If Jesus is God . . .

[BishopM 114]

I appreciate the exchange, the very thoughtful contributions, and the civility from each of you Now, I have another question. If there is a God,even be He one of a nuanced trinity, why not just worship God in lieu of His human manifestation as Jesus on earth?

Worshipping God in lieu of his human manifestation on earth is perfectly acceptable. When Christians worship Jesus, they aren't worshipping his corpreal form, but rather they are worshipping his true essence as the Godhead. Recognizing Christ's incarnation in Jesus as the true Godhead is what makes Jesus capable of stating that He is 'The Way'....and also simultaneously reinforces the efforts of all mankind who seek to know God...with or without the great benefit God provided through Jesus.

[luckytxn 2,264]

Quick Thoughts to your great questions, Sister Sofiyaa, so please forgive my 'shortness' on these answers as volumes have be written.

- does that mean that He worshipped himelf: Nah... Jesus washed his disciples feet, settled hierarchial disputes between his disciples John and James regarding who was greater before God, and told them (on multiple occasions) that he who is least is greatest in the eyes of God. Jesus was 'selfless' and taught humility and a life of servitude. So, no need for him to worship his 'selfless self'. As 'God-Man' living both in full humanity and divinity, yet lacking any duality, through the concept of hypostatic union (same essential substance/essence - Trinitarian point of view), I like to think that when Christ prayed (such as he did always) that he was setting the example for others to follow (though this is somewhat shallow minded on my part and I should put more thought into this...).

- does that mean He killed himself? God 'emptied himself' (again, being 'selfless' in the same manner as the question above) during His incarnation in order that he could become incarnate in the fleshy body of Jesus, the man. When Jesus (the man) died on the Cross for the expiation of mankind's sins, it was the flesh that died. God did not die.

Honestly, as a Western person, I never could understand/attempt to answer these types of questions because we tend to be so rationally minded and have no interest in things that we can't 'touch/feel/explain'. It was really only when I started reading from the Hindu/Buddhist scriptures that I came to a new type of understanding which enabled me to grasp (even if only lightly!) the meaning behind the life of Christ. As an example, it is an interesting parallel between the life of Christ and the enlightened life of Siddhartha Qautama (the Buddha). For the Buddha, once he gained enlightenment he thought to himself to just live the remainder of his life in bliss. But, instead he decided to teach and to 'confront the sins' of others in order that some may find the same peace that he'd found. He didn't have to do this, but he did, and changed the world. For Christ, he bore the weight of sin for the past/present/future world through his incarnation/death/resurrection. At times I am amazed by the strength this must have taken! At times, I am bothered with my own family members and their trivial pursuits, not to mention my own trivial pursuits! I know what it means to love, but I imagine that God's love is much greater than my own, but when I think of my own powers of love I like to believe that I would be willing to 'die' for my wife/children/others. Yet, in the reality of my experiences I often find that I am easily bothered by the smallest of what I would deem 'their faults', which become my pet peeves per se. In short, I don't really have the shoulders to bear the weight of my own sins, much less the weight of my sins plus even one other person's sins, no matter how much I proclaim to love them! Yet, Christ shows us tremendous strength in his willingness to shoulder the sins of all mankind...and Buddha showed great strength is his love of mankind by teaching his 8 fold path for the remaining 45 years of his life when he probably could have just sat in a cave and been 'blissful'. Anyways, that is one reason why I admire the men, and one reason why I realize the absolute strength annd blessing of Christ's love which he demonstrated through his short life in Jesus, and on the cross.

Blessings and...as usual...I have rambled for far too long...it probably would have been better to be silent on such deep yet seemingly simple questions! <haha>

BishopM

Brother Mark. Always so in tune and knowledgeable of our great religion and always as usual very humble at the end.

As you know and we talked about briefly I am a non trinitarian but have had to search deeply about this as I begin my new journey into an old but new to me faith. I always have prayed to God and ask him for guidance my whole life and he has blessed me many times by guiding me. I also have my whole life have followed Jesus teachings and taken them into my heart. Jesus teachings have guided me also but he has taught me as only a teacher can do. His life has shown me a path that we can all follow daily. Jesus is one of the few that not only talked the talk but showed by his every action he was sincere. And his end maybe was the crowning glory. After all was said and done he looked up and asked for forgiveness to be shown to his torturers and all who did him wrong as they knew not what they were doing. Very few remember that he cried before this out to his father and asked why he was being forsaken. Everyone I ever asked this of thought he meant that God should have intervened before his brutal treatment. I always thought he meant that he was in agony and wanted it to end and come home. His body had to expire before the final chapter could come though. He could not arise again until he was free from his mortal body. All in all when he knew the time was finally come he asked for only forgiveness to all who brutalized him.

I also when I traveled Asia sought out Buddha and Hindu and tried to understand and did find some enlightment there. It helped me to learn and grow. I also have had many Muslim friends and still have some and they have taught me a lot and helped me to understand some things. The best thing I have ever learned though was that I am still a Christian and an even stronger one the more I learn and go through life. God does not mind if we question him. In fact he welcomes it as he knows that if we do and stay or come back that it will be of our own free will.

Of course someone like my wife who has always been heavily into the Catholic faith and has never known anything else could never imagine questioning anything. She is a saint and I am a lucky man to have her by my side. I pray to God for thanks for giving me her. Having her now has shown me I am blessed. Where before I was a rigid non trinitarian I am now on a journey and have softened and now can see more clearly because her light shines bright.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

These are sincere questions, and not intended to offend. They are not meant to be mocking of Christianity in any way. Jesus is a great prophet in Islam, one who will return on the Day of Judgment, so no observant Muslim would ever disrespect Him. However, because I am a scholar and a perpetual student of religion, I'm always curious about such matters. I've asked these questions of laymen and scholars alike for years, and it's always interesting to see what individuals think. So. . . .

If Jesus is God,

- does that mean He worshipped Himself?

- does that mean He killed Himself?

No. It means you can only out 16 pancakes in a doghouse because a car only has four doors. No soap, means no radio.

If Cinderella's coach really turned into a pumpkin at midnight, what happened to the glass slipper?

Religion is a collection of made up fairy tales and there really is no "serious questions" which can receive serious answers

[웃 910]

There are only a few things provable when it comes to Jesus / God

1) He is mute

2) He is incapable of speaking or communicating

3) He has never been seen

BILLIONS of people have tried to communicate with this unprovable figure but have NEVER gotten a response. So the odds that God can respond are 0 in 10s of billions. Try and speak to Him. See if you get a response

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

There are only a few things provable when it comes to Jesus / God

1) He is mute

2) He is incapable of speaking or communicating

3) He has never been seen

BILLIONS of people have tried to communicate with this unprovable figure but have NEVER gotten a response. So the odds that God can respond are 0 in 10s of billions. Try and speak to Him. See if you get a response

He talks to me all the time. Perhaps you are just not listening.

[sussemadel 16]

No. It means you can only out 16 pancakes in a doghouse because a car only has four doors. No soap, means no radio.

If Cinderella's coach really turned into a pumpkin at midnight, what happened to the glass slipper?

Religion is a collection of made up fairy tales and there really is no "serious questions" which can receive serious answers

I fully agree...somehow though the OP will find a way to make her explanation the "right" one...oh human nature is beautiful.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I fully agree...somehow though the OP will find a way to make her explanation the "right" one...oh human nature is beautiful.

I haven't offered an explanation, nor do I have one. Keep your day job, you suck at human nature

[sussemadel 16]

I haven't offered an explanation, nor do I have one. Keep your day job, you suck at human nature

I'm sure since you're so smart, you'd have a good explanation on all things religious..as per all your previous posts show. Aggh good comeback....doesn't Islam teach you to be more tolerant and not so critical...oh wait...human nature again

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I'm sure since you're so smart, you'd have a good explanation on all things religious..as per all your previous posts show. Aggh good comeback....doesn't Islam teach you to be more tolerant and not so critical...oh wait...human nature again

Did you just come here to bait me? Say yes, or you're lying.

[sussemadel 16]

Playing victim again?

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Playing victim again?

Not my style.

Do you have an opinion re the topic? I am not the topic.

[sussemadel 16]

Like Gary said

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

More head whipping and hair pulling please.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

More head whipping and hair pulling please.

Wrong thread

[웃 910]

If God is reading this (which I know He is not, lol) then show us all a simple sign.....Make VJ have an outage tomorrow for a period of 90 minutes at some point throughout the day....Then we will all know that the invisible unseen never before heard from never before shown a single fraction of a hint to humanity of His existance is actually there.... tick...tock...tick...tock....