I have a question for you gals

[noura 0]

It's funny you say that. Actually people who revert seem to know more then people who are born Muslim. I was born Muslim, but didn't know much about it till I was is college. A revert is part of the reason of what got me interested in learning more. Shortly After is when I put on the Scarf. So I don't agree with you that a revert knowns any less. Also I have noticed that people who revert tend to follow Islam better then some people who are born Muslims. This is a choice that you made. It actually makes me feel pride when I see people like you.

I was thinking the same thing lost.... Those who choose to follow Islam (or any religion) generally pursue it w/ much more fervor than those born into it. Maybe "making up for lost time"... dunno, but I find we often take for granted that which is given at birth, but a choice is a choice often made as an adult. There is a genuine interest in the subject matter.

[jordanianprincess 0]

There are 2 women here, SZSZ and Lostinlove, whose posts I take the most seriously. Not only because they were born Muslim, but it is also a part of the history. Learning the Quran in English is not the same as learning it in Arabic, which is the only form it should be in.

The funny part about it, is when ever a question is asked about Islam, all the converts or reverts, jump to answer right away without looking at all view points and alot of the time those answers seem snippy and condecending. I have never felt that by looking at posts from SZSZ or Lostinlove. Actually if you look at the original post, you will notice the first handful of answers are all different. I was actually impressed and relieved when Lostinlove posted that she would research it and come back to answer.

This exemplifies why I don't usually say much in religious discussion. Because I am a "revert" I will always be the "retarded child", my views will never "count". I have been ridiculed and insulted in the past by a few members here. I try to be intelligent with my views and I try hard to be opened minded, but I'm weary of this.

If one chooses to revert to Islam, does this make their faith and their belief any LESS? I can assure I feel as strongly about my own relationship with Allah through Islam as any other muslim does. I cannot at this time study Islam in Arabic because I can't read Arabic. I plan to learn it so I can. I do not want to be patronized. I turn away from those who do it.

I will keep my thoughts to myself from here on out regarding anything to do with Islam since obviously my faith is considered inferior by those who post here because I was not "born" Muslim.

I do want to remind one thing, however. When one accepts Islam who is not biologically born into it, they are still considered clean and new. One's relationship with Allah is that. A relationship. Highly personal. In a relationship there is always growth and discovery. It can't be forced. It has to progress on its own. I'm not necessarily addressing this poster personally, but its the attitude of several others that makes me regret posting anything on this subject.

I just find it disappointing.

Jean is there a specific reason you take everything as a personal attack on yourself? These are my opinions and I am free to express them as I like. The same way you are free to constantly express yours. I find it funny that you say that you don't contribute much to religious discussion, as you are in pretty much every thread reagarding it. I didn't insult you or call you a "retarded child" or say that you were inferior. I don't take the posts made my SZSZ and Lostinlove seriously only becuase they are arabic, but to be quite honest their posts are well thought out and unbiased. The same is for Bosco, which even though she is not arabic, I still think her posts are great and I do enjoy reading them. I didn't say it made your belief in Islam less if you convert. You are shoving words down my mouth and I don't appreciate it.

I am still baffled by your actions. It seems anytime we have some kind of constructive debate, you come into the thread and play the part of the victim, storm off, and say your not going to say anything else. Just because we don't agree doesn't mean we are flaming each other.

You may take my words as an attack on you personally, but they weren't intended in that way. They triggered a personal frustration with this board that I've had since I joined. It wasn't directed at you personally. I was no shoving words down your throat.

As far as playing the part of the victim or storming off or supplying my opinions, its no different then you supplying yours. If you have a problem with me please feel free to exercise the ignore feature. I've already mentioned previously that I'm not quite myself these days and am frankly having a hard time. I didn't think that meant I had to leave the forum. This is the only support system I have. I am just who I am, and doing the best I can. Again, feel free to block me. I won't be offended.

And I will from now on keep my religious opinions to myself.

Jean one thing about board ettiquitte is that if you are going to quote someone in your reply that usually means your post is directed at them or what they said. I don't take your words as an attack at all, I am simply asking YOU why think everthing is a personal attack on yourself. I have seen you play the victim time and time again and get offended by things people say that don't even concern you. They are just opinions, take them with a grain of salt. Everyone here is equally frustrated and you are not the only by any means. Supplying opinions is fine, saying you don't want to play anymore because someone doesn't agree with you is just plain childish.

You constantly talk about how much stress your under as a means for justifying your posts. If you are so frustrated and unhappy with the forum then why do you keep posting? I don't need to block you or anyone else that matter. I have no problems reading peoples posts and if I don't agree with them then that is fine, but I don't feel the need to try to stop debates because i don't agree with the content or threaten not to come back.

I would assume that everyone that contributes to these forums is an adult and therefore should act like one. Playing the victim and storming off is not any way the same as sharing opinions.

[noura 0]

Am I the only one who finds the speaking your mind trend on VJ refreshing? The nicey nicey...let's all blow sunshine up each other's asses thing gets old. As long as it's done in good taste I say...express yo self!

you said "asses" and it didn't get blocked! you said "asses" you said "asses"

[iceyspots 0]

Is ####### better:?

[noura 0]

Is ####### better:?

almost anything is funny at this point! i'm just having giggle fits..

[jordanianprincess 0]

It's funny you say that. Actually people who revert seem to know more then people who are born Muslim. I was born Muslim, but didn't know much about it till I was is college. A revert is part of the reason of what got me interested in learning more. Shortly After is when I put on the Scarf. So I don't agree with you that a revert knowns any less. Also I have noticed that people who revert tend to follow Islam better then some people who are born Muslims. This is a choice that you made. It actually makes me feel pride when I see people like you.

I was thinking the same thing lost.... Those who choose to follow Islam (or any religion) generally pursue it w/ much more fervor than those born into it. Maybe "making up for lost time"... dunno, but I find we often take for granted that which is given at birth, but a choice is a choice often made as an adult. There is a genuine interest in the subject matter.

I definitly agree with this, but at the same time, those that are so much more fervor than others don't look at all sides of the equation and are sometimes overly eager to answer. There is nothing wrong with being passionate about religions. There seems to be a trend here among certain members (which I will not name) that are reverts/convert. They are usually so adament about their views and can't look at all sides of the spectrum, this is not true for all, but true for many.

I am Christian and will be the first to admit that its not 100% perfect or clear. I have learned alot here myself about Christianity. I think all relgions need to be looked at with an open mind.

[noura 0]

I think all relgions need to be looked at with an open mind.

if you have an open mind, is there a chance your brain might fall out?

this is a "funny" ppl... laugh w/ me now! it's the tagline on my emails!

[jordanianprincess 0]

I think all relgions need to be looked at with an open mind.

if you have an open mind, is there a chance your brain might fall out?

this is a "funny" ppl... laugh w/ me now! it's the tagline on my emails!

Now that's funny!!!!!

Mea culpa. But you have to remember that I thought I was addressing JordanianPrincess and with a name like that, you can't fault me too much for presuming she or her SO of being of Arab descent.

Anyway, what I said applies to any foreigner, not just Arabs. If Prince Henry or Prince William of the UK immigrates to the US, they would not be able to become the Pres of the USA. And you can't be whiter than either of them

edit: also, note where this thread falls under:

VisaJourney.com > General Discussion Area > Regional Discussion > Middle East and North Africa

You can't fault me too much if its catagorized under this subcatagory.

Yes I am of arab decent and so is my SO. I am the USC and was not born here. I have never had a problem with that at all, I don't intend or have any interest in being a politician of any kind. Not sure what your point is at all.

[iceyspots 0]

I think all relgions need to be looked at with an open mind.

if you have an open mind, is there a chance your brain might fall out?

this is a "funny" ppl... laugh w/ me now! it's the tagline on my emails!

I think I saw that happen on Live Surgery on TLC

[Nagishkaw 510]

There are 2 women here, SZSZ and Lostinlove, whose posts I take the most seriously. Not only because they were born Muslim, but it is also a part of the history. Learning the Quran in English is not the same as learning it in Arabic, which is the only form it should be in.

The funny part about it, is when ever a question is asked about Islam, all the converts or reverts, jump to answer right away without looking at all view points and alot of the time those answers seem snippy and condecending. I have never felt that by looking at posts from SZSZ or Lostinlove. Actually if you look at the original post, you will notice the first handful of answers are all different. I was actually impressed and relieved when Lostinlove posted that she would research it and come back to answer.

This exemplifies why I don't usually say much in religious discussion. Because I am a "revert" I will always be the "retarded child", my views will never "count". I have been ridiculed and insulted in the past by a few members here. I try to be intelligent with my views and I try hard to be opened minded, but I'm weary of this.

If one chooses to revert to Islam, does this make their faith and their belief any LESS? I can assure I feel as strongly about my own relationship with Allah through Islam as any other muslim does. I cannot at this time study Islam in Arabic because I can't read Arabic. I plan to learn it so I can. I do not want to be patronized. I turn away from those who do it.

I will keep my thoughts to myself from here on out regarding anything to do with Islam since obviously my faith is considered inferior by those who post here because I was not "born" Muslim.

I do want to remind one thing, however. When one accepts Islam who is not biologically born into it, they are still considered clean and new. One's relationship with Allah is that. A relationship. Highly personal. In a relationship there is always growth and discovery. It can't be forced. It has to progress on its own. I'm not necessarily addressing this poster personally, but its the attitude of several others that makes me regret posting anything on this subject.

I just find it disappointing.

Jean is there a specific reason you take everything as a personal attack on yourself? These are my opinions and I am free to express them as I like. The same way you are free to constantly express yours. I find it funny that you say that you don't contribute much to religious discussion, as you are in pretty much every thread reagarding it. I didn't insult you or call you a "retarded child" or say that you were inferior. I don't take the posts made my SZSZ and Lostinlove seriously only becuase they are arabic, but to be quite honest their posts are well thought out and unbiased. The same is for Bosco, which even though she is not arabic, I still think her posts are great and I do enjoy reading them. I didn't say it made your belief in Islam less if you convert. You are shoving words down my mouth and I don't appreciate it.

I am still baffled by your actions. It seems anytime we have some kind of constructive debate, you come into the thread and play the part of the victim, storm off, and say your not going to say anything else. Just because we don't agree doesn't mean we are flaming each other.

You may take my words as an attack on you personally, but they weren't intended in that way. They triggered a personal frustration with this board that I've had since I joined. It wasn't directed at you personally. I was no shoving words down your throat.

As far as playing the part of the victim or storming off or supplying my opinions, its no different then you supplying yours. If you have a problem with me please feel free to exercise the ignore feature. I've already mentioned previously that I'm not quite myself these days and am frankly having a hard time. I didn't think that meant I had to leave the forum. This is the only support system I have. I am just who I am, and doing the best I can. Again, feel free to block me. I won't be offended.

And I will from now on keep my religious opinions to myself.

Jean one thing about board ettiquitte is that if you are going to quote someone in your reply that usually means your post is directed at them or what they said. I don't take your words as an attack at all, I am simply asking YOU why think everthing is a personal attack on yourself. I have seen you play the victim time and time again and get offended by things people say that don't even concern you. They are just opinions, take them with a grain of salt. Everyone here is equally frustrated and you are not the only by any means. Supplying opinions is fine, saying you don't want to play anymore because someone doesn't agree with you is just plain childish.

You constantly talk about how much stress your under as a means for justifying your posts. If you are so frustrated and unhappy with the forum then why do you keep posting? I don't need to block you or anyone else that matter. I have no problems reading peoples posts and if I don't agree with them then that is fine, but I don't feel the need to try to stop debates because i don't agree with the content or threaten not to come back.

I would assume that everyone that contributes to these forums is an adult and therefore should act like one. Playing the victim and storming off is not any way the same as sharing opinions.

[/quot

Not to revisit the scene of the primal crime, but there comes a time when we have to pay our respects to the past without becomming possessed by it.

[amal 4]

wow it's gettin hot in here........

[Bosco 1]

A few observations/reminders (that I can use myself)...

While we are all going through the same process with fiances/spouses from the same region, we are still a very diverse group. We don't normally choose friends or seek support from people based on such a limited criteria - in this case a visa and a MENA spouse.

Some people are much more sensitive than others, others have thicker skins. Some of us are blessed to have strong support systems in our families/friends, others have none. Some have busy social lives, and some have little more at this time than waiting for their spouse. For some, this may be the only major headache you are dealing with in life, and others are struggling with many other issues in their personal lives. All this affects how we react to things and our strength in this process.

Some people have felt genuine bonds on this board, for others it is a transition. For those who really use this board as a support system, perceived slights can be VERY painful - especially if that is a person who you like/respect through this forum.

I remember a time when Henia posted something and got a reaction she didn't expect. In the heat of it, she named names of people whose posts she enjoyed. This also was not well received. If I recall JP, you were one of the people who responded. Likewise, when you posted yesterday and named names of the people whose posts you take seriously, I think some feelings may have been hurt. My point is not at all to call you out on that post, but to shed some light on why Jean may have felt as she did. If we say things like "I like/respect/take seriously only these people's posts", there will be people that feeled snubbed or hurt. We may not realize that other people actually care what we think of them or their opinions (and we may think they shouldn't care), but there are people who do care. Let's face it, there is some bonding that goes on here (which is one reason I think I have not left even though we have GC in hand).

Not sure of my point.... I hate to see someone in our forum hurting whether or not the reaction seems justified from our perspective.

[amal 4]

All I can say is that I respect every opinion and I do my best to understand where everybody is coming from. Now, having said that, sometimes I do take some things too seriously and may have said things in a hateful way but all in all...I love you all !

[noura 0]

wow it's gettin hot in here........

so take off all your clothes....

[Nagishkaw 510]

I thank my Elvis crucifix that I'm not smelling the colour blue or tasting my favourite music or reinventing my wheel of fortune.....I think I will guard my privacy from any misguided snooping.Yup, too hot.