Dog-Walkers to Dominatrices: Many College Grads Face 'Malemployment'

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Audio.

Transcript

JIM LEHRER: Now: the sobering job prospects for young college graduates and how they have changed since the recession.

Our economics correspondent, Paul Solman, has that story. It's part of his reporting on Making Sense of financial news.

PAUL SOLMAN: David Cook got a B.A. in anthropology in 2008. Unable to find work in his native Atlanta, he moved his wife and young son to Fort Collins, Colorado, earlier this year for a government job which looked like a sure thing, but:

DAVID COOK, college graduate: They said that they were considering hiring college students, local college students, to fill the positions as interns for free. So...

PAUL SOLMAN: With a family to support, he set his sights downward, fast-food manager, car detailer. He finally found work washing trash cans at $9 an hour, part-time.

DAVID COOK: I don't want to seem ungrateful. I just feel like I devoted years of my life and thousands of dollars into developing specialized skills that I'm not using.

PAUL SOLMAN: We have done stories about unemployment, underemployment. This one's about malemployment, the mismatch between college skills and real-world work.

Andrew Sum studies the labor market.

ANDREW SUM, Center for Labor Market Studies, Northeastern University: Nearly half of all young college graduates -- I'm talking about B.A.-holders under -- 25 and under -- only half of them are working in a job that requires a college degree.

The rest of them are working in jobs that either don't -- do not require a degree or not working at all. On average, by the way, their salary is 40 percent less than a college graduate that is in a job that requires a college degree.

PAUL SOLMAN: After Abigail Lunetta got her B.A. in creative writing two years ago, she worked in New Orleans as a part-time copywriter, then moved to New York to find a real job.

ABIGAIL LUNETTA, college graduate: I just sort of assumed that I would become an assistant editor somewhere for some publication, and just work my way up. It's definitely no walk in the park.

PAUL SOLMAN: Though, actually, given the dog-eat-dog publishing world, walks in the park have become her job.

ABIGAIL LUNETTA: I am walking dogs right now to sort of help feed myself while I'm here.

PAUL SOLMAN: Through an agency, she gets 10 bucks an hour. She bunks for free with friends as the job search goes on.

The theme of one surprising interview: stocks and bondage.

ABIGAIL LUNETTA: I looked into the world of a dominatrix.

(LAUGHTER)

It was kind of like out of a movie, you know? The guy, he was a little rough around the edges. You know, he knew that I had absolutely no experience with this whatsoever, but he did say that, to a prostitute, this is pennies, but, to -- for a waitress, this is a fortune.

PAUL SOLMAN: We will spare you more graphic footage about this particular instance of malemployment, and go back to the dogs, to set up Lunetta's reaction when told the typical clients would come from Wall Street.

ABIGAIL LUNETTA: I think that would be some kind of karma. That would be like a stress release on my part. It's kind of their fault that I'm in this position, so slapping them around might feel pretty good.

(LAUGHTER)

PAUL SOLMAN: Lunetta was just the second in her family to get a college degree, still a plus for those over 25. Their jobless rate is half that of non-graduates.

But, last month, the jobless rate for older grads topped 5 percent for the first time in 40 years. And for grads under 25, it's 9.5 percent.

Rutgers professor Carl Van Horn says Abigail Lunetta is typical of her generation.

CARL VAN HORN, Center for Workforce Development, Rutgers University: The advice that they have gotten since they were toddlers was, get a college degree, and you will have a successful economic future. And I want to emphasize that still is a better bet than not, but now it's more difficult to translate that in this particular economy.

And, of course, the cost of education has gone up so dramatically that many people are facing really significant debts when they are finished.

PAUL SOLMAN: In fact, the debts have been getting harder to pay. Between 2000 and 2009, inflation-adjusted earnings for grads with just a bachelor's degree fell by 15 percent, while public college tuitions rose 63 percent; private school 30 percent.

Small wonder most of last year's B.A.s were in debt, owing, on average, $24,000 upon graduation.

Evan Melillo was a history major who minored in political science and graduated last year $40,000 in debt. He hoped to land a local government job after an internship at the town manager's office in nearby Sandwich, Massachusetts.

EVAN MELILLO, college graduate: I really had to give up on that after a couple of months, because the positions just weren't there, and who I'm competing with are far more experienced people than me.

PAUL SOLMAN: Melillo finally found temp work moving furniture while becoming certified to teach.

EVAN MELILLO: I went on Craigslist and I looked up every tutoring, assistant teacher. I think I applied to a driving school. And, so far, I got two e-mails back.

PAUL SOLMAN: The only job he did land was through a connection at a local charter school. Kara (ph), his 10-year-old sister, is a student there.

EVAN MELILLO: Unbeknownst to me, my little sister was going into the copying room and asking people if her brother had gotten a job.

PAUL SOLMAN: Unable to support himself on the $72 he makes subbing at his sister's school once a week, Melillo moved back into his old room.

Evan's 22-year-old brother lives with their parents, too. In fact, he's never left, says their mom.

LAUREN MELILLO, mother of Evan Melillo: Evan's brother was -- has not been to college and has had just about as much success finding work, making the same amount of money as Evan has.

PAUL SOLMAN: So, he sees no reason to go to college. So far, all of the grads you've seen went to state schools: David Cook to Georgia State; Abigail Lunetta to Louisiana State; Evan Melillo to the University of Massachusetts.

But, these days, even an Ivy League degree is no guarantee.

GOWRI CHANDRA, college graduate: I have applied for 400 jobs, at least, probably closer to 500.

PAUL SOLMAN: Gowri Chandra graduated from Brown in 2009, $80,000 in the hole. A comp lit major, she hoped to work at a nonprofit for at-risk youth. But 18 months have yet to produce a full-time job.

GOWRI CHANDRA: Everybody says, you know, don't take it personally. And it's hard to keep that in mind, because it does feel like a personal rejection.

PAUL SOLMAN: Chandra's working part-time on E-470 in Denver, $10.75 an hour to log license plate numbers from photos of cars that use the toll road. Plenty of her Brown classmates are malemployed as well.

GOWRI CHANDRA: Jobs that you don't need a college education for, by any stretch of the imagination.

PAUL SOLMAN: Chandra thought the highway job would be stopgap. It's lasted a year, with food stamps needed at times to supplement her part-time income.

David Cook and his wife, also a college grad, and part-time waitress, are still on food stamps, were on welfare for a while, too.

DAVID COOK: It's been really emotionally tough for -- for both of us. And, psychologically, it's hard to, you know, be the father and the husband, the man of the family, all this, but not providing for him.

PAUL SOLMAN: And now the Cooks are awaiting the arrival of a second baby.

DAVID COOK: I found this job washing trash cans the day before she found out she was pregnant. So...

(LAUGHTER)

... at least I was finally able to call family members that I was too embarrassed to talk to before, and tell them the good news, and also that I had found a job.

But it's hard to call back home when you feel like you're failing, you know? It's hard to, like, call your grandparents and tell them that you're still not working, you know, and that -- that you're on welfare and stuff like that, you know? It's three degrees in the house, you know? It's -- so, it's -- so, I'm really grateful to be washing trash cans.

PAUL SOLMAN: Grateful to have any job, even if he didn't need a degree in anthropology to get it.

http://www.pbs.org/n...ates_12-03.html

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Perhaps he shouldn't have gotten a degree in anthropology.... That would explain a lot too. If you want that degree you have to be REALLY passionate about that subject matter and you also have to understand your options will be limited as it's a very open study and not centralized. He would have been better off doing a distinct social science, rather than anthropology..... Human nature is my specialty and I wouldn't be stupid enough to go for a degree in anthropology as I know the dead ends it can lead into...

Look at the other examples here... Creative writer.... History/Political Science..

So we have 3 people who got meaningless degrees in this world today.

Show me people getting IT degrees and engineering degress, than we'll talk.

The only thing this story should do, is encourage young people to get into degree programs that actuall produce something for society, rather than produce something for themselves.

[^_^ 5,021]

Perhaps he shouldn't have gotten a degree in anthropology.... That would explain a lot too. If you want that degree you have to be REALLY passionate about that subject matter and you also have to understand your options will be limited as it's a very open study and not centralized. He would have been better off doing a distinct social science, rather than anthropology..... Human nature is my specialty and I wouldn't be stupid enough to go for a degree in anthropology as I know the dead ends it can lead into...

Look at the other examples here... Creative writer.... History/Political Science..

So we have 3 people who got meaningless degrees in this world today.

Show me people getting IT degrees and engineering degress, than we'll talk.

The only thing this story should do, is encourage young people to get into degree programs that actuall produce something for society, rather than produce something for themselves.

Yes. Computer Science major hiring at the university near me has been robust in 2010, although it wasn't as good in 2007-9.

[The_Dude 1,142]

Perhaps he shouldn't have gotten a degree in anthropology.... That would explain a lot too. If you want that degree you have to be REALLY passionate about that subject matter and you also have to understand your options will be limited as it's a very open study and not centralized. He would have been better off doing a distinct social science, rather than anthropology..... Human nature is my specialty and I wouldn't be stupid enough to go for a degree in anthropology as I know the dead ends it can lead into...

Look at the other examples here... Creative writer.... History/Political Science..

So we have 3 people who got meaningless degrees in this world today.

Show me people getting IT degrees and engineering degress, than we'll talk.

The only thing this story should do, is encourage young people to get into degree programs that actuall produce something for society, rather than produce something for themselves.

Yes, everyone should study something practical like engineering and and IT. Lets get rid of any semblance of creativity or innovation left. ....... That sounds about as logical as a degree from Beck U.

[^_^ 5,021]

The idea that there is no creativity and innovation involved in engineering and IT is amusing.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Yes, everyone should study something practical like engineering and and IT. Lets get rid of any semblance of creativity or innovation left. ....... That sounds about as logical as a degree from Beck U.

It's about what's needed and what's not in the moment.

People go after degress in certain fields for various reasons.

The point is though, if you want to be successful, especially in a down economy, you need to go for a degree that's needed in that moment.

Creative writing and political science degrees are a dime a dozen, and that's about what you're going to get paid if you have one, unless you can somehow gain attention and blow people away with your skills.

[tmma 467]

Perhaps he shouldn't have gotten a degree in anthropology.... That would explain a lot too. If you want that degree you have to be REALLY passionate about that subject matter and you also have to understand your options will be limited as it's a very open study and not centralized. He would have been better off doing a distinct social science, rather than anthropology..... Human nature is my specialty and I wouldn't be stupid enough to go for a degree in anthropology as I know the dead ends it can lead into...

Look at the other examples here... Creative writer.... History/Political Science..

So we have 3 people who got meaningless degrees in this world today.

Show me people getting IT degrees and engineering degress, than we'll talk.

The only thing this story should do, is encourage young people to get into degree programs that actuall produce something for society, rather than produce something for themselves.

I agree with this. Culture/Creativity IS important, but it's not paying the bills for the folks in the editorial.

I have a specialized degree but also did 2 others as a back up. Mathematics was one.

Mathematics teachers are always in demand. All the while I was at college I was mindful that I had to draw an income afterwards. I am lucky, my passion is Meteorology and I secured employment in that field.

I have ( and still do) teach mathematics as a supplemental income.

Edited December 6, 2010 by tmma

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Besides, there is a long and proud historical tradition of artist-types being poor and living off the charity of others. Only today do our 'creative ones' major in art history or someshit and then expect jobs that have them living in a nice manhattan apartment.

[The_Dude 1,142]

The idea that there is no creativity and innovation involved in engineering and IT is amusing.

You know what I meant.

It's about what's needed and what's not in the moment.

People go after degress in certain fields for various reasons.

The point is though, if you want to be successful, especially in a down economy, you need to go for a degree that's needed in that moment.

Creative writing and political science degrees are a dime a dozen, and that's about what you're going to get paid if you have one, unless you can somehow gain attention and blow people away with your skills.

Paul, how abou you leave the judgements about value and difficulty of various university degrees to those who actually know how difficult it is.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Besides, there is a long and proud historical tradition of artist-types being poor and living off the charity of others. Only today do our 'creative ones' major in art history or someshit and then expect jobs that have them living in a nice manhattan apartment.

Actually, the entertainment industry is full of art college types, many of whom have been fairly successful career wise.

[Sgt. McGee 27]

I have a major in music, a minor in French, and I hold a job as an I.T. Director (which I'm happy with). Getting a job "in your field" may not be practical for everyone, everywhere, every time. The bigger issue is the notion that everyone should go to college, rack up this debt, and expect that they'll be able to pay it off afterward.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I have a major in music, a minor in French, and I hold a job as an I.T. Director (which I'm happy with). Getting a job "in your field" may not be practical for everyone, everywhere, every time. The bigger issue is the notion that everyone should go to college, rack up this debt, and expect that they'll be able to pay it off afterward.

Yeah, I would be in favor of revamping our secondary education system to develop trade-skills schools. Lower the HS graduating age to 16 and then make 2 year trade-skills an available option for those who aren't ready for college or don't want to go on to a 4 year college or university.

[SMR 368]

You know what I meant.

No, actually, I really don't. The "dream" jobs of the graduates in the article were government jobs and assistant editorships. Is that what you consider to be creative? Are those the types of people that you consider innovators?

I understand that there are different types of creativity. Designing and engineering things, solving problems, entertaining people, making art, or running an effective government all require certain types of creativity. But when someone goes and decides what he or she wants to do without considering whether or not anyone will pay him or her to do it, I don't consider that creativity.

Basically, you implied that history and anthropology majors are more innovative than engineers or IT professionals and when someone called you to the carpet you responded with "you know what I meant." What you said didn't make any sense and so no, I don't think most people know what you meant. If the world needed more anthropology or history majors, the ones that graduated would get jobs quite easily. As you can see, they don't because it doesn't.

[The_Dude 1,142]

No, actually, I really don't. The "dream" jobs of the graduates in the article were government jobs and assistant editorships. Is that what you consider to be creative? Are those the types of people that you consider innovators?

I understand that there are different types of creativity. Designing and engineering things, solving problems, entertaining people, making art, or running an effective government all require certain types of creativity. But when someone goes and decides what he or she wants to do without considering whether or not anyone will pay him or her to do it, I don't consider that creativity.

Basically, you implied that history and anthropology majors are more innovative than engineers or IT professionals and when someone called you to the carpet you responded with "you know what I meant." What you said didn't make any sense and so no, I don't think most people know what you meant. If the world needed more anthropology or history majors, the ones that graduated would get jobs quite easily. As you can see, they don't because it doesn't.

If you dont' know what I meant, then don't presume to put words in my mouth that I never said. Nice attempt at trolling though.

What I actually did mean was to counter Paul's implication that people not bother studying things like anthropology because in his estimation, IT and engineering is more practical, more needed in todays world. My point is that sometimes, we need innovation and art, just for the sake of progression, that soemtimes doesn't come from the usual sources. I wasn't placing any judgement on you engineers, so you can pull your panties out of your arses.

Edited December 6, 2010 by Rob & Mel

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And FWIW, SMR - I did know what Rob meant. But I called him out because his language was a tad indelicate, he gets carried away in his attempts to PWN Paul sometimes