The internet and Inhumanity

[alienlovechild 75]

ok I am calling you on this. What is your opinion of someone who says Mexican families should be machine gunned in the river as they try to swim to the USA ?

You offer no words of condemnation on this statement.

Apart from saying they have a right to say it, do you have any opinion on whether what they advocate is anti christian or anti patriotic or anti american

Let's see your true colors - don't be shy

Making more demands? Tact isn't one your qualities but we like directness here.

If you disagree with gunning down Mexican illegally crossing the border, explain why instead of taking center stage as a Brit waving an American flag while yakking on about the Founding Father's intent when your ancestors were busy hanging everyone they got their hands on. The anti-Christian part is probably as sincere as an empty Anglican church on Sunday but you may be the exception.

It's great that you can be on equal footing with the locals in this country; whereas, I'd never really be seen truly British once I started spouting off about British values and waving a dozen Union Jacks. Pushing Christian values in the UK probably would be seen as joke but I never tried that one there.

Shooting illegal Mexicans is a bad policy without your oddball pleas to the better angels of the yokels' character. We don't need a border war with one of our largest trading partners (with oil to boot) and the bad economy is driving many illegals out. The city I work in is about 40% Hispanic (mostly Mexican), I speak some Spanish, my wife is frequently mistaken for Mexican and my brother-in-law is Mexican-American so I've thought about this issue longer than you have and I always correct mistaken beliefs whenever I hear them including yours.

[_Simpson_ 250]

I was just listening to a radio report of prisoners being burned to death in a fire that some of them started

in a prison in Chile. I could almost hear the Internet posts of people saying " Serve em right" and "They should all have fried, we need more of that"

It depresses me to think that I might be mixing with the people who think like that

I go to my rifle club and people say that Mexican families should be machine - gunned if they try and swim the river to the US side

Who are these people who think and talk like that ? I have yet to find one who doesn't claim to be Christian at the same time as saying these things.

They believe in executing people without trial and kidnapping and torturing foreign nationals as required

Why is there no disapproval and censure of these people in the USA ? They are as anti- christian and anti-American as they can possibly be - and yet claim to be committed examples of both.

Surely this thinking is totally opposed to every thought of the founding fathers and the constitution and the law of the land and the flag which represents all those things

So how do they get away with it and still claim to be patriots ?

How do they get away with it and still mix in normal human society ?

Its a well known fact that there is no shortage of stupid people but the fact that a good amount of them has found there way to you has me wondering more about you than them.

[Captain Oates 911]

Making more demands? Tact isn't one your qualities but we like directness here.

If you disagree with gunning down Mexican illegally crossing the border, explain why instead of taking center stage as a Brit waving an American flag while yakking on about the Founding Father's intent when your ancestors were busy hanging everyone they got their hands on. The anti-Christian part is probably as sincere as an empty Anglican church on Sunday but you may be the exception.

It's great that you can be on equal footing with the locals in this country; whereas, I'd never really be seen truly British once I started spouting off about British values and waving a dozen Union Jacks. Pushing Christian values in the UK probably would be seen as joke but I never tried that one there.

Shooting illegal Mexicans is a bad policy without your oddball pleas to the better angels of the yokels' character. We don't need a border war with one of our largest trading partners (with oil to boot) and the bad economy is driving many illegals out. The city I work in is about 40% Hispanic (mostly Mexican), I speak some Spanish, my wife is frequently mistaken for Mexican and my brother-in-law is Mexican-American so I've thought about this issue longer than you have and I always correct mistaken beliefs whenever I hear them including yours.

If I need to 'explain why' gunning down Mexican families is a bad thing, we are not going to get anywhere on that.

I am an American now and you can't use my ethnicity to put me back into a cage where you can't hear my opinions. I was an alien for long enough and those days have gone. You don't even value the act of become a Naturalized Citizen. You don't value human life. What do you value ?

By the way, you have no idea where my ancestors were in 1776. The guy who's picture is on the $10 note is a naturalized American and a former Brit. I wonder what your ancestors said to him.

Seems to me that some 'natural borns' have no allegiance at all to basic American ideals of decency and equality.

Basically you can't stand toe to toe with me in an exchange of ideas and so you go straight to try and devalue me on a personal basis by referring to my ethnicity and my ancestors from hundreds of years ago.

Like I am going to blame you for murdering Cherokees or setting dogs on black people or something

You still won't disavow people who want to kill mexican families swimming the river and you ask me to explain what is wrong with it - so people can draw their own conclusions about your opinion on that

Edited December 8, 2010 by Alan the Red

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I was just listening to a radio report of prisoners being burned to death in a fire that some of them started

in a prison in Chile. I could almost hear the Internet posts of people saying " Serve em right" and "They should all have fried, we need more of that"

It depresses me to think that I might be mixing with the people who think like that

I go to my rifle club and people say that Mexican families should be machine - gunned if they try and swim the river to the US side

Who are these people who think and talk like that ? I have yet to find one who doesn't claim to be Christian at the same time as saying these things.

They believe in executing people without trial and kidnapping and torturing foreign nationals as required

Why is there no disapproval and censure of these people in the USA ? They are as anti- christian and anti-American as they can possibly be - and yet claim to be committed examples of both.

Surely this thinking is totally opposed to every thought of the founding fathers and the constitution and the law of the land and the flag which represents all those things

So how do they get away with it and still claim to be patriots ?

How do they get away with it and still mix in normal human society ?

IMO, I think the internet has given an avenue for people to say things out loud that they'd never say in public. It's kind of like the way some people turn into a$$holes as soon as they are behind the wheel of a vehicle. If there was some way to assign accountability with what people say on the internet, maybe we'd read less outrageously stupid and callously inhumane statements.

[Captain Oates 911]

IMO, I think the internet has given an avenue for people to say things out loud that they'd never say in public. It's kind of like the way some people turn into a$$holes as soon as they are behind the wheel of a vehicle. If there was some way to assign accountability with what people say on the internet, maybe we'd read less outrageously stupid and callously inhumane statements.

I am ok with outrageously stupid but inhumane makes me boil - but at least we know what some of the people around us are thinking and what can happen if we don't make sure the govt and everyone complies with the law and basic decency

Abu Ghraib happens

Let em put in the public arena so we can see them for what they are and what we are up against

[Obama 2012 1,714]

I am ok with outrageously stupid but inhumane makes me boil - but at least we know what some of the people around us are thinking and what can happen if we don't make sure the govt and everyone complies with the law and basic decency

Abu Ghraib happens

Let em put in the public arena so we can see them for what they are and what we are up against

be very careful what you wish for.

Don't be asking for something like this unless you're willing to let someone else (possible one of those who you are complaining about) control what you can and cannot say in some way.

[alienlovechild 75]

If I need to 'explain why' gunning down Mexican families is a bad thing, we are not going to get anywhere on that.

I am an American now and you can't use my ethnicity to put me back into a cage where you can't hear my opinions. I was an alien for long enough and those days have gone. You don't even value the act of become a Naturalized Citizen. You don't value human life. What do you value ?

By the way, you have no idea where my ancestors were in 1776. The guy who's picture is on the $10 note is a naturalized American and a former Brit. I wonder what your ancestors said to him.

Seems to me that some 'natural borns' have no allegiance at all to basic American ideals of decency and equality.

Basically you can't stand toe to toe with me in an exchange of ideas and so you go straight to try and devalue me on a personal basis by referring to my ethnicity and my ancestors from hundreds of years ago.

Like I am going to blame you for murdering Cherokees or setting dogs on black people or something

You still won't disavow people who want to kill mexican families swimming the river and you ask me to explain what is wrong with it - so people can draw their own conclusions about your opinion on that

I gave you a thoughtful response and and you got defensive. I never backed the idea of shooting illegal immigrants and the only things shot may be your brain cells. Where did you you come with with that one?

I've got no problem where you came from and this one of the few nations where a guy like you can wave a flag in my face without hesitation. I consider that a positive part about America but you chose to skip that part. Most of my ancestors hailed from the England, Ireland and Scotland so I don't feel the need to sugarcoat history for your benefit or mine. I'm just pointing the irony you show no signs of seeing yourself. If you feel devalued, you devalued yourself because no one asked to hide who are or your background.

Seems to me that some 'natural borns' have no allegiance at all to basic American ideals of decency and equality.

You got that input on that in bars and gun ranges? In any case I don't know what you're referring to based on my post.

Like I am going to blame you for murdering Cherokees or setting dogs on black people or something

Lots of transplanted Yankees like myself aren't sons of the South but I don't expect you'd know much recent history or internal migration patterns. My ancestors served the in Union Army but that probably means nothing to you anyway.

Edited December 9, 2010 by alienlovechild

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Let em put in the public arena so we can see them for what they are and what we are up against

Blog sites can help by requiring bloggers to give some basic personal information about themselves. There are some things that can and should be said anonymously, but all too often people abuse the power of saying things they aren't willing to stand by in the public eye.

[Captain Oates 911]

Lots of transplanted Yankees like myself aren't sons of the South but I don't expect you'd know much recent history or internal migration patterns. My ancestors served the in Union Army but that probably means nothing to you anyway.

You assume an ignorance in me that you have no evidence for... I was working with white Company Directors in Lagrange, Georgia from 1983 onward and my wife's family is from Arkansas. I have spent a lot of time with my wife's black friends in Central Milwaukee and know a lot about historical migration patterns in the USA - so I have heard it all from both sides.

I was educated in world history in an advanced educational environment from 1959 on - so you shouldnt assume I am from sucksville - elev 348 feet - pop 54 + one mangy dawg

Your idea that I have never heard of the American Civil war and how you butchered 600,000 fellow Americans is plainly not credible. I have even visited the battlefields.

The internet does not allow anyone to truly know their debating partners or what their history is and that is one of the points that came up..

[alienlovechild 75]

You assume an ignorance in me that you have no evidence for... I was working with white Company Directors in Lagrange, Georgia from 1983 onward and my wife's family is from Arkansas. I have spent a lot of time with my wife's black friends in Central Milwaukee and know a lot about historical migration patterns in the USA - so I have heard it all from both sides.

I was educated in world history in an advanced educational environment from 1959 on - so you shouldnt assume I am from sucksville - elev 348 feet - pop 54 + one mangy dawg

Your idea that I have never heard of the American Civil war and how you butchered 600,000 fellow Americans is plainly not credible. I have even visited the battlefields.

The internet does not allow anyone to truly know their debating partners or what their history is and that is one of the points that came up..

You assumed I was from the South and I merely set the record straight. You needn't give me your life story but the personal touch makes you little more human.

I didn't say you were uneducated either but if feel the need to post your CV to justify yourself so be it if it makes you feel less devalued.

I didn't butcher 600,000 Americans but then you are a American Civil War buff so who I'm I to question your credibility.

[Captain Oates 911]

You assumed I was from the South and I merely set the record straight. You needn't give me your life story but the personal touch makes you little more human.

I didn't say you were uneducated either but if feel the need to post your CV to justify yourself so be it if it makes you feel less devalued.

I didn't butcher 600,000 Americans but then you are a American Civil War buff so who I'm I to question your credibility.

Wrong yet again on two scores:

1 I didn't assume you were from the South but you mentioned the Union Army and not being a transplanted yankee and internal migration patterns and implied I knew nothing of those matters

2 I am not a civil war buff but I have much more knowledge of it than the average American has of the English Civil War and I acquired that knowledge decades ago and built on it

Your imagination is lurching from one inaccurate profile of me to the next but in the process, showing exactly what I meant about people forming an image of other people on the internet without more than a tiny shred of information to go on.

I am just trying to point out that I am not a huddled mass and I haven't just got off the Ellis Island ferry boat,

and I know much more about American history and economics and the Constitution and law than 'the average American' will ever know - and I knew most of it 20 years before I got a green card.

People should allow for people not actually fitting their preconceptions, and they should bear it in mind when reaching for their keyboards.

That's fair enough isn't it ?

[alienlovechild 75]

1 I didn't assume you were from the South but you mentioned the Union Army and not being a transplanted yankee and internal migration patterns and implied I knew nothing of those matters

So you threw out the crack about setting dogs on blacks and murdering Cherokees for no particulate reason? I brought up the Union Army and Yankee angle after you threw out the blacks and Cherokees into the mix. That stuff happened down South and you knew exactly what you doing even though none of it applied to me. If you're going the make some serious charges out of the blue you better have good reason for it and you didn't.

2 I am not a civil war buff but I have much more knowledge of it than the average American has of the English Civil War and I acquired that knowledge decades ago and built on it

You are not a buff even though you match precisely the first definition I found. I don't think you know what a buff is and other than bragging using other terms just to desperately find a flaw in what I wrote.

"One who is enthusiastic and knowledgeable about a subject: a Civil War buff."

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/buff

Your imagination is lurching from one inaccurate profile of me to the next but in the process, showing exactly what I meant about people forming an image of other people on the internet without more than a tiny shred of information to go on.

What inaccurate profile? YOU provided all the details and I added nothing. You can't even quote me as I shred your reasoning sentence by sentence.

I am just trying to point out that I am not a huddled mass and I haven't just got off the Ellis Island ferry boat,

and I know much more about American history and economics and the Constitution and law than 'the average American' will ever know - and I knew most of it 20 years before I got a green card.

Your knowledge of American history is overshadowed by coming off a pompous azz giving a lecture to us poor simple natives while ignoring everything else. Your ####### at the outset painting me as someone who approved of shooting Mexicans and repeating it even though I said nothing of the kind and I went to explain why it was wrong without throwing in appeals to patriotism and religion without shame. Your knowledge American history, economics and the Constitution may exceed the average Joe but not mine so far as I've seen and that's who you're talking to. Hard to believe anyone can live here as long as you claim and still come off so badly.

You probably can't change yourself at this late date and you certainly don't have to do on my accord but could make some small contribution by talking to people without the obligatory jabs of American stupidity and your claims of superiority and truly expect any reasonable person to kowtow to you. If you want to make your point make it and at least have the common courtesy to reply to what a poster writes and not just ignore it and go on the offense. There are numerous ways to challenge people to think even they disagree with you but you've got to appeal to them beyond wrapping your arguments in a flag and using religion as a weapon against them. You may get to that point but you're doing in your first post, you're one pissed off person that should avoid loaded terms unless you're just trolling.

Edited December 9, 2010 by alienlovechild

[^_^ 5,021]

There aren't nuts in the UK?

[Captain Oates 911]

So you threw out the crack about setting dogs on blacks and murdering Cherokees for no particulate reason? I brought up the Union Army and Yankee angle after you threw out the blacks and Cherokees into the mix. That stuff happened down South and you knew exactly what you doing even though none of it applied to me. If you're going the make some serious charges out of the blue you better have good reason for it and you didn't.

You are not a buff even though you match precisely the first definition I found. I don't think you know what a buff is and other than bragging using other terms just to desperately find a flaw in what I wrote.

"One who is enthusiastic and knowledgeable about a subject: a Civil War buff."

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/buff

What inaccurate profile? YOU provided all the details and I added nothing. You can't even quote me as I shred your reasoning sentence by sentence.

Your knowledge of American history is overshadowed by coming off a pompous azz giving a lecture to us poor simple natives while ignoring everything else. Your ####### at the outset painting me as someone who approved of shooting Mexicans and repeating it even though I said nothing of the kind and I went to explain why it was wrong without throwing in appeals to patriotism and religion without shame. Your knowledge American history, economics and the Constitution may exceed the average Joe but not mine so far as I've seen and that's who you're talking to. Hard to believe anyone can live here as long as you claim and still come off so badly.

You probably can't change yourself at this late date and you certainly don't have to do on my accord but could make some small contribution by talking to people without the obligatory jabs of American stupidity and your claims of superiority and truly expect any reasonable person to kowtow to you. If you want to make your point make it and at least have the common courtesy to reply to what a poster writes and not just ignore it and go on the offense. There are numerous ways to challenge people to think even they disagree with you but you've got to appeal to them beyond wrapping your arguments in a flag and using religion as a weapon against them. You may get to that point but you're doing in your first post, you're one pissed off person that should avoid loaded terms unless you're just trolling.

That's quite a histrionic list and I would have to write a book to reply to it all.

It's full of personal invective and accusations that I am a 'troll' and a 'pompous ####' etc

It's a perfect example of what weapons some people reach for when they are called on their statements and feel frustrated and it highlights what the thread is all about.

Anyone reading back will see that the things you complain about are merely my counter arguments to issues you raised first and rebuttals of statements you made about my knowledge etc etc. You are the one handing out unsubstantiated statements and judgements and accusations sprinkled with personal remarks. I never said you were in favor of shooting Mexicans but I did ask you several times to say you disapproved of people who did say those things and you were very slow to say it and it took many posts. It's all in the record above for all to see.

If you can't stand people disagreeing with you without getting your nickers in a twist and handing out personal epithets rather than reasoned argument, then you should not enter into a debate in the first place.

[Danno 1,228]

I am ok with outrageously stupid but inhumane makes me boil - but at least we know what some of the people around us are thinking and what can happen if we don't make sure the govt and everyone complies with the law and basic decency

And which angel among us is going to write these "basic decency" standards that will stand the test of reason in all times and places?

Why don't you submit yours and lets see if all agree.

Edited December 9, 2010 by Danno