Sorry, Hamas, I'm Wearing Blue Jeans

[ready4ONE 5,400]

Sometimes she answers but usually in accusations or riddles.

[james&olya 1,121]

Sometimes you can say something and people will misinterpet it. for instance

I said " Sorry I dont have a PDA, I've never used one."

You misinterpetted that as an apology when in fact it was just me feeling sorry that I cant afford a PDA.

Sofi is a brilliant rhetorician and she knows her subject

this is an example of one of her straight answers, and then me trying to guess what the answer was.

Was the girl that was getting caned for wearing pants being persecuted?

Women are often the immediate targets of authorities during periods of political turmoil and conflict in any society. It is easy for men who feel otherwise powerless to control and oppress women. In most societies, what is acceptable dress for women directly reflects the current societal mood toward womens' autonomy, or the lack of it. This has been true even in the US, which has swung from uptight Victorian garb, through the era of the Flapper Girl, the Earth Mother, mini skirts and bikinis, that accompanied the sexual liberation movement of the 60s, but left rape victims being tried in American courtrooms for "asking for it" via their dress.

What I'm saying, in a rather clinical manner, is that women all over the world face arbitrary cultural barriers that dictate the limits of their community participation. That is not meant to excuse the intrusion into her private sphere nor the punishment inflicted. It means that it doesn't surprise me at all because the language of clothing is highly regulated in much of the world to control women. The punishment varies, from place to place, but is not commonly so immediate or physical.

I think you are saying "No" the girl is not being persecuted. She was simply facing an arbitrary cultural barrier.

What she was trying desperately to avoid, was saying that the girl getting caned was being persecuted by muslims. She talked all around the subject without ever answering the question. I was a little dizzy when I got done reading it. I didn't disagree with a single thing she said but she never did answer the question.

A rule for politicians is "never answer the question they ask, answer the question you wanted them to ask" I'll say it again Sofi is brilliant at this and there is very little she says that I actually disagree with.

by the way she didn't say she couldnt read the question. this is what she said

"I am on my PDA and can't see the third question anymore, so I'll need to close here, for now."

Now if I use my scroll bar I can honestly tell you that I can't read that quote any more. Sofi chooses her words very carefully.

Anyway it was my conclusion that she was ducking the question.

Then she went with the "ARE YOU CALLING ME A LIAR" ploy.

followed by the "Its because Im Palistinian" trick

ending with the "Have a great Day" Im done with you close.

Im still concluding she dosnt want to answer the question.

Well, I am a bit new to this discussion so I don't have your perspective. Is it possible that she is ducking the question because the whole victim mentality thing is something she really wants to avoid? So much of what she says belies a much more tolerant and mature approach than what you usually hear from aggrieved minorities. Just wondering.

[Dan and Judy 614]

Well, I am a bit new to this discussion so I don't have your perspective. Is it possible that she is ducking the question because the whole victim mentality thing is something she really wants to avoid? So much of what she says belies a much more tolerant and mature approach than what you usually hear from aggrieved minorities. Just wondering.

You know, Sofiyya, between your posts and the inflammatory (Quran or Bible?) quote you have at the bottom of your panels, it surprises me that the responses you get are as gentle as they are. Just sayin'... I think we could all try to find the common ground and learn more tolerance regardless of our backgrounds.

This is you falling into the trap she layed(she would have been much happier if a raging bigot said she was try start WWIII) You were taking the cant we all be freinds angle

Frankly, you should look up the meaning of the word "tolerance". It aint pretty. Barebones toleration is plentiful here; respect isn't. Ya know, I long got over the idea that there would be much empathy for my "minority" perspective as the only Muslim who regularly posts here, considering the bait material that constantly appears and the fact that some of the non-Muslims who respond have made it abundantly clear that they no interest in learning because they already know more about Muslims and Islam from reading blogs and articlesthan any Muslim does, and it's all bad. Since you're attacking me, I dont expect you to be any different.

As for my siggy, it refers to a recurring theme here. It's interesting that you don't know where it's from.

This is her venting and making you look like a fool, You had sort of done that for yourself (as "christian" not knowing the bible") but she was rubbing it in. Of course it's an assumption that you consider your self christian. If you had looked it up first and noted that it was from the bible you would have been covered. anyway you werent trying to debate the pro's and con's of muslims vs

christians. You were searching for that warm fuzzy feeling. She slammed you to the ground.

This is me pointing out that she is not wanting warm fuzzy feelings, If she was she wouldnt have slammed you. The choice of gender was not an accident. to me the writting seemed to be that of a man. Thats is not intended as an insult or compliment, thats just what my gut told me. inspite of the picture provided (believe it or not, Im not really a monkey )

The quote is from the bible, It's hardly fair to blame Sofi for that.

He's not looking for gentle responses.

He's feeling persecuted.

I was merely pointing out the feeling of persecution was the reason she felt the need to slam you and make zingers. The majority of what I read from her was complaining about how the Muslims are treated and stereotyped. Most of her complaints are probably reasonable and she's right the muslims get stereotyped. but she is also playing games and getting her zings in. She has a superior intellect and she's good at it. but then she switches to the "Im only hear to educate" and peace love as taught in the koran stuff. It does seem to confuse her advesaries.

She chose to take exception to my statement that she felt persecuted, so the game between her and I was on.

She knew it was a game as well as I. She is an expert. The latter complaint of hers that I fooled her, and she was trying to give me straight answers is hogwash

I had no idea it would end with her not wanting to answer a question about the jews.

To quote Danno

I hear ya..... but thats what swimming in the deep end is all about.

To quote You

The problem is that sometimes it isn't the water that's deep!

To answer your question about wanting to avoid the victim mentality thing, Yes she would like to avoid it but she can't . It is part of her. She can deny it, but that wont make it go away.

To conclude I think Sofi is brilliant and I agree with most of what she says

.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Wow, just wow.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

Wow, just wow.

And still no answer to the third question. Like anybody here is surprised.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

It sounds like an opinion has already been assigned to me, along with several motivations. Apparently, some of you don't need me to tell you what I think, so don't ask. I've been on this site for a lot longer than you guys. Anyone who matters knows the real answer I would give freely. It's not like the subject is a new one, or that I have anything to prove to you.

Catch ya later!

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

It sounds like an opinion has already been assigned to me, along with several motivations. Apparently, some of you don't need me to tell you what I think, so don't ask. I've been on this site for a lot longer than you guys. Anyone who matters knows the real answer I would give freely. It's not like the subject is a new one, or that I have anything to prove to you.

Catch ya later!

And there you have it people. Another not-so-artful dodge.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

And there you have it people. Another not-so-artful dodge.

[james&olya 1,121]

And there you have it people. Another not-so-artful dodge.

Maybe.

I admit I am curious as to what her answer might be to the question but since she chooses not to answer it maybe some of us will never know. Not sure that it really matters though. I understand what you say about her posts and agree you may have a bit of a point. On the other hand it appears to me that her unique experience and insights position her well to help many of us, even some of us that think we might already be well-informed, understand the complexities of these issues better. I did initially start to get drawn in by her provocations but I don't hold that against her. To the contrary, I appreciate anyone who can poke at ideas I have and deflate the ones without substance, allowing me to develop ones that hold up to criticism. So I appreciate what she does here, though it sounds as if she has irritated a few of you. While she may be no Socrates, my understanding is that is how he educated, inspired, but also irritated the the hell out of the powers that be till they executed him.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Sofiyya is so angry. I hope she can find a productive way to channel her energy.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Maybe.

I admit I am curious as to what her answer might be to the question but since she chooses not to answer it maybe some of us will never know. Not sure that it really matters though. I understand what you say about her posts and agree you may have a bit of a point. On the other hand it appears to me that her unique experience and insights position her well to help many of us, even some of us that think we might already be well-informed, understand the complexities of these issues better. I did initially start to get drawn in by her provocations but I don't hold that against her. To the contrary, I appreciate anyone who can poke at ideas I have and deflate the ones without substance, allowing me to develop ones that hold up to criticism. So I appreciate what she does here, though it sounds as if she has irritated a few of you. While she may be no Socrates, my understanding is that is how he educated, inspired, but also irritated the the hell out of the powers that be till they executed him.

James, get this straight. They have no point. Ever since this forum started, they have done nothing more than post threads or hijack other people's threads to use them as a platform to demean Muslims and denigrate Islam. They have done this with dozens of threads for months. I have no obligation to comply to their manipulations. For them, mocking others is sport and they believe they have found a forum that allows them to attack Muslims with no moderation. And, it seems they have.

I will not be defined by haters, but if you choose, you can allow them to define others for you. It won't be pretty; they don't like anyone who is not like themselves, and, if you are a nice person, you don't want to be like them.

Do yourself a favor; look at the older threads and see who it is that's been spreading hate and division on this board. I guarantee you, it won't be me.

I suggest you start with this thread.

Sofiyya is so angry. I hope she can find a productive way to channel her energy.

Maybe I sound angry, I'm not, but it's better than sounding stupid, like some on this thread.

[james&olya 1,121]

James, get this straight. They have no point. Ever since this forum started, they have done nothing more than post threads or hijack other people's threads to use them as a platform to demean Muslims and denigrate Islam. They have done this with dozens of threads for months. I have no obligation to comply to their manipulations. For them, mocking others is sport and they believe they have found a forum that allows them to attack Muslims with no moderation. And, it seems they have.

I will not be defined by haters, but if you choose, you can allow them to define others for you. It won't be pretty; they don't like anyone who is not like themselves, and, if you are a nice person, you don't want to be like them.

Do yourself a favor; look at the older threads and see who it is that's been spreading hate and division on this board. I guarantee you, it won't be me.

I suggest you start with this thread.

Maybe I sound angry, I'm not, but it's better than sounding stupid, like some on this thread.

Sofiyya, be assured I will not let anyone define you other than you. I understand, I think, where you are coming from and I have no problem with it. By acknowledging the point he was making, specifically that you are dodging a question, does not mean that I find that to be terribly important. I understand these issues are complex and it may be the wisest course of action for you to dodge the questions that serve to 'set you up'. I used to be very good at that sort of question myself. I thought I was terribly clever when I regularly got suspended from my religious school for asking questions that the teachers found they could not answer. It was immature but as a teenager maybe somewhat normal. I like that this forum allows people the freedom to say what they really think. Some of it is quite alarming but until you know what people are really thinking it is hard to know how to deal with their ignorance. Now I find myself trying a different tactic that is a little gentler. Whether it works as well I don't know. I do know that many years ago it worked for me to get me thinking in a different paradigm than the ignorant, right-wing mentality I grew up with and that I see demonstrated here so often.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

I suggest you start with this thread.

Maybe I sound angry, I'm not, but it's better than sounding stupid, like some on this thread.

Pages 4 & 5 of that thread for sure. Your not even good at this. You avoid blunt obvious questions, and then you cry about what you don't like on here...yet you feel compelled to post anyways. Give it up.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Pages 4 & 5 of that thread for sure. Your not even good at this. You avoid blunt obvious questions, and then you cry about what you don't like on here...yet you feel compelled to post anyways. Give it up.

Keep trying to tell me what to do. It's probably better than sex for you, . . . if you get any at all.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Sofiyya, be assured I will not let anyone define you other than you. I understand, I think, where you are coming from and I have no problem with it. By acknowledging the point he was making, specifically that you are dodging a question, does not mean that I find that to be terribly important. I understand these issues are complex and it may be the wisest course of action for you to dodge the questions that serve to 'set you up'. I used to be very good at that sort of question myself. I thought I was terribly clever when I regularly got suspended from my religious school for asking questions that the teachers found they could not answer. It was immature but as a teenager maybe somewhat normal. I like that this forum allows people the freedom to say what they really think. Some of it is quite alarming but until you know what people are really thinking it is hard to know how to deal with their ignorance. Now I find myself trying a different tactic that is a little gentler. Whether it works as well I don't know. I do know that many years ago it worked for me to get me thinking in a different paradigm than the ignorant, right-wing mentality I grew up with and that I see demonstrated here so often.

I used to ask, if God knew what we were going to do before we did it, why punish us for it? To this day, that remains unanswered, and I've spent my life studying God.

Thanks for your open mind. It's a breath of fresh air here. I posted a partial history of Muslim bashing on this board and sent you a link. You'll see why I don't feel they deserve an answer. Dan and Judy is new to me, but Why_Ne is here for one thing only, to spread hate and division. His posting history makes that clear.