Sending money to your wife's family for hospital expenses

[adiiann 163]

If you're right, then what do I have to lose by coming down hard and saying "no" when I feel like keeping the peace by saying "yes"? Perhaps she'll respond differently and stop the nonsensical behavior she's been exhibiting. I'll then be whacking myself on the side of the head wondering why I didn't have the strength earlier to say "no".

Darn Gilles! It's like punishing a dog when making a mess even though it looks so cute and adorable, but you need to because the dog needs discipline.

One more thing, if you think you made mistake in the past that resulted your situation right now, you can't keep doing mistakes to make things right. Wake up man! Go to the roots of your problem instead of being superficial. You are such a coward that you can't face the consequences of your situation instead you keep justifying reasons that aren't justifiable. You can't change a person that is not willing to change. There's a lot of good advices that had been spoken here for you, pick it up and if thats what really your reason posting this thread.

In Tagalog quote, "Para kang sirang plaka, paulit-ulit na lang, nakakarindi."

To Kevin (who posted about verses in the Bible)

You probably think that I am one of the haters. I admire you for being so religious but there's an extent of being so religious, you don't have to flaunt it by posting verses here which for me doesn't make sense. And oh by the way, if you think that identifying the truth and saying it out loud is being haters, then you are hypocrite because you are sugar-coating something that shouldn't be.

Hay naku! Okay rin pala mag-comment dito, nakakawala ng stress. LoL

[~happyndinlove~ 540]

Gilles:

So..how you feeling about the way this thread has turned out for you? Do you like it? Do you like the way some have labeled you? (calling you a "coward" and other similar complimentary descriptions)

It's strange how some are willing to give advice freely (with an attitude of open minded support) and then become hostile and degrading when their advice is not followed. It seems the attitude of some .... How dare you not follow the advice! How dare you discuss the advice in a way that seems argumentative! I wonder why some give advice with the expectation that you follow it and if you don't...well...the posse that showed up to help...has now tied the noose around your neck. Your dealing with a mess at home and a hostile VJ mob? How you feel about that? What do you think about that?

It's the old saying...be careful what you ask for coz you might not like what you get. Although I would not post personal marriage info (such as conflicts) in a public forum... I think it is admirable that you are willing to sell yourself out to get "meaningful" advice. Another opinion, for what it's worth (probably not much) ....your marriage is suffering from a power struggle. I think you need to make a choice....accept it or quit it. It's obvious that you want as much or more control/ power (as you describe) your wife. My wife and I have a married-couple friend that has conducted "marriage encounter" workshops (for their church) 30 years. They have often stated that "successful" marriages are the result of a couple learning acceptance. You need to decide wether you can accept your wife for who she is and if not....move on or continue the power struggle to whatever ending result you find. (If) your looking (here on VJ) for a "collective" effort to out-wit out-last out-manipulate your wife....hmmmm....how bout you just make that real clear to everybody instead of throwing a bait and switch party? (I'm curious to read the responses)

P.S. I'm also finding it humorous how the posse has turned on itself. The attempts of 1 posse member to squash anothers freedom of expression. Be religious, but only to the "extent" that I like it. I mean, isn't it obvious that the squashers advice is absolutely the best advice and all should listen? Afterall...it's (guess who), and we all should know by now that (guess who) perspective will probably help. How many more times does (guess who) have to tell us this before we finally get it? (Thank you thank you thank you for staying up so late and sacrificing sleep to enlighten us!)

[Gilles 4]

Darn Gilles! It's like punishing a dog when making a mess even though it looks so cute and adorable, but you need to because the dog needs discipline.

One more thing, if you think you made mistake in the past that resulted your situation right now, you can't keep doing mistakes to make things right. Wake up man! Go to the roots of your problem instead of being superficial. You are such a coward that you can't face the consequences of your situation instead you keep justifying reasons that aren't justifiable. You can't change a person that is not willing to change. There's a lot of good advices that had been spoken here for you, pick it up and if thats what really your reason posting this thread.

I can't know if she's willing to change unless I try a different approach. Unfortunately it's not within my character to play "tough", so I have to step outside my comfort zone which is a difficult thing for me to do. It's like asking a the nicest guy in the world to show some meanness. If she doesn't change after I try a different approach, then perhaps you're right that she won't change. But we won't know until I try something different and I've been working in that direction.

I'm not offended in the slightest that you call me a coward. You're entitled to your opinion and your perception. IMO, a coward is someone who would have walked away from this situation without exhausting every available method or resource to fix the problem. In other words, one who retreats from the front line in battle because he can't handle the fright.

In Tagalog quote, "Para kang sirang plaka, paulit-ulit na lang, nakakarindi."

My apologies for being too lazy to look it up at a translation page, but what does that mean?

To Kevin (who posted about verses in the Bible)

You probably think that I am one of the haters. I admire you for being so religious but there's an extent of being so religious, you don't have to flaunt it by posting verses here which for me doesn't make sense. And oh by the way, if you think that identifying the truth and saying it out loud is being haters, then you are hypocrite because you are sugar-coating something that shouldn't be.

I am a non-believer and not a Christian, but I think the Bible offers some very good moral lessons. While the verses might make no sense to you right now, if you were given real life situations to apply them to, you'd see that they make a lot of sense.

]

[Gilles 4]

Gilles:

So..how you feeling about the way this thread has turned out for you? Do you like it? Do you like the way some have labeled you? (calling you a "coward" and other similar complimentary descriptions)

I have no problem with others labeling me a coward. I have a strong background & lots of experience in both child and adult psychology & sociology and have learned that by making derogatory remarks about someone else or by calling them by a derogatory name only reflects poorly on the name caller and not on the one being called the name. I actually encourage those who think I'm a coward to come forward and say so. I like to learn about others. In many cases, saying something negative about someone else reveals a low self-esteem on the part of the name caller.

It's strange how some are willing to give advice freely (with an attitude of open minded support) and then become hostile and degrading when their advice is not followed. It seems the attitude of some .... How dare you not follow the advice! How dare you discuss the advice in a way that seems argumentative! I wonder why some give advice with the expectation that you follow it and if you don't...well...the posse that showed up to help...has now tied the noose around your neck. Your dealing with a mess at home and a hostile VJ mob? How you feel about that? What do you think about that?

I could choose to ignore the hostile replies, but I don't. If they have any effect on me, they humor me, as the posters of those attacks don't realize that what they're saying reveals far more about themselves than it does about me.

It's the old saying...be careful what you ask for coz you might not like what you get. Although I would not post personal marriage info (such as conflicts) in a public forum... I think it is admirable that you are willing to sell yourself out to get "meaningful" advice.

If "selling myself out" is the price to pay to get useful advice or hear how others have dealt with similar situations, it is a small price to pay. I have no issues posting this stuff in a public forum, as we can all be as anonymous as we choose.

Another opinion, for what it's worth (probably not much) ....your marriage is suffering from a power struggle. I think you need to make a choice....accept it or quit it. It's obvious that you want as much or more control/ power (as you describe) your wife.

Yes, it's a power struggle. And I'm trying to be nice all the time. I need to test the other approach and that is to be tough - which isn't in my character.

My wife and I have a married-couple friend that has conducted "marriage encounter" workshops (for their church) 30 years. They have often stated that "successful" marriages are the result of a couple learning acceptance. You need to decide wether you can accept your wife for who she is and if not....move on or continue the power struggle to whatever ending result you find. (If) your looking (here on VJ) for a "collective" effort to out-wit out-last out-manipulate your wife....hmmmm....how bout you just make that real clear to everybody instead of throwing a bait and switch party? (I'm curious to read the responses)

I think I have made it clear that there are many possible ways to deal with someone like my wife. Some work with some people. Some work with other people. Some don't work with certain people. And others don't work with certain people. But if you look for trends, you'll see that in general some approaches work better than other approaches. And what I've learned here and from other sources is that the only thing which will work - if anything will work - is for me to be tough and not give in.

P.S. I'm also finding it humorous how the posse has turned on itself. The attempts of 1 posse member to squash anothers freedom of expression. Be religious, but only to the "extent" that I like it. I mean, isn't it obvious that the squashers advice is absolutely the best advice and all should listen? Afterall...it's (guess who), and we all should know by now that (guess who) perspective will probably help. How many more times does (guess who) have to tell us this before we finally get it? (Thank you thank you thank you for staying up so late and sacrificing sleep to enlighten us!)

I do find it humorous that those with nothing useful to say actually post in threads. They'll think in their value system the thread serves no purpose, so they'll say something like, "CAN SOMEONE PLEASE SHUT DOWN THIS THREAD, IT SERVES NO PURPOSE", when they don't even participate in it nor did anyone force them to read it.

[Joan >3 Bob 20]

I think this post has strayed from its original post subject issus and should be closed! Charles where are you on this one????????

[adiiann 163]

Gilles:

So..how you feeling about the way this thread has turned out for you? Do you like it? Do you like the way some have labeled you? (calling you a "coward" and other similar complimentary descriptions)

It's strange how some are willing to give advice freely (with an attitude of open minded support) and then become hostile and degrading when their advice is not followed. It seems the attitude of some .... How dare you not follow the advice! How dare you discuss the advice in a way that seems argumentative! I wonder why some give advice with the expectation that you follow it and if you don't...well...the posse that showed up to help...has now tied the noose around your neck. Your dealing with a mess at home and a hostile VJ mob? How you feel about that? What do you think about that?

P.S. I'm also finding it humorous how the posse has turned on itself. The attempts of 1 posse member to squash anothers freedom of expression. Be religious, but only to the "extent" that I like it. I mean, isn't it obvious that the squashers advice is absolutely the best advice and all should listen? Afterall...it's (guess who), and we all should know by now that (guess who) perspective will probably help. How many more times does (guess who) have to tell us this before we finally get it? (Thank you thank you thank you for staying up so late and sacrificing sleep to enlighten us!)

This probably my last post on this thread. You know what "~happyndinlove~", its too obvious you are pertaining your comments to me and might be some others here, if you don't like my comment here, and want to say something to me, put it under my post. Address me in your post not using "one member". I don't expect at all that Gilles will follow what I've posted here. I am just directly giving my opinion and as well as giving comment on the flow of the arguments here. As for the religious thing, wasn't it hypocrite to quote verses from the Bible and then address people "haters" when they comment negatively?

Your act of backstabbing members here when they try to give comment on how they perceive the arguments here is an example of why threads are being closed even though its really informative to some members. Talking about the freedom of expression? Why not take a look of how you comment on my post as if I can't say negative comment or opinion because you think its inappropriate therefore only sugar-coating words are acceptable. You probably need to check yourself first before giving comment. We're not underage here that couldn't handle negative comments if its the reality. I am not the point of the subject nor the other VJ members who expressed their selves, whether positively or negatively.

Anyway, as for Gilles, I call you coward not because you can't fight other man to defend yourself or your family. It's because you are coward enough to face the reality of your situation or even accepts the loopholes of your decisions. Many VJ members here gave their opinions on your situation from your first post, other post and this thread, and yet same arguments keep going on and on and on. It's so bias that you keep talking about your wife, calling her manipulator and yet she can't defend herself, we only heard your side of the story and our comments here were base on your own story. Even the guilty criminals are given the chance to defend themselves in a trial.

P.S. I don't want to start any sparks here but I am entitled to my own opinion. I don't care whether some VJ members here like it or not because for me its the "Freedom of Expression". I don't suppress others to give their own insights (I don't have power to do that) but this is a free-flowing arguments and everybody can give their own opinions.

Is anybody here expects that the OP will follow their advices?

Edited November 13, 2010 by adiiann

[Loolie 56]

I have no problem with others labeling me a coward. I have a strong background & lots of experience in both child and adult psychology & sociology and have learned that by making derogatory remarks about someone else or by calling them by a derogatory name only reflects poorly on the name caller and not on the one being called the name. I actually encourage those who think I'm a coward to come forward and say so. I like to learn about others. In many cases, saying something negative about someone else reveals a low self-esteem on the part of the name caller.

I could choose to ignore the hostile replies, but I don't. If they have any effect on me, they humor me, as the posters of those attacks don't realize that what they're saying reveals far more about themselves than it does about me.

If "selling myself out" is the price to pay to get useful advice or hear how others have dealt with similar situations, it is a small price to pay. I have no issues posting this stuff in a public forum, as we can all be as anonymous as we choose.

Yes, it's a power struggle. And I'm trying to be nice all the time. I need to test the other approach and that is to be tough - which isn't in my character.

I think I have made it clear that there are many possible ways to deal with someone like my wife. Some work with some people. Some work with other people. Some don't work with certain people. And others don't work with certain people. But if you look for trends, you'll see that in general some approaches work better than other approaches. And what I've learned here and from other sources is that the only thing which will work - if anything will work - is for me to be tough and not give in.

I do find it humorous that those with nothing useful to say actually post in threads. They'll think in their value system the thread serves no purpose, so they'll say something like, "CAN SOMEONE PLEASE SHUT DOWN THIS THREAD, IT SERVES NO PURPOSE", when they don't even participate in it nor did anyone force them to read it.

Maybe if you will let your wife read your two threads then maybe she will understand what your going through. It took you two threads and how many responses for you to know that all you need to do is to be tough and not give in? boy thats tough. How can you love the person? kiss the person but at the back of your head..."I have a vj thread that I need to answer.. about this cheating wife of mine...hmmm" Anyway, goodluck and hope for the best.

[Ban Hammer 13,352]

I think this post has strayed from its original post subject issus and should be closed! Charles where are you on this one????????

if threads in regional forums were closed when they strayed from their original post, there wouldn't be much to do in the regionals.

however, there's a bit of hostility in this thread between posters and some name slinging. that needs to cease.

[~happyndinlove~ 540]

This probably my last post on this thread. You know what "~happyndinlove~", its too obvious you are pertaining your comments to me and might be some others here, if you don't like my comment here, and want to say something to me, put it under my post. Address me in your post not using "one member". I don't expect at all that Gilles will follow what I've posted here. I am just directly giving my opinion and as well as giving comment on the flow of the arguments here. As for the religious thing, wasn't it hypocrite to quote verses from the Bible and then address people "haters" when they comment negatively?

Your act of backstabbing members here when they try to give comment on how they perceive the arguments here is an example of why threads are being closed even though its really informative to some members. Talking about the freedom of expression? Why not take a look of how you comment on my post as if I can't say negative comment or opinion because you think its inappropriate therefore only sugar-coating words are acceptable. You probably need to check yourself first before giving comment. We're not underage here that couldn't handle negative comments if its the reality. I am not the point of the subject nor the other VJ members who expressed their selves, whether positively or negatively.

Anyway, as for Gilles, I call you coward not because you can't fight other man to defend yourself or your family. It's because you are coward enough to face the reality of your situation or even accepts the loopholes of your decisions. Many VJ members here gave their opinions on your situation from your first post, other post and this thread, and yet same arguments keep going on and on and on. It's so bias that you keep talking about your wife, calling her manipulator and yet she can't defend herself, we only heard your side of the story and our comments here were base on your own story. Even the guilty criminals are given the chance to defend themselves in a trial.

P.S. I don't want to start any sparks here but I am entitled to my own opinion. I don't care whether some VJ members here like it or not because for me its the "Freedom of Expression". I don't suppress others to give their own insights (I don't have power to do that) but this is a free-flowing arguments and everybody can give their own opinions.

Is anybody here expects that the OP will follow their advices?

From what I have observed....one reason threads are closed ...is when posters insult and name call another. Example...."you are such a coward"=name calling insult=thread closing. Perhaps an acceptable way to phrase it....you are behaving like a coward or IMO your behavior is cowardly. ...Understand the difference?

Every1 has the right to express themselves freely but in compliance with TOS. I have had to learn this myself having had experience with some of my own posts being removed for TOS violation.

I am curious why you think Kevin is "flaunting" his religion....is there something wrong with his advice to build marriage on a scriptural foundation? I'm not in total agreement with his perspective but I don't have the right or desire to tell him how to steer his own ship.

IMO...you have demonstrated that you include, in your opinon, derogatory words and insulting labels. Why do you do that? Does that make your advice more ....effective?

[Maxx121 14]

Maybe if you will let your wife read your two threads then maybe she will understand what your going through. It took you two threads and how many responses for you to know that all you need to do is to be tough and not give in? boy thats tough. How can you love the person? kiss the person but at the back of your head..."I have a vj thread that I need to answer.. about this cheating wife of mine...hmmm" Anyway, goodluck and hope for the best.

After my last post i made the choice to just stop posting to this thread. I now break that vow to say this is the best idea i have heard anyone give. and when i say best, i mean BEST. you have fully expressed yourself in these threads in a way that im sure you have not to her. LET HER READ IT IF YOU CANT SPEAK IT.

I am now going back to my position on no longer posting.

wishing you the best

ONE

[Kevin- 13]

It's fascinating how people will jump into a thread, turn it into bickering about the person who started the thread, argue against anyone who tries to keep it on-track, then claim it should be closed due to being "off topic".

There is actually still genuine discussion going on about the original post, yet people want so badly to ... what exactly? I don't even know what these actions are trying to accomplish.

Anyway, here is my followup:

The Bible teaches a family hierarchy. The man has the authority and the responsibility as head of the household.

Ephesians 5:23-28. It is authority, but not a blindly-superior type of authority. It's proper authority with full responsibility and willingness to give everything.

Men are commanded to Love their wives, while women are commanded to Respect their husbands. The concept of respect comes naturally to men, but not to women; and the ability to love obviously is how women are built, but not so much men. Women have to "work" at being respectful, and men have to "work" at being loving. If both the man and the woman concentrate on this, the marriage will flourish. Men have to learn to ask themselves "will saying or doing this make my wife feel loved?", while women must ask themselves "will my husband feel that respect him?". Very often wives will say "he has to earn my respect first!", but then this leads to men having a very hard time being loving to a woman who disrespects him.

Ephesians 5:33 as mentioned. The whole passage of 5:22-33 combines these two concepts together.

Also, regarding her "license to be bad". If she is using forgiveness as an excuse to do whatever she wants, then I feel the need to ask what denomination she follows? Knowing this will help me compare what she believes with what the Bible actually teaches, if you would like to help her understand it better. Only a few denominations teach that one can do whatever they want, whenever they want, and just use forgiveness to absolve all responsibility. This is very clearly not how forgiveness and repentance work according to the Bible. We are not forgiven if we intend to do whatever it was again. Forgiveness is freely given, but we have to actually repent in order to receive it. Repentance means not merely acknowledging wrongdoing, but also desiring to never do it again.

This concept is taught throughout the new testament after the Gospels. I'll list several passages about it.

Galations 5:19-23. This contrasts the "works (or desires) of the flesh" to those "of the Spirit". This means the difference between those who walk with the Holy Spirit in their lives and those who allow their "sinful nature" to dictate what they do. "The flesh" wants whatever feels good in the moment, no temperance, pure impulse. Verse 20 specifically contains "hatred, contentions, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions", which may all apply to her behavior. "Dissent" seems especially pertinent.

First John (Not the gospel of John) 3:6-9. This one is quite self explanatory.

First John 1:9. Last part of this verse indicates that a person forgiven will be cleansed from, and therefore not have any remaining wickedness or unrighteousness.

Romans 6:1,2,14,15. Paul twice says "Certainly Not!" in response to the hypothetical questions of whether one should continue to sin when under the grace of God.

Matthew 7:21 is also very important. Not everyone who claims to follow Christ will be saved, only those who do His will.

When you present these things to her, do it in a loving, peaceful way, rather than being confrontational. Don't preach to her, ask her about them. Try to create a real discussion on the topic of these verses.

I would like to strongly reiterate that it may greatly help your marriage, and specifically her behavior, if you develop a genuine interest in Christianity. We can choose to be interested in a topic for the sake of a goal, even if the topic isn't interesting to us in itself. She would then be obligated as a Christian to help you understand, and then no longer has any way to rationalize her excuse of "you don't even believe". You don't have to actually believe it to be interested in it, but if she really means business as a Christian she should be trying to help you in your interest, in the hopes of winning you over. That would also carry with it the victory over her current problems.

Any questions, etc, please let me know.

Edited November 13, 2010 by Kevin-

[Kevin- 13]

Regarding the term "haters". I told Gilles personally to not mind them. There are people directly attacking him as he comes here seeking help, because they apparently seem to think that during the time since their advice has been posted he should have 1. already done exactly what they advised, and thus 2. gotten great results or 3. given up on the whole marriage. Since it seems he's not immediately and completely followed their "flawless" suggestions, he must be a (insert bad name here). These individuals are then attacking anyone who continues to try to help him as well as helping the thread to stay on the topic of helping him.

It is not hypocritical to call something what it is. Being a Christian does not make a person impotent to correct others who are doing wrong, or to properly label people who are behaving in a certain way. Nobody can stop behaving poorly if they are unaware that their behavior is poor. If you don't want to be labeled as a hater, then don't be hateful and angry at a person who has done nothing wrong to you. It seems a certain subset of people here have a very powerful need to create and participate in drama. I'm sure now somebody will accuse me of the same, and label me a hypocrite again. It would once again merely be a deflection.

If you don't think you fit the descriptions I've laid out, then perhaps I'm not even talking to you. So, no need to defend yourself

As can clearly be seen, I'm trying to help Gilles with his situation, and trying to get other people to either do the same or simply leave the thread alone instead of get angry at him.

Edited November 13, 2010 by Kevin-

[SnME 3]

Last night she noticed that her bank account was overdrawn and she blamed me. She accused me of giving her no notice that I was using her account to pay bills and I made it clear that she gave me no notice that she was going to send large sums of money to her family in the Philippines. She said it was OK because it was her money and not our money whereupon I corrected her by saying it was our money. I asked her how she got the money to send to her family and she said she borrowed it. So I asked who she borrowed it from and she said, "my boyfriend" (I'm pretty sure that was just a sarcastic response) and I asked what happens if we don't pay it back. She said they would kill her if she doesn't pay it back. So she has asked me to put money into her bank account so it isn't overdrawn. Please tell me if I'm wrong, but it's clear to me that she needs to be taught a lesson and I'd be foolish to replenish her account. She just doesn't seem to get it that our needs must come first!

When she made the "My Boyfriend" comment, You should have started packing her bags for her... That is not something that she should be joking about IMHO.

If it was "her" bank account (as you claim above), You should not have used it without asking her first. Does she have to ask YOU before using YOUR bank account???

When she said the stuff about how "they would kill her if she doesn't pay it back", You should have asked for her sisters phone number. Let her know for sure that she could easily be replaced by someone better...

Her lies to you now WILL get worse as time goes by. You 'allow' her to do this to you and should have put your foot down from the start.

You should have spent more time getting to know this girl BEFORE you married her.

[thelastpetitioner 218]

thanks to SnME,i missed that comment by gillies

like maxx i made a vow to never post on any gillies related topic again,but its nearly impossible.

gillies im not gonna call you a coward,im gonna call you harmfully simple.

your wife thinks its ok to joke about infidelity in your relationship and youre still trying to work things out with her.

has it ever occurred to you that some things,situations and people are nearly impossible to change?

dont you think a year is enough time for her to change?she is doing what she is doing because she knows in the end of the day,either A) youre just gonna keep on making empty threads or B) youre not gonna keep it up for more than a week.

again like i did 3 pages ago,i suggest individual counseling.youre keeping up with her #######,doesnt make YOU much better

[Gilles 4]

Now she wants me to pay for her schooling and wants the first 3 to 4 months earnings of hers all to herself to pay for a new house for her parents. And she says after that, she would sign 100% of her paychecks over to me, but suggested that I return some 60-70% of her paycheck to her for her own discretionary money (I had a figure in mind of a lot less than that). Furthermore, why should she get more discretionary money than me? While she said she'd still contribute to some bills (just groceries) during those 3-4 months, I have some reservations, as her desire for 60-70% of her paycheck as discretionary money is too much.

I'd like for her to go to school and improve her job skills. But if she just wants to be a money hog, then what's the purpose? Furthermore, she could say she'll sign over her paychecks and then elect not to.

This is getting nauseating, as she pesters me about this every day. She says if I don't agree to this plan, she'll go to "plan B", but won't tell me what that is.