Where is the humour?

[Peikko 1,575]

Nazi imagery, including swastikas, have been and can be used in humorous settings, e.g. Mel Brooks "Springtime for Hitler" from the Producers.

http://www.nytimes.c...d.html?_r=1

It depends on context. I am offended by swastikas which are meant to glorify Nazism, condone antiSemitism, deny the Holocaust, etc.

I am comfortable with swastikas that are used to mock the Third Reich and what it stood for - particularly when it's done with sensitivity and understands the irony of its own message.

Mel Brooks is funny.

Swastikas on a synagogue are NOT. Any defacement of a place of worship is wrong. Swastikas are a particularly, awfully, wrong.

Dix points for finding at least one context where the use/wearing of nazi symbolism is indeed humerous.

Kids vandalising synagogues with them really can't be either humerous or entirely innocuous, in my opinion whether or not a kid truly understands the depth of the harm they cause by such actions, they do know it is at some level offensive.

[Ban Hammer 13,337]

I am comfortable with swastikas that are used to mock the Third Reich and what it stood for - particularly when it's done with sensitivity and understands the irony of its own message.

Mel Brooks is funny.

i've always wanted to see that movie he promised us at the end of history of the world part 1 - hitler on ice.

[scandal 951]

i've always wanted to see that movie he promised us at the end of history of the world part 1 - hitler on ice.

Me too!!

[Danno 1,228]

How could a child come to the conclusion that it is funny to vandalise a synagogue with Swazi stickers without having some understanding of what a Swazi sticker stands for?

Discuss.

IN the first place we must define what "CHild" actually means, big difference between a 10 or 12 yr old and say a 15 yr old.

Kids of all ages just do stupid stuff but by the time a kid is...oh I don't know 15, there is way more accountability.

I think I may have been aware of these things earlier than some of my friend but it was because of the things we watched at my home such as the BBC's WORLD AT WAR and those type things on occasion.

It really only takes one kid who has heard someone say something negative about "Jews" to prompt others to pull this kind of stuff..... which I think they see more as a "prank" than a crime.

We see these same type of vandalism committed against Churches as well: satanic symbols and such it is even gotten to the place that you can not find a house of worship anywhere that does not have sheets of plexi glass protecting stained glass windows from vandals.

[Peikko 1,575]

IN the first place we must define what "CHild" actually means, big difference between a 10 or 12 yr old and say a 15 yr old.

Kids of all ages just do stupid stuff but by the time a kid is...oh I don't know 15, there is way more accountability.

I think I may have been aware of these things earlier than some of my friend but it was because of the things we watched at my home such as the BBC's WORLD AT WAR and those type things on occasion.

It really only takes one kid who has heard someone say something negative about "Jews" to prompt others to pull this kind of stuff..... which I think they see more as a "prank" than a crime.

We see these same type of vandalism committed against Churches as well: satanic symbols and such it is even gotten to the place that you can not find a house of worship anywhere that does not have sheets of plexi glass protecting stained glass windows from vandals.

All fine and dandy, but are you saying that the kids that engage in vandalism find it funny? I don't find anything funny in vandalism, and I see even less humour in vandalism which is done with the intent to intimidate. I also don't think vandalism of any sort is a prank; it is quite definitely a crime although it is more of a misdemeanor if the intention of the child is to do do something as a dare type act and a more serious crime if the intention is to intimidate.

Some graffiti is art - however racist or intimidating slogans are not art.

[mawilson 2,133]

Swazi Stickers:

[Ban Hammer 13,337]

Swazi Stickers:

[Danno 1,228]

All fine and dandy, but are you saying that the kids that engage in vandalism find it funny? I don't find anything funny in vandalism, and I see even less humour in vandalism which is done with the intent to intimidate. I also don't think vandalism of any sort is a prank; it is quite definitely a crime although it is more of a misdemeanor if the intention of the child is to do do something as a dare type act and a more serious crime if the intention is to intimidate.

Some graffiti is art - however racist or intimidating slogans are not art.

MC you kinda sound like the old lady next door (when I was a kid) telling me what "she" found funny or not... as if kids need advice on that or not.

But I would say -Yes, many times kids and even teens do pranks or even vandalism because it's fun or funny... at least seems that way when they are in a group. These type things are rarely done by a single person. (When done by children)

Peer pressure is a powerful thing both to follow and to lead.... and some kids are just trying to do something a "little out there".

Didn't you do or know of such stuff when you were a kid?

Such as Find a fresh pile of dog #######, get it into a paper bag... put it on someone porch, light it on fire, ring the door bell and run in the hopes the home owner will try to stamp it out?

How about put your neighbors garden hose down his cellar window and turn it on.

M-80 in someones mailbox?

Or a smoke bomb in someones mail slot (in the door).

I recall one case where there was a bridal shop next to a 7-11 store, after eating 3/4 of a hostess cherry pie, one kid holds the bridal shop door open while the other kid throws the pie on the dress rack.

And who did not throw hard packed snow balls at cars on the highway?

I guess there were other ones I can't recall that went on but it was basically punk-aZZ early teen stuff done out of fun but which could have had disastrous results in some cases.

[Ban Hammer 13,337]

MC you kinda sound like the old lady next door

[SuperDuper! 230]

MC you kinda sound like the (Mean) old lady next door

Fixxored.

:thumbs:

[Peikko 1,575]

MC you kinda sound like the old lady next door (when I was a kid) telling me what "she" found funny or not... as if kids need advice on that or not.

But I would say -Yes, many times kids and even teens do pranks or even vandalism because it's fun or funny... at least seems that way when they are in a group. These type things are rarely done by a single person. (When done by children)

Peer pressure is a powerful thing both to follow and to lead.... and some kids are just trying to do something a "little out there".

Didn't you do or know of such stuff when you were a kid?

Such as Find a fresh pile of dog #######, get it into a paper bag... put it on someone porch, light it on fire, ring the door bell and run in the hopes the home owner will try to stamp it out?

How about put your neighbors garden hose down his cellar window and turn it on.

M-80 in someones mailbox?

Or a smoke bomb in someones mail slot (in the door).

I recall one case where there was a bridal shop next to a 7-11 store, after eating 3/4 of a hostess cherry pie, one kid holds the bridal shop door open while the other kid throws the pie on the dress rack.

And who did not throw hard packed snow balls at cars on the highway?

I guess there were other ones I can't recall that went on but it was basically punk-aZZ early teen stuff done out of fun but which could have had disastrous results in some cases.

Are you actually trying to trivialise vandalism and all because of some bizarre desire to down play the importance of the use of hate crime ordinances in order to prevent certain groups from being marginalized? Wow!

I didn't engage in any of these so called 'trivial' behaviours of yours. Teens do pull some punk stunts, but they become crimes when they harm or intend to harm others. Some of the ones you illustrate are nearly as bad as malicious criminal damage and vandalism, others not. None of them are 'fun', especially not for the victims and if I knew my kid was doing anything like that he'd lose every privilege he has for months. If that makes me sound like the 'mean old lady next door, too bad.

Perhaps when you have kids and they do this sort of thing you'll laugh it off and tell the people who complain to 'lighten up'? Kids are after all just kids, right?You wouldn't want to be known as the 'mean dad' after all would you? You'd rather be 'friends' with the neighbourhood punk asses.

Edited October 17, 2010 by Madame Cleo

[Danno 1,228]

Are you actually trying to trivialise vandalism and all because of some bizarre desire to down play the importance of the use of hate crime ordinances in order to prevent certain groups from being marginalized? Wow!

I didn't engage in any of these so called 'trivial' behaviours of yours. Teens do pull some punk stunts, but they become crimes when they harm or intend to harm others. Some of the ones you illustrate are nearly as bad as malicious criminal damage and vandalism, others not. None of them are 'fun', especially not for the victims and if I knew my kid was doing anything like that he'd lose every privilege he has for months. If that makes me sound like the 'mean old lady next door, too bad.

Perhaps when you have kids and they do this sort of thing you'll laugh it off and tell the people who complain to 'lighten up'? Kids are after all just kids, right?You wouldn't want to be known as the 'mean dad' after all would you? You'd rather be 'friends' with the neighbourhood punk asses.

I didn't say you were the Mean-mom, I said you sound like the mean old lady next door who would point her finger in the kids face and announce "I don't find that funny one bit" ...

as if her judgment should be a kids guide to humor..

No one is trying to do anything but explore the issue you raIsed in your title of this thread: "where is the humor".

I'm sure you didn't partake in any of the pranks or out right vandalism which many boys do but that does not mean they are not

-very common

- nor done out of meanness

-often done with very little forethought or deep thought.

Where did I suggest, when caught punishment is not in order?

But are you really going to charge a 10yr old with a hate crime?

That seems wacky to me.

[Peikko 1,575]

I don't think you were 'exploring the question' at all, because you fail to address how a kid associates nazi symbolism with Jewish synagogues in the first place.

Who said anything about charging a 10 year old with a hate crime btw? I am merely pointing out that any act that has the effect of harming others would illicit extreme punishment in my house and I wonder how any kid can find enjoyment out of causing harm. My kid certainly 'gets it' in that regard and he's only 11.

Edited October 18, 2010 by Madame Cleo