Marriage contract

[iceyspots 0]

this thread is and if it's not, it should be

yea I know... VJ is coming to be the twilight zone!

henia open your yahoO! you are ignoring me! lol

[Veiled Princess 1]

PS - I asked you for proof that Christians and Jews who died in the Prophet's time wil be the only ones who will enter heaven. So far, you have posted ayat that contradict what you said about that, but stil nothing to prove that there was a cutoff date for the ahl al kitab to enter heaven.

I am sure I posted an ayah that stated it was a requirement that they follow the Quran and Muhammad after Muhammad... here's another...

[004:047] O you who have been given the Scripture (Jews and Christians)! Believe in what We have revealed (to Muhammad [sal-Allâhu 'alayhi wa sallam]) confirming what is (already) with you, before We efface faces (by making them like the back of necks; without nose, mouth and eyes) and turn them hindwards, or curse them as We cursed the Sabbath-breakers. And the Commandment of Allâh is always executed.

[004:048] Verily, Allâh forgives not that partners should be set up with Him (in worship), but He forgives except that (anything else) to whom He wills; and whoever sets up partners with Allâh in worship, he has indeed invented a tremendous sin.

[004:049] Have you not seen those (Jews and Christians) who claim sanctity for themselves? Nay, but Allâh sanctifies whom He wills, and they will not be dealt with injustice even equal to the extent of a Fatîlâ (a scalish thread in the long slit of a date stone).

[004:050] Look, how they invent a lie against Allâh, and enough is that as a manifest sin.

[004:051] Have you not seen those who were given a portion of the Scripture? They believe in A-Jibt and At-Tâghût and say to the disbelievers that they are better guided as regards the way than the believers (Muslims).

PS - I asked you for proof that Christians and Jews who died in the Prophet's time wil be the only ones who will enter heaven. So far, you have posted ayat that contradict what you said about that, but stil nothing to prove that there was a cutoff date for the ahl al kitab to enter heaven.

The whole point of having the explaination is to know how the prophet explained it.

Those who believed that then were called disbelievers and promised hellfire. yesterday, today, tomorrow, next week.....

Ok, so what you're saying now is that what you said before about ahl al kitab who died before Islam going to heaven isn't true after all.

So, did Allah lie, contradict Himself, or is He just more confused than you are?

No and my 9 year old understands this so I don't understand how you can't..... not all christians believe in the trinity... never have... those real followers of Isa were promised heaven.... the ones who worshipped Isa were promised hell... after Muhammad then christianity and judaism is no more.... Islam is the only religion acceptable to Allah.

[Henia 11]

PS - I asked you for proof that Christians and Jews who died in the Prophet's time wil be the only ones who will enter heaven. So far, you have posted ayat that contradict what you said about that, but stil nothing to prove that there was a cutoff date for the ahl al kitab to enter heaven.

I am sure I posted an ayah that stated it was a requirement that they follow the Quran and Muhammad after Muhammad... here's another...

[004:047] O you who have been given the Scripture (Jews and Christians)! Believe in what We have revealed (to Muhammad [sal-Allâhu 'alayhi wa sallam]) confirming what is (already) with you, before We efface faces (by making them like the back of necks; without nose, mouth and eyes) and turn them hindwards, or curse them as We cursed the Sabbath-breakers. And the Commandment of Allâh is always executed.

[004:048] Verily, Allâh forgives not that partners should be set up with Him (in worship), but He forgives except that (anything else) to whom He wills; and whoever sets up partners with Allâh in worship, he has indeed invented a tremendous sin.

[004:049] Have you not seen those (Jews and Christians) who claim sanctity for themselves? Nay, but Allâh sanctifies whom He wills, and they will not be dealt with injustice even equal to the extent of a Fatîlâ (a scalish thread in the long slit of a date stone).

[004:050] Look, how they invent a lie against Allâh, and enough is that as a manifest sin.

[004:051] Have you not seen those who were given a portion of the Scripture? They believe in A-Jibt and At-Tâghût and say to the disbelievers that they are better guided as regards the way than the believers (Muslims).

PS - I asked you for proof that Christians and Jews who died in the Prophet's time wil be the only ones who will enter heaven. So far, you have posted ayat that contradict what you said about that, but stil nothing to prove that there was a cutoff date for the ahl al kitab to enter heaven.

The whole point of having the explaination is to know how the prophet explained it.

Those who believed that then were called disbelievers and promised hellfire. yesterday, today, tomorrow, next week.....

Ok, so what you're saying now is that what you said before about ahl al kitab who died before Islam going to heaven isn't true after all.

So, did Allah lie, contradict Himself, or is He just more confused than you are?

No and my 9 year old understands this so I don't understand how you can't..... not all christians believe in the trinity... never have... those real followers of Isa were promised heaven.... the ones who worshipped Isa were promised hell... after Muhammad then christianity and judaism is no more.... Islam is the only religion acceptable to Allah.

I am looking up all of the suras you both posted here...brb

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Ok, Layla. I posted three ayat that say that there will be Christians and Jews in heaven. In response, you said that ahl al kitab today will not go to heaven. I reminded you that their doctrine was well defined 300 years before Islam came to the Arabs, and asked you if God didn't know what they believed or would believe at the time He revealed that notice.

You avoided answering that. Instead, you posted several ayat and a hadith that condemn all non-Muslims to hell (with commentary in the ayah). Then you said that those who died before the Prophet will go, even tho the ayat you posted said nothing of the sort. Then you said that none of them will go. All the while, you offered no context or explanation of the quotes.

I'm still waiting for the explanation of the contradictions. You're so smart, you can do it. Should I wait?

[Veiled Princess 1]

I have to go to bed... it's 1:30am here and I have to get up in 3 and a half hours... I should not spend so much time on here arguing with an innovator.

Henia, please let me know if my Quran and your Quran do not agree and if not then also who is the translator of yours. Thanks.

[iceyspots 0]

Ok, Layla. I posted three ayat that say that there will be Christians and Jews in heaven. In response, you said that ahl al kitab today will not go to heaven. I reminded you that their doctrine was well defined 300 years before Islam came to the Arabs, and asked you if God didn't know what they believed or would believe at the time He revealed that notice.

You avoided answering that. Instead, you posted several ayat and a hadith that condemn all non-Muslims to hell (with commentary in the ayah). Then you said that those who died before the Prophet will go, even tho the ayat you posted said nothing of the sort. Then you said that none of them will go. All the while, you offered no context or explanation of the quotes.

I'm still waiting for the explanation of the contradictions. You're so smart, you can do it. Should I wait?

dang. she's going to bed...

ding ding ding! we have a winner!

[Veiled Princess 1]

Ok, Layla. I posted three ayat that say that there will be Christians and Jews in heaven. In response, you said that ahl al kitab today will not go to heaven. I reminded you that their doctrine was well defined 300 years before Islam came to the Arabs, and asked you if God didn't know what they believed or would believe at the time He revealed that notice.

You avoided answering that. Instead, you posted several ayat and a hadith that condemn all non-Muslims to hell (with commentary in the ayah). Then you said that those who died before the Prophet will go, even tho the ayat you posted said nothing of the sort. Then you said that none of them will go. All the while, you offered no context or explanation of the quotes.

I'm still waiting for the explanation of the contradictions. You're so smart, you can do it. Should I wait?

I have already explained it to you.... not all people of the book will go to heaven.... those who worshipped other than Allah will not (they are referred to as disbelievers and mushrikeen in the Quran), those after Muhammad and the Quran who don't accept them both will not...

I don't think it's that you don't understand my point it's just that you don't want to and you want to argue with me. So have fun arguing with yourself... I should not have unignored you in the first place

Ok, Layla. I posted three ayat that say that there will be Christians and Jews in heaven. In response, you said that ahl al kitab today will not go to heaven. I reminded you that their doctrine was well defined 300 years before Islam came to the Arabs, and asked you if God didn't know what they believed or would believe at the time He revealed that notice.

You avoided answering that. Instead, you posted several ayat and a hadith that condemn all non-Muslims to hell (with commentary in the ayah). Then you said that those who died before the Prophet will go, even tho the ayat you posted said nothing of the sort. Then you said that none of them will go. All the while, you offered no context or explanation of the quotes.

I'm still waiting for the explanation of the contradictions. You're so smart, you can do it. Should I wait?

dang. she's going to bed...

ding ding ding! we have a winner!

If you have nothing to contribute to the actual discussion must you waste space with nonsense?

FYI... I did not avoid answering anything.... I have answered all of SZSZs questions.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

No and my 9 year old understands this so I don't understand how you can't..... not all christians believe in the trinity... never have... those real followers of Isa were promised heaven.... the ones who worshipped Isa were promised hell...

Maybe not all Christians believe in the Trinity, but they all believe Jesus is God, so what difference does that make to your argument that none of them will enter heaven?

after Muhammad then christianity and judaism is no more.... Islam is the only religion acceptable to Allah.

Islam means submission to the Will of God. It has existed since Adam, not since Muhammad. It is the Message that was sent to all the world. You don't talk as if you grasp that fact; you make the timeline start with Muhammad as if He is the first prophet of Islam rather than the last.

God is not interested in labels, but in deeds. That is why you are wrong about the imporatnce of labels such as Muslim, Christian and Jew having the weight you give them. And that is why I am right to believe that God didn't lie when He said there will be Christians and Jews in heaven.

[iceyspots 0]

Ma'am people who call USA kufar country and liberally spout out the word "kufar west" *IS* nonsense.

[Veiled Princess 1]

Maybe not all Christians believe in the Trinity, but they all believe Jesus is God, so what difference does that make to your argument that none of them will enter heaven?

No they don't

Islam means submission to the Will of God. It has existed since Adam, not since Muhammad. It is the Message that was sent to all the world. You don't talk as if you grasp that fact; you make the timeline start with Muhammad as if He is the first prophet of Islam rather than the last.

No but they must accept the Quran as the word of Allah and Muhammad as His last messenger and since they don't they are disbelievers and have been promised hell.

God is not interested in labels, but in deeds. That is why you are wrong about the imporatnce of labels such as Muslim, Christian and Jew having the weight you give them. And that is why I am right to believe that God didn't lie when He said there will be Christians and Jews in heaven.

I don't believe He lied either. I have not denied that there will be jews and christians in heaven... I'm just stating that anyone who dies as a jew or christian today having rejected the Quran and Muhammad are non-believers and have been promised hell. Every prophet will come on JD with his followers.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I have already explained it to you.... not all people of the book will go to heaven.... those who worshipped other than Allah will not (they are referred to as disbelievers and mushrikeen in the Quran), those after Muhammad and the Quran who don't accept them both will not...

Dayam, girl! I already said that not all ahl al kitab wil enter heaven when I posted those three ayat. You said they were wrong. BUT THE AYAT SAY THAT THEY ARE CHRISTIANS AND JEWS, NOT SOME SORT OF RECONSTITUTED NON-CHRISTIANS AND JEWS. Stpo trying to get around the FACT that Allah has included them in His vision of heaven.

I don't think it's that you don't understand my point it's just that you don't want to and you want to argue with me. So have fun arguing with yourself... I should not have unignored you in the first place

It must be hard to put all that energy into evading my requests.

[Veiled Princess 1]

Ma'am people who call USA kufar country and liberally spout out the word "kufar west" *IS* nonsense.

I have already explained to you my position on that many many many times...it's boring now.

It must be hard to put all that energy into evading my requests.

I have not... I have wasted several hours answering all of your asinine questions.

[hollyw 0]

No and my 9 year old understands this so I don't understand how you can't..... not all christians believe in the trinity... never have... those real followers of Isa were promised heaven.... the ones who worshipped Isa were promised hell...

Maybe not all Christians believe in the Trinity, but they all believe Jesus is God, so what difference does that make to your argument that none of them will enter heaven?

after Muhammad then christianity and judaism is no more.... Islam is the only religion acceptable to Allah.

Islam means submission to the Will of God. It has existed since Adam, not since Muhammad. It is the Message that was sent to all the world. You don't talk as if you grasp that fact; you make the timeline start with Muhammad as if He is the first prophet of Islam rather than the last.

God is not interested in labels, but in deeds. That is why you are wrong about the imporatnce of labels such as Muslim, Christian and Jew having the weight you give them. And that is why I am right to believe that God didn't lie when He said there will be Christians and Jews in heaven.

umm i'm going to try to butt in here with a question.... my husband and i were actually talking about this the other day and he explained to me that christians and jews will be in heaven.. IF they have searched for the true religion and found it to be christianity or judiasm. if a person is born christian or jewish and do NOT search for the true religion and remain christian or jewish, then they go to hell. (he explained it much better than this, im just trying to remember what i can). i was wondering if this is correct and your opinions on it....

[Veiled Princess 1]

umm i'm going to try to butt in here with a question.... my husband and i were actually talking about this the other day and he explained to me that christians and jews will be in heaven.. IF they have searched for the true religion and found it to be christianity or judiasm. if a person is born christian or jewish and do NOT search for the true religion and remain christian or jewish, then they go to hell. (he explained it much better than this, im just trying to remember what i can). i was wondering if this is correct and your opinions on it....

You mean they never knew about Islam, the Quran or Muhammad?

[iceyspots 0]

Ma'am people who call USA kufar country and liberally spout out the word "kufar west" *IS* nonsense.

I have already explained to you my position on that many many many times...it's boring now.

szsz used the word kufar in the correct context, you DID NOT. you used it as a derogatory label.. and everyone here agrees.

What about the nonsense where you called a 7th grader a hooker? sounds like nonsense to me!