Dual Citizenship

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

Like many of you, I've been reading up on dual citizenship for many months now. I just recently found a page that I personally find to be superb, as it hits the nails on the head, exactly, and covers issues that I've never seen before.

A must read, IMHSHO.

(Also, check out the "other pages on that site!)

http://www.newcitizen.us/dual.html

[Captain Oates 911]

Dual voting is a myth for the Brits

They send the voting forms out a few days before the election and they have to be back on polling day and you need to have another Brit living overseas to countersign

For a Brit living in a desert on Pacific time, it takes 7 to 10 days to receive a UK letter and the same for return - so basically it is a totally impossibility to get one's vote recorded

One can nominate a proxy, but my lot were either killed by the Germans or died or left the country or can't be arsed.

[v333k 59]

Thanks! A good article!

[OBX 51]

Excellent resource. Thanks Bob.

[CVB 18]

Great job Bob. It's nice to know there is nothing to worry about.

Still... be aware we never will be considered the same as the natural born ones. You always will be considered a naturalized immigrant.

I just hope they never get it into their heads to force American citizenship upon us because I would refuse to give up my Belgian citizenship. I am and always will feel Belgian in the first place.

Edited December 14, 2010 by CVB

[Captain Oates 911]

Great job Bob. It's nice to know there is nothing to worry about.

Still... be aware we never will be considered the same as the natural born ones. You always will be considered a naturalized immigrant.

I just hope they never get it into their heads to force American citizenship upon us because I would refuse to give up my Belgian citizenship. I am and always will feel Belgian in the first place.

Wait until you get your passport and it says 'Nationality - USA' - its then it hits you. I thought I was just beoming a citizen, I didnt realise I was changing my nationality - joke - sort of

Anyway it must be nice to be Belgian and the same Nationality as Plastic Bertrand

[NickD 202]

Congratulations, Bob on becoming a dual citizen, or didn't you have your oath ceremony yet?

Of course, the Department of State doesn't like that dual citizenship term, they like dual nationality. And tolerate is the key word, although they give no choice to the naturalized citizen to become a dual citizen and they should call it that, because that is what it is by putting your place of birth on your US passport. Some countries will not let you in if they see that your place of birth is that country on your US passport. And insist you maintain your citizenship in that country with a valid ID and their passport. With that ID, you are an official citizen of that country.

USCIS has a slightly different outlook on this subject, really realize you have no choice of where you were born, so put down your former country that you were a citizen of. Really again not much of a choice if you went to a neighboring country just so you could find a job and not live in complete poverty. So on your US certificate of naturalization, they put your former nationality.

This wouldn't make much difference to you if you were a lonely orphan of that country, but if you have family there, may want to visit them occasionally. If this is the case, you have to maintain dual citizenship, whether you were born there or was the only place you could find a job. This also puts those that want to become US citizens at risk because to do so, have to live here. That author of that site you posted uses that term global economy in a positive way. I look at it in a negative way, because our government controls what we can manufacture here and if a bit messy, prefers to have these jobs sent overseas rather than develop technology to keep those jobs here. But being two faced like they are, are now talking about the world environment rather than the local environment. Especially since the major form of pollution in California is now coming across the pond from China.

Of course the USA want immigrants, either with advance degrees that we seem to lack here because our universities have become so expensive, our own people can't afford to go anymore. Or finding a US citizen with plenty of bucks to support them while still paying outrageous taxes so we can become and are the most powerful military in the world. But they sure don't want the poor.

But if you come here and still want to visit your mom, you are forced to maintain dual citizenship. Don't bother writing the president, your senator, and your congressman on this issue, none of them actually have any knowledge of the 1,525 government agencies they have already created and don't have the slightest idea of or interest in what they are doing. They just want your vote.

[Captain Oates 911]

The whole thing about dual citizenship mirrors our world and our lives in general.

It depends which angle you are coming from.

In Europe my Nationality is British. In the USA my nationality is USA.

To a 16 year old I am an old gimmer. To a 75 year old I am a slip of a lad. To a Right wing Conservative I am a foreign commie who should be shot or at least deported. To a left wing union man I am a sell out to my birth class and a selfish fat cat.

The answer is - if you can't please everybody then you might as well please yourself.

It's great that I can live and work anywhere from Hawaii to Crete and Alaska to Tenerife and I will be 'at home' on a home passport.

The only place I will get a stamp in my passport is the USA as the Europeans or British will not stamp my British pass - just wave me through.

I want to vote in UK and European elections but I might have to give a proxy to my MP as the mailing deadlines are too tight

If the USA played England at football (soccer) I would support the USA to encourage the game here

If I was told to give up one passport it would be the USA one as the British one might save my life if I got sick - and that of my USC wife as it is so easy to get her a UK green card

Edited December 14, 2010 by Alan the Red

[NickD 202]

Just feel that your US passport should identify you as a US citizen and nothing else whether you were natural born or naturalized. Regarding any relations with your home country, that is your business as long as it does not conflict with the laws of this country.

Just leave off the place of birth, not your choice where you were born.

[Captain Oates 911]

Just feel that your US passport should identify you as a US citizen and nothing else whether you were natural born or naturalized. Regarding any relations with your home country, that is your business as long as it does not conflict with the laws of this country.

Just leave off the place of birth, not your choice where you were born.

That's what I mean Nick - it all depends on your perspective and your perspective is the American perspective and so is mine while I am here

While I am in Britain, I am a British passport carrying natural born British Citizen and that has not changed.

When the border guy at Leeds asks me my Nationality - I say British - and it is true

When the border guy at Seattle asks me my Nationality - I say American - and it is true

When I travel elsewhere I have the choice - in Teheran I would probably go for Brit but it's close

That is how it is and it is a lot easier for a Brit to accept that than a natural born American because of the powerful culture differences. Where I went school there was no hand on heart and facing the flag and pledge of allegiance and misty eyed mysticism. The Brits are pragmatic and whatever works. It's just a culture diff and who is to say which is right ?

That jewish guy big j had it down right >>

"Give unto Sarah that which is Sarah's, and give unto Yorkshire that which is Yorkshire's"

ps David Soul (Starsky and Hutch)became a British Citizen and enjoys that - I bet he still calls himself an American when he comes back here.

[Captain Oates 911]

David Soul - am American becoming a Briton (too)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/david-soul-my-home-is-where-my-art-is-535323.html

[NickD 202]

That's what I mean Nick - it all depends on your perspective and your perspective is the American perspective and so is mine while I am here

While I am in Britain, I am a British passport carrying natural born British Citizen and that has not changed.

When the border guy at Leeds asks me my Nationality - I say British - and it is true

When the border guy at Seattle asks me my Nationality - I say American - and it is true

When I travel elsewhere I have the choice - in Teheran I would probably go for Brit but it's close

That is how it is and it is a lot easier for a Brit to accept that than a natural born American because of the powerful culture differences. Where I went school there was no hand on heart and facing the flag and pledge of allegiance and misty eyed mysticism. The Brits are pragmatic and whatever works. It's just a culture diff and who is to say which is right ?

That jewish guy big j had it down right >>

"Give unto Sarah that which is Sarah's, and give unto Yorkshire that which is Yorkshire's"

ps David Soul (Starsky and Hutch)became a British Citizen and enjoys that - I bet he still calls himself an American when he comes back here.

Can say anything you want, but your US passport gives your nationality or place of birth if the same away. Its not that my wife is ashamed of where she was born, its the fact that she has to maintain her home country passport as well just to visit her mom. Thought this would be history after she got her US citizenship.

It's not that I object to her having an extra passport, but to maintain that passport is a great expense and time consuming project, only three of those consulates in the entire USA! Wouldn't be bad if you could drop a check in the mail and receive that passport, but they want to see you in person. And some aren't exactly nice since you came here. Also wouldn't be that bad if it was legal for me to pound the living ####### out of them if they are nasty, but can't do that either, have to be nice. I hate being nice.

[Captain Oates 911]

Can say anything you want, but your US passport gives your nationality or place of birth if the same away. Its not that my wife is ashamed of where she was born, its the fact that she has to maintain her home country passport as well just to visit her mom. Thought this would be history after she got her US citizenship.

It's not that I object to her having an extra passport, but to maintain that passport is a great expense and time consuming project, only three of those consulates in the entire USA! Wouldn't be bad if you could drop a check in the mail and receive that passport, but they want to see you in person. And some aren't exactly nice since you came here. Also wouldn't be that bad if it was legal for me to pound the living ####### out of them if they are nasty, but can't do that either, have to be nice. I hate being nice.

That's not true because you have too much sense of right and wrong so you are a natural born 'Nice'

If I had escaped from some fly blown garbage tip of a dictator's or anarchistic country, I would gladly throw my old passport away and start saying that the US is finest country in the history of the world and that I am deeply in love with it and the constitution was inspired by god etc etc like they do.

As it is, I need my red passport in case I get sick and the insurance people kick me into the gutter to die in this land of milk and honey.

At that point I jump on a yookay plane from Seattle, tell em hooray I am back to stay - and they spend a bundle on me for free - all of which they owe me for all my male ancestors soldiering and dying and the hundreds of thousands of tax I paid there.

So between the two passports, I have a health care safety net and eight inches rain per annum - so I am doing all right.

At that stage some people say 'I'm all right Jack so pull up the ladder'

I am not like that so I will push for a fear-free and forever present health care system here. Health care IS a right as much as public protection from being murdered - and should be like a baby's mother - always there for us unconditionally. The rest of politics is up for grabs.

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

Nick,

I'm not there yet, still have to take the Oath, but thanks anyway.

Listen, I know exactly where you are coming from and the thingi with your wife and the insane laws of the Colombian Government which is heavily influenced by the all-mighty the drug cartels are really an exception to the rule.

I can have a US passport (which I soon will have), my mom can be German (which she was), my dad Swedish (also true) and I can be born in South Africa. That still doesn't me an African American, not even a white African American like Theresa Heinz-Kerry, and so there would be no need for me to carry a South African passport for the rest of my life.

Despite your personal dilemma, the country of birth means squat, especially since jus soli has rather been abolished from the civilized nations, save for Yankeeland.

[Captain Oates 911]

Nick,

I'm not there yet, still have to take the Oath, but thanks anyway.

Listen, I know exactly where you are coming from and the thingi with your wife and the insane laws of the Colombian Government which is heavily influenced by the all-mighty the drug cartels are really an exception to the rule.

I can have a US passport (which I soon will have), my mom can be German (which she was), my dad Swedish (also true) and I can be born in South Africa. That still doesn't me an African American, not even a white African American like Theresa Heinz-Kerry, and so there would be no need for me to carry a South African passport for the rest of my life.

Despite your personal dilemma, the country of birth means squat, especially since jus soli has rather been abolished from the civilized nations, save for Yankeeland.

I would like the RIGHT to be President - but just so I can say I am not a second category American Citizen

Edited December 14, 2010 by Alan the Red