When did Christianity stop being evil?

[BishopM 114]

What do you mean by this ambiguous word? One of my favorite theological writers, Joseph Campbell, would declare himself to be "ecumenical", without being religious. Once asked what was his "favorite" religion, he stated that he no longer has the naiveté to prefer any one religion, although he could find the similarity of mythology in all religions.

Peace and Love to you, Brother Mark

By ecumenical, I mean that I believe God loves all of humanity, we're all children of God, and that I'm open and interested in inter-religious discussion. I also mean that I don't have all the answers...and will always seek to learn. Its that simple

In the end, I doubt that any religion knows the mind of God. And, I suspect, that God is too big for any one religion.

Blessings, B-Ji

[luckytxn 2,264]

Thanks for sharing that Sister Sofiyya. +1

Unfortunately, it would seem that most Christians have a similar experience with their own sect (mine is Catholic, and certainly no exception) where their Priets/Pastors have acted inproperly accordinging to the tenets of their own faith. My own personal experiences of 'wrong' in the Church came when I was a young teen in the 70s and it certainly drove me away from the Church for the next 1.5 decades or so. Eventually though you have to judge the faith by its doctrines and not be its 'flock'.

However, when I think of religion (all religions) I do believe that they are all based upon civility and peace, not evil. While I am Catholic, I came to this conclusion through a study of the faith, and studies of other faiths. I don't doubt is that God exists, but as for religion, I believe that God speaks through them to individuals and individuals should align themselves with the faith that speaks to them in the clearest manner. Ya...I know...that can open a can of worms. But, I believe that faiths need to be questioned and held accountable for their teachings more than the way their teachings are distorted by individuals. So, to that end, I don't find one faith to be greater than the other, but I do find Catholicism to be greater for me personally. Again, I'm highly ecumenical, which unfortunately seems to be a trait that has fallen to the wayside in modern Christianity....

Blessings,

BishopM

Nice brother Bishop. I also recently was horrified by the actions of a few at our church. My first reaction was to leave that church and find another but my personal saint who is my wife and her simple words calmed me by saying that it is not the church but the people. It was her nationality that was harmed and if she can turn the other cheek I figure I can as well. If she can peacefully sit among the few that are what I think evil then I guess I can too. Also there is a certain amount of comfort in showing them weekly how evil they are when we come in and sit among them.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

In the end, I doubt that any religion knows the mind of God. And, I suspect, that God is too big for any one religion.

I like that quote very much, Bishop. In my holy book, God says that He chose to allow us to have different beliefs. It is His wish that we find a way to use what we have in common to work toward peace. To that end, for those of us who move toward Him, there will be the rewards, and it will not matter what you were labeled in life - Muslim, Christian, Jew, etc.. What will matter is how you lived, how well you represented your faith in your daily encountered with others. Those who please Him will enter heaven; we are never lead to believe that those who please Him will only be Muslim.

I've long been motivated by the beauty in this edict, although I struggled mightily with Catholicism, having married a Catholic at an early age, thus, bringing it into my home and life unedited for 30 years. My poor husband had to live with my Islam, too, so it was a fair trade. I hope it made us better people and that it shows.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Using Sofiyya's rules..... No Christian has ever done anything evil. Christians that do bad things are not true Christians.

P.S. All this recent Islamic terrorism is really a Jew/Athiest plot. In fact, the planes on 9/11 were piloted by Teddy bears.

[luckytxn 2,264]

Using Sofiyya's rules..... No Christian has ever done anything evil. Christians that do bad things are not true Christians.

P.S. All this recent Islamic terrorism is really a Jew/Athiest plot. In fact, the planes on 9/11 were piloted by Teddy bears.

They were also piloted by terrorists from countries that we have not punished after the fact

[2ndMessiah 184]

Well you misread my post or it wasn't clear due to brevity. There are some Christian groups that do rival Radical Islam and engage in terrorism. However I don't see the level of denial or knee jerk defensiveness from mainstream Christianity regarding those types of groups.

And there is the matter of scale. Mainstream Christians don't cheer abortion clinic bombers or have any problem condemning killers of abortion doctors.

Right so we are just talking the degree of terror then or the amount of supporters. So maybe two or three christian doctor killers is ok but maybe 4 is too many. One act of terrorism by an religious faction is one too many. It is there beliefs that drive them to it.

Islam is a more fundamental and radical, more open support for "Holy wars" but Christian fundalmentalism is just bubbling under the surface. It wasnt that long ago a christian preacher in Florida was calling ofr the burning of the Qur'an. Now they backed off at the last minutes but could you imagine how that could have escalated. All over different ideologies. Its a sad reflection on those who set aside reason for belief.

Edited December 19, 2010 by 2ndMessiah

[Danno 1,228]

Right so we are just talking the degree of terror then or the amount of supporters. So maybe two or three christian doctor killers is ok but maybe 4 is too many. One act of terrorism by an religious faction is one too many. It is there beliefs that drive them to it.

Islam is a more fundamental and radical, more open support for "Holy wars" but Christian fundalmentalism is just bubbling under the surface. It wasnt that long ago a christian preacher in Florida was calling ofr the burning of the Qur'an. Now they backed off at the last minutes but could you imagine how that could have escalated. All over different ideologies. Its a sad reflection on those who set aside reason for belief.

You're swinging the bat but not even coming close to the ball.

There is no "faction" as you put it...of Christian trying to kill abortion doctors (who are also in the business of taking life).

It has been isolated participants.

In fact so isolated was the most notable, that he was living in the mountains and eating out of dumpsters.... until he was caught.

... Not much of an organization chart, I suspect.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

Right so we are just talking the degree of terror then or the amount of supporters. So maybe two or three christian doctor killers is ok but maybe 4 is too many. One act of terrorism by an religious faction is one too many. It is there beliefs that drive them to it.

Islam is a more fundamental and radical, more open support for "Holy wars" but Christian fundalmentalism is just bubbling under the surface. It wasnt that long ago a christian preacher in Florida was calling ofr the burning of the Qur'an. Now they backed off at the last minutes but could you imagine how that could have escalated. All over different ideologies. Its a sad reflection on those who set aside reason for belief.

One idiot committing terror, bad but not a movement.

Several idiots committing terror, also bad obviously, but starting to look like a group. Perhaps it is even a zealous group which holds their beliefs justify their actions. Targets are few, and quite specific, i.e. abortion clinic bombers and abortion doctor murderers.

Hundreds, even thousands, with an organization spread worldwide exibitng both political and spiritual wings and you start get to the level of Radical Islam, which is more or less cheered in the region where Islam was born, even if active participants are relatively few amongst the majority population and you start to get to an understanding of scale.

Bad.

BAD.

REALLY BAD.

[B_J 2,752]

I'm not sure, but aren't all of the people who committed the abortion clinic bombings and murders currently in prison? Aren't they serving life sentences? And I honestly consider these to be true acts of Christian terrorism. They committed these acts in the name their religion. But the key to me is the response. They are in prison.

All I really want is, when there is an act of terrorism by any other religion, that there be the same response. Other countries shouldn't hide these criminals; they should put them behind bars.

B.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

B. The Catholic Church is clearly anti-abortion but did you see any dancing and cheering at the Vatican the last time an abortion doctor was murdered? No.

We did see an awful lot of cheering across the Muslim world after 911. Curious no?

That was the point I was driving at, support for terrorism which some here work so hard denying exists.

Edited December 20, 2010 by ready4ONE

[B_J 2,752]

B. The Catholic Church is clearly anti-abortion but did you see any dancing and cheering at the Vatican the last time an abortion doctor was murdered? No.

We did see an awful lot of cheering across the Muslim world after 911. Curious no?

That was the point I was driving at, support for terrorism which some here work so hard denying exists.

I think we're making the same point.

[2ndMessiah 184]

You're swinging the bat but not even coming close to the ball.

There is no "faction" as you put it...of Christian trying to kill abortion doctors (who are also in the business of taking life).

It has been isolated participants.

In fact so isolated was the most notable, that he was living in the mountains and eating out of dumpsters.... until he was caught.

... Not much of an organization chart, I suspect.

I used abortion doctors as an example (probably a bad one).

Do you not find it twisted tho, that it is a crime to kill a collection of cells but hey its ok to kill fully gorwn fully developed functioning human beings.

But one death in any gods name is one too many.

Yes there are Factions. Baptists, Prodestant, Catholic, Methodist. All factions in Christianity.

faction - members of a group or organization who hold views not representative of the group and usually more extreme the radical fringe.

[The_Dude 1,142]

Do you not find it twisted tho, that it is a crime to kill a collection of cells but hey its ok to kill fully gorwn fully developed functioning human beings.

It's only warped if you think in such deluded terms.

[2ndMessiah 184]

It's only warped if you think in such deluded terms.

Surely from an christian point of view life is life and the taking of it is a sin?

Double standards, but then again belief drives people to do daft things.

Anyway,good luck to those in "immigration hell" and have faith that sensible minds will prevail.

[Dan and Judy 614]

I dont have any expertise in this subject but here is something to think about.

I think in some states at least, if a robber was to shoot a pregnant woman and her baby died.

the state could charge him with murder and then execute him for the crime.

and in that same state the woman could decide to have an abortion (kill the fetus) with no penalty

Im guessing there is a state where that is true.

Also to muddy the waters.

If there is a guy standing on a corner shooting people indiscriminately

and somebody shoots him and kills him. that person would probably get a medal.

If somebody believes that killing the fetus is equivilent to murder it seems to me that killing the doctor would be morally equivilent to shooting the guy on the corner.

Does the fact that congress passed a particular law make it right

Of course there have to be laws, and if they are broken there have to consequences

but if someone believes there is a higher authority that says killing the fetus is murder

would he not have a moral obligation to take action in spite of the consequences?

Previously congress has passed laws that run away slaves must be returned to their masters

Did that make it morally right?