Abuse of power in the American Consulate

[Nasturtium 500]

I don't actually associate automatically with any one group and fraud. I acknowledge some countries are higher fraud statistically than others, but I take each person I meet case-by-case. The more red flags the person spits out, the more I view the relationship as potential fraud. And heck, I think I can name various red flags for just about all of us at some point So it's not much more than just something that is. What gets me more is someone who lives in total denial of their red flags. But that is also not here nor there. I imagine the COs see tons of that all the time and have had to desensitize to emotional plays by couples.

[LaL 418]

^^^ OMG there's another one LaL

[Lisamarie 79]

There are horror stories all over the internet. But like I said before, I think we don't read much about the positive experiences because people are too busy living and enjoying their lives to write about it on the internet.

I was going to mention Daniel Pipes, but he's pretty inflammatory in the Muslim community. To say the least. But yea, I posted on there myself after getting screwed over by a Moroccan guy online about 6 years ago.

[Lisamarie 79]

In the CO's eyes I imagine the one red flag right off the bat is being American, or western, I should say. Then, being older (for the ones that are older), he approaching her on a dating website, having young children or not being able to have children/or any more children, he not speaking English well, he not having a job, etc. Those aren't in any particular order, but just off the top of my head.

quote name='julianna' timestamp='1298952181' post='4509900']

I don't actually associate automatically with any one group and fraud. I acknowledge some countries are higher fraud statistically than others, but I take each person I meet case-by-case. The more red flags the person spits out, the more I view the relationship as potential fraud. And heck, I think I can name various red flags for just about all of us at some point So it's not much more than just something that is. What gets me more is someone who lives in total denial of their red flags. But that is also not here nor there. I imagine the COs see tons of that all the time and have had to desensitize to emotional plays by couples.

Edited March 1, 2011 by Lisamarie

[KittyPollitt 284]

There are horror stories all over the internet. But like I said before, I think we don't read much about the positive experiences because people are too busy living and enjoying their lives to write about it on the internet.

I see a lot of positive experiences through networking on Facebook. Makes me feel a lot better. I got a positive experience right here, too If it wasn't, his #### would be outdoors!

[Staashi 371]

There are horror stories all over the internet. But like I said before, I think we don't read much about the positive experiences because people are too busy living and enjoying their lives to write about it on the internet.

One would assume that is the case, but every so often on vj, someone pops on after years of being away. Inevitably, they break the news that things didn't work out. Yes, there is shame in it. Especially when someone had been do fvcking adamant - "Oh, not my man. We'll be together forever. We love each other so much." B!tch, please. You don't know. No one knows until the sh!t hits the fan and it's allover but the crying. I just say that if every one in two American marriages ends in divorce, then I cannot even begin to fathom how many immigration-based marriages end up in the toilet.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

One would assume that is the case, but every so often on vj, someone pops on after years of being away. Inevitably, they break the news that things didn't work out. Yes, there is shame in it. Especially when someone had been do fvcking adamant - "Oh, not my man. We'll be together forever. We love each other so much." B!tch, please. You don't know. No one knows until the sh!t hits the fan and it's allover but the crying. I just say that if every one in two American marriages ends in divorce, then I cannot even begin to fathom how many immigration-based marriages end up in the toilet.

I could absolutely tell you lots of stories of amazing relationships that I have had with mena people, both from Morocco and other countries like Algeria and the mid east. Some even spanning 10 years. None of them were marriages. They were friendships based on commonalities and they always included honesty. Several were men and they were all true to themselves and married women from their own country. I have however known several Moroccan women who have married American men and are incredibly happy. One was a Moroccan girl who had been very mistreated by men from her own country. She had come to the US with epcot and had married an American and after she got divorced , she wanted to get married and have kids with a Moroccan and man after man abused her and used her. She finally met a guy who was very prominent, not a millionaire but pretty close and he was about 20 years older. He married her and gave her long dreamed of baby and she is actually beaming with her little son and has a nice time going to places with him and his family, even putting up a Moroccan christmas tree and having cous cous at thanksgiving. I knew her first in 2002 and watched her run through a string of Moroccan guys who used her so badly then talked about her. I have her on my facebook now and its so nice to see her happy.

I have know Moroccan US citizens who honestly have sought out relationships with Americans after using the first,then a horrible relationship with a Moroccan they either married her or brought from there and then they just feel a little lost and sometimes end up with Americans.

Honestly after reading all of this and after the 10 plus years I have been around Moroccans from overseas and here in the US, I love them as friends, I absolutely adore North Africans , even when they are little crapheads but I never ever ever could recommend anyone I knew sponsoring one and giving them papers or bringing them here unless they had an age appropriate and time tested relationship. If you meet a Moroccan here in the US and hes got his papers straightened out and he wants to marry you, then you know the playing field is level. For an older woman trying to throw pennies into the fountain of youth by hooking up with a guy who is alot younger than you, I can only say you absolutely have to plan for the end and try to make it as painfree as possible. Statistically , I have never ever seen one work over a 10 year period. Not one. I have seen some people marry simiilar in age and have kids and struggle along and hang in there but not older younger. We dont want to hear it because somehow it makes us feel like we are less than and in the US, older women have lives, they have boyfriends, they go on after divorce. The shelf life in Morocco is alot shorter and a woman there has to make her marriage count and work because after she has kids and loses her virginity, game over for the most part unless they are upper middle class.

We cannot place our values on another culture.

I personally even with as badly as I got screwed mentally, emotionally and financially will not stop being friends with North Africans and MENA but I would slap the living ####### out of anyone I knew who wanted to mess up their life like I did. It rarely works and perhaps if you arent doing anything better with the next 4 years of your life and dont mind getting used and then walked away from with a thank you if they are nice, then go for it.

What killed me is I heard another Moroccan tell another one, oh dont worry, we never forget people who helped us? What is that supposed to mean? Do I get a gift certificate or a hallmark on the anniversary of the day you got your papers? I think in some misguided way , they have to minimise the impact that this deception has on our lives.

I wish some women who have been hurt would talk about it instead of running away. I think you cant avoid the using, you can only try to survive the aftermath. My whole family had to become involved to help me through this awful situation. I was blackmailed with financial situations and threatened with attempts to take my money and my family's money. My feels run from terror to hate to sadness to hate. I forgive him almost every day but its hard.

[kristen_maroc 126]

I really hate this thread. I know-- the truth hurts-- but it's starting to make me question my fiance, and when I listen to that deep, still voice from within, I trust him completely. JEEZ. And it's not like we have a lot of red flags, just two: I'm a bit overweight, and he is still a student = no job. We're the same age, I've lived in Morocco for 4+ years and refused to date anyone for 3 of them... he's amazing. I love him. ARGH. I really hate reading this because I do not like it when external things place even a seed of doubt.

[Mithra 1,185]

It is what it is. You can't change the truth about certain relationships. I think almost all of us going through this process have had some strange feelings regarding hearing stories of fraud along the way. There does come a time where you have to be secure in your own relationship and try not to pay attention to the stories. I would be willing to bet half if not more of the women who have gone through this have fought with their spouses over some ####### story they've read on here. Most won't admit it though. I'll admit the stories affected me during my "visa journey" and I did feel somewhat insecure especially before my husband came here. And when he did come here I still didn't relax because of the other stories. The stories of what happens after they get here ie abuse, cheating, etc. I finally had enough of letting that affect my life and let it go. If he was going to cheat, lie, leave, etc he was going to do whether or not I was uptight about it. The best thing I ever did was let go of the insecurity. Try to let go now. If not, don't read these threads. I know it's hard to avoid them but try. It does help.

Edited March 1, 2011 by Mithra

[Mithra 1,185]

Couldn't edit and wanted to add - another thing that helps is to never think your relationship is bulletproof or that bad things can't happen. Always keep in mind that you and your SO are human and will make mistakes. Don't go around with the "not my man" attitude. That's a horrible attitude to have. Usually the "not my mans" ARE that guy. Be realistic. My marriage is not perfect, my husband is certainly NOT perfect and neither am I. We've been married 5 years but not one of those years has been without some drama or issues like most ppl. I still don't consider our marriage a total success because it will always need work. I still don't consider us bulletproof.

[msheesha 548]

It is what it is. You can't change the truth about certain relationships. I think almost all of us going through this process have had some strange feelings regarding hearing stories of fraud along the way. There does come a time where you have to be secure in your own relationship and try not to pay attention to the stories. I would be willing to bet half if not more of the women who have gone through this have fought with their spouses over some ####### story they've read on here. Most won't admit it though. I'll admit the stories affected me during my "visa journey" and I did feel somewhat insecure especially before my husband came here. And when he did come here I still didn't relax because of the other stories. The stories of what happens after they get here ie abuse, cheating, etc. I finally had enough of letting that affect my life and let it go. If he was going to cheat, lie, leave, etc he was going to do whether or not I was uptight about it. The best thing I ever did was let go of the insecurity. Try to let go now. If not, don't read these threads. I know it's hard to avoid them but try. It does help.

Amen!

[kristen_maroc 126]

I don't think I'm unrealistic: I know we are not just human, but flawed humans. We both have our issues. We are constantly learning to compromise and communicate and sacrifice and make things work. It's a battle and it will always be one, but it's a battle worth having.

[msheesha 548]

Couldn't edit and wanted to add - another thing that helps is to never think your relationship is bulletproof or that bad things can't happen. Always keep in mind that you and your SO are human and will make mistakes. Don't go around with the "not my man" attitude. That's a horrible attitude to have. Usually the "not my mans" ARE that guy. Be realistic. My marriage is not perfect, my husband is certainly NOT perfect and neither am I. We've been married 5 years but not one of those years has been without some drama or issues like most ppl. I still don't consider our marriage a total success because it will always need work. I still don't consider us bulletproof.

Marriage is WORK!!!

Sometimes it's great; sometimes it's not great.

I think some people think that the time spent on vacation in their spouses' country prepares them for marriage, and that's just delusional! It's like equating two weeks vacation with two weeks of full time work. It just doesn't equate, and sometimes I think these marriages hit really tough spots because they weren't expecting any discomfort, any work along the way, because "oh my gosh, my husband is soooo great & soooo loving & the week and a half we spent on vacation together was perfect!" And, they don't know what to do in the rough spots that any normal marriage absolutely has.

Those are my two cents, and I agree whole heartedly with Mithra; don't be too cocky; don't be too insecure/paranoid. Balance is everything in life, imho!

Edited March 1, 2011 by msheesha

[Mithra 1,185]

I wasn't really referring to you with the be realistic statement. I think we all, at times, have higher hopes about certain things and then end up disappointed. I'm guilty of that. I didn't realize it would take forever for my husband to find a job when he first came here. I didn't take into consideration that he could lose that job and then have a hard time finding another. I didn't realize how long it would take for my husband to become somewhat independant of me or how that would affect me. I wasn't realistic about these things. I thought it would be easier than it is/was. Some women go beyond that and have this idealistic opinion of their husbands. That he's some sort of Adonis and can do no wrong. We've all read about those kinds of opinions around here.

I don't think I'm unrealistic: I know we are not just human, but flawed humans. We both have our issues. We are constantly learning to compromise and communicate and sacrifice and make things work. It's a battle and it will always be one, but it's a battle worth having.

[msheesha 548]

I wasn't prepared for what a b$tchy, impatient teacher/guide I can be sometimes. Then I think about what it would be like for me if I was living in Morocco and he was as impatient with me as I've been to him at times, and I feel like a horrible human being. So, there's that also.

Mithra - how long did it take for the independence to really take hold for your husband?