be the "retarded child", my views will never "count". I have been ridiculed and insulted in the past by a few members here. I try to be intelligent with my views and I try hard to be opened minded, but I'm weary of this.

If one chooses to revert to Islam, does this make their faith and their belief any LESS? I can assure I feel as strongly about my own relationship with Allah through Islam as any other muslim does. I cannot at this time study Islam in Arabic because I can't read Arabic. I plan to learn it so I can. I do not want to be patronized. I turn away from those who do it.

I will keep my thoughts to myself from here on out regarding anything to do with Islam since obviously my faith is considered inferior by those who post here because I was not "born" Muslim.

I do want to remind one thing, however. When one accepts Islam who is not biologically born into it, they are still considered clean and new. One's relationship with Allah is that. A relationship. Highly personal. In a relationship there is always growth and discovery. It can't be forced. It has to progress on its own. I'm not necessarily addressing this poster personally, but its the attitude of several others that makes me regret posting anything on this subject.

I just find it disappointing.

[SirLancelot 1]

This exemplifies why I don't usually say much in religious discussion. Because I am a "revert" I will always be the "retarded child", my views will never "count". I have been ridiculed and insulted in the past by a few members here. I try to be intelligent with my views and I try hard to be opened minded, but I'm weary of this.

If one chooses to revert to Islam, does this make their faith and their belief any LESS? I can assure I feel as strongly about my own relationship with Allah through Islam as any other muslim does. I cannot at this time study Islam in Arabic because I can't read Arabic. I plan to learn it so I can. I do not want to be patronized. I turn away from those who do it.

I will keep my thoughts to myself from here on out regarding anything to do with Islam since obviously my faith is considered inferior by those who post here because I was not "born" Muslim.

I do want to remind one thing, however. When one accepts Islam who is not biologically born into it, they are still considered clean and new. One's relationship with Allah is that. A relationship. Highly personal. In a relationship there is always growth and discovery. It can't be forced. It has to progress on its own. I'm not necessarily addressing this poster personally, but its the attitude of several others that makes me regret posting anything on this subject.

I just find it disappointing.

jordanianprincess, I don't know if it's you who is immigrating to the US or your SO who is coming to the US, but be prepared, you'll encounter the exact same ####### from many of the "natives" regarding the eventual US Citizenship. You or you SO will not be a "native born" US citizen. It'll be EXACTLY as you described above, except it wouldn't be regarding your faith but your citizenship.

It's still enshrined in the US Constitution--but I hope one day someone will challege that using the 14th amendment. If you're a foreign born US Citizen, you still can't become the President of the USA. You can become a Senator, a Secretary of State, or a Congressman, but you can't become the President yet. It's fully sanctioned instituationalized discrimination. And it's Bullsh*t!

[noura 0]

This exemplifies why I don't usually say much in religious discussion. Because I am a "revert" I will always be the "retarded child", my views will never "count". I have been ridiculed and insulted in the past by a few members here. I try to be intelligent with my views and I try hard to be opened minded, but I'm weary of this.

If one chooses to revert to Islam, does this make their faith and their belief any LESS? I can assure I feel as strongly about my own relationship with Allah through Islam as any other muslim does. I cannot at this time study Islam in Arabic because I can't read Arabic. I plan to learn it so I can. I do not want to be patronized. I turn away from those who do it.

I will keep my thoughts to myself from here on out regarding anything to do with Islam since obviously my faith is considered inferior by those who post here because I was not "born" Muslim.

I do want to remind one thing, however. When one accepts Islam who is not biologically born into it, they are still considered clean and new. One's relationship with Allah is that. A relationship. Highly personal. In a relationship there is always growth and discovery. It can't be forced. It has to progress on its own. I'm not necessarily addressing this poster personally, but its the attitude of several others that makes me regret posting anything on this subject.

I just find it disappointing.

jordanianprincess, I don't know if it's you who is immigrating to the US or your SO who is coming to the US, but be prepared, you'll encounter the exact same ####### from many of the "natives" regarding the eventual US Citizenship. You or you SO will not be a "native born" US citizen. It'll be EXACTLY as you described above, except it wouldn't be regarding your faith but your citizenship.

It's still enshrined in the US Constitution--but I hope one day someone will challege that using the 14th amendment. If you're a foreign born US Citizen, you still can't become the President of the USA. You can become a Senator, a Secretary of State, or a Congressman, but you can't become the President yet. It's fully sanctioned instituationalized discrimination. And it's Bullsh*t!

Just fyi, you're directing your comment to JP, when you are actually quoting/replying to the words of Just_Waiting (Jean). Obviously, you missed that in your cut/paste procedure.

[SirLancelot 1]

This exemplifies why I don't usually say much in religious discussion. Because I am a "revert" I will always be the "retarded child", my views will never "count". I have been ridiculed and insulted in the past by a few members here. I try to be intelligent with my views and I try hard to be opened minded, but I'm weary of this.

If one chooses to revert to Islam, does this make their faith and their belief any LESS? I can assure I feel as strongly about my own relationship with Allah through Islam as any other muslim does. I cannot at this time study Islam in Arabic because I can't read Arabic. I plan to learn it so I can. I do not want to be patronized. I turn away from those who do it.

I will keep my thoughts to myself from here on out regarding anything to do with Islam since obviously my faith is considered inferior by those who post here because I was not "born" Muslim.

I do want to remind one thing, however. When one accepts Islam who is not biologically born into it, they are still considered clean and new. One's relationship with Allah is that. A relationship. Highly personal. In a relationship there is always growth and discovery. It can't be forced. It has to progress on its own. I'm not necessarily addressing this poster personally, but its the attitude of several others that makes me regret posting anything on this subject.

I just find it disappointing.

jordanianprincess, I don't know if it's you who is immigrating to the US or your SO who is coming to the US, but be prepared, you'll encounter the exact same ####### from many of the "natives" regarding the eventual US Citizenship. You or you SO will not be a "native born" US citizen. It'll be EXACTLY as you described above, except it wouldn't be regarding your faith but your citizenship.

It's still enshrined in the US Constitution--but I hope one day someone will challege that using the 14th amendment. If you're a foreign born US Citizen, you still can't become the President of the USA. You can become a Senator, a Secretary of State, or a Congressman, but you can't become the President yet. It's fully sanctioned instituationalized discrimination. And it's Bullsh*t!

Just fyi, you're directing your comment to JP, when you are actually quoting/replying to the words of Just_Waiting (Jean). Obviously, you missed that in your cut/paste procedure.

Thanks Noura. Duly noted. My post should have been directed to Just_Waiting then. I tried editing but it doesn't allow me anymore.

[noura 0]

Thanks Noura. Duly noted. My post should have been directed to Just_Waiting then. I tried editing but it doesn't allow me anymore.

No problem, just patrolling... my morning duty!

[Together4ever 1]

I am an American, born and raised. I have no "Arab" blood. I love the assumptions. Muslim does necessarily mean someone of Arabian descent. There are quite a few of us "white bread Muslims" out there. And yes I'm quite aware of a lot of BS. I'm not trying to be smug with you although I know I come acrossed that way. I agree with your words. Its just that quite frankly between this process and the level of idiocy in this country towards Muslims (not Arabs... MUSLIMS) I am quite fed up with humanity in general. Last I checked freedom of religion in this country was a right. It should have come with a disclaimer I guess.

Grrrr too late to edit and too early in the morning. I MEANT to say Being Muslim does NOT necessarily mean being of Arab descent. Sorry.