Ukraine K-1 initial denial - next steps to fix

[Mehmet&Elena 20]

Please please please, don't derail this thread. Your case in not unique and you are fine. My wife and I corrsponded for three months, met for 10 days and then 10 months later she had her interview. Never was there a question about our relatioship relative to the time lenght. You either have a real relationship or you do not. Period.

I appologize for posting to this thread. I should have started a new discussian.

[birdman2010 0]

Oddly enough, that would usually be enough for Kiev. I would say that he has not provided enough evidence of "intense chatting". He should also include evidence of the other things he says he did. They do not "assume" that because she does not have a job that you are her source of income...but beware that two edged sword! For every piece of evidence you sent her money, there should be even more that there were other aspects to the relationship

The Skype logs are rather long. Included with them were excerpts, and then a separate very-small-font printout showing the bulk - that there had been much more.

Also not really shown are all the videos I made for her.

Included with the original application and with what she brought were copies of cards, phone logs, Skype log excerpts, a listing of the videos I made for her, notes about roses sent.

We don't have audio transcripts of what we talked about during our webcam chats, but there were many such conversations.

Anyway I've mostly composed a four page single spaced letter. It goes into some more detail about how we met, why I decided to move forward with asking her, and what I detected from her has we met.

Here's some excerpts from the new letter:

------------------------------------------- draft begins

Greetings Ms. Hennessey,

I am writing to you about a visa for my fiancée. This letter is being sent via fax and mail.

I wanted you to know that I am incredibly concerned about the initial denial of a visa for my fiancée. I respectfully request your assistance with having a visa for my fiancée granted.

In the recent email letter sent to my fiancée there were a couple of errors. The letter talks about a period of chatting of only six months. This is not accurate. Also, my fiancée did bring to your embassy a copy of my I-134 form, and from what I understand "...a K-1 applicant is not required to have a material basis for expatriation..." – an affidavit of support (I-134) has already been sent.

I met my fiancée in October of 2009 at Café Tokio House in Odessa, Ukraine. I met her by happenstance, because a friend of hers invited her along to meet me. my fiancée was sweet, and we did have an immediate and fast romantic connection right from the beginning.

It took me a little while to realize what was happening – to recognize her initial interest, and also my own feelings. So, when I returned to Ukraine in January of this year, I very much worked to rectify my past mistake in not following up sooner.

While I was in Odessa in January, I walked with her in the central city garden near Afina. I sat on a park bench and looked in her eyes, and I told her that I was sorry that I had made a mistake in the past – by not recognizing earlier our mutual connection. She looked back at me in a loving & caring way, and we both connected & developed a deeper emotional connection and a commitment to move forward with our relationship. And yes, during my visit in January she and I did physically touch each other affectionately, and in a way that aligns with what lovers do & more than just friends.

After my return to the U.S. I continued to talk with my fiancée, over the phone, and online via Skype’s webcam conversing service.

One key thing I would like to convey to you that webcam chatting is of a different fidelity and character than mere phone or text chatting. Fortunately, and thankfully, Skype with webcam chatting was available to us. It helped us maintain & deepen our relationship. I want you to realize that our so-called “Internet chatting” has not been trivial. We have connected emotionally via these chats which included us being able to see each other and to be able to hear each other’s voice in detail. The minor intonations & details of our voices were shared, so that we could detect what each of us was feeling. This was only possible with the higher fidelity conversations we were able to have via webcam conversing. Also our chatting has taken place at all hours of the day and night, chats that left us both without sleep the next day – or having a hard time working the next day because either of us had spoken at either midnight or at 3AM the night before. This happened many times. Are these the actions of a couple merely interested in a “fling?” No. The time we’ve spent, the commitment, and the concern we’ve felt when we could not chat – these are not trivial things.

Your staff does not have audio transcripts of the webcam conversations I have had with my fiancée. I wish I could provide such a thing. But I can swear to you that our webcam conversations have not been trivial. They have been of a couple who is growing to love & care for each other, and of a couple who wants to move forward to the next step in life.

From all of my conversations with my fiancée, I have come to know that she is a strong woman, a woman of deep conviction, and also that she has developed deep romantic feelings for me. She is also very sweet, and she is not a woman who easily decides to make a big life decision like this.

My fiancée has placed in me a lot of trust. It does take a lot of trust for someone to come over to a country one has not been to yet. But, not trivially, she has decided that she wants to come to live with me as my fiancée so that we can then marry. This was not something she sought herself at first. I worked to convince her. And, when she became convinced, I then worked to show her what life would be like, and to continue our connection. She has placed her trust in me. I hope that you can honor this trust as well by honoring her visa request.

In your most recently email to my fiancée your staff states that my fiancée and I have only been chatting for six months. This is not true. We have been chatting in earnest for about ten months now. I just consulted the Skype logs on my home computer and found that the first Skype message I exchanged with my fiancée was on January 20, 2010, after my return to the U.S.A. from Ukraine. Here is the very first entry form the log:

Hello Jonatan! Thank you very much four you flowers and candys. It is so beautiful and sweet. How are you, how are you rest in NEW Yourk

I shall include with this letter more excerpts from the Skype logs, showing that was have been conversing for nearly ten months now via Skype. But, one thing the logs may not fully show (because they are long & detailed) is that we have had many webcam conversations. No, not just text. Not just phone. Webcam conversations – and as previously noted, these conversations were of a much high quality & higher emotional fidelity than the other methods.

Also, so that my fiancée & I could better communicate, I helped her obtain a computer and webcam. And with her computer & webcam she was able to see how I lived my life. My fiancée was able to evaluate what my life is like, what my family is like, and to be able to decide for herself whether to come over. She decided to say “yes.”

My fiancée was also able to see my mother before she passed away. One of the final videos of my mother was made for my fiancée. She was happy to see my mother before she passed away. And she also became very impressed by my family.

I know that my fiancée has no special interest in coming to America “just to come.” I know that she wants to come as my fiancée – and that this is her primary reason. She is a woman of principle and honor – a strong Ukrainain woman who is also very sweet. We have connected. We can get along. We can work things out. We have worked through problems as they have come up. We have seen each other’s ups and downs, and we’ve learned how to move forward.

For the past several months we have been “as a couple” – emotionally tied. Worried when we could not talk. Very concerned for the other’s welfare. Deeply emotionally tied. Our relationship is not trivial.

But one key thing I would like you to know is that my fiancée has been able to see how I live my life, via the following method: Via her viewing of many videos that I created for her, on a special section of Youtube.com and Blip.tv. Many hours of videos. And my fiancée took the time to review these videos, in detail. She spent many hours taking time to carefully review the videos I made for her. Here are the two websites I used to share the videos I made for my fiancée:

[]

Your staff is welcome to visit these sites so that you may see the titles of all that I have shared to her. On the second site you can see all the titles listed by clicking on “episode archive.”

The time my fiancée spent reviewing these videos, so that she could better see what life is like in Utah & Salt Lake City – this shows that her interest is more than trivial.

My fiancée is a beautiful woman that is true.

I do feel very lucky that she expressed a romantic interest in me, in October of 2009.

And I am glad that I was able to follow up on her initial interest in January of 2010, during the Ukrainian Christmas and New Year.

We went out together several times, and we visited the Dolphinarium in Odessa, which is where the photos of us together were taken.

We have exchanged packages both ways, and greeting cards, and letters, in the regular postal mail. I have sent many greeting cards to my fiancée - much more than what was given to you in the previous documentation, and as she was able she also sent cards back to me, through the post, and she also sent to me two packages.

In addition to Skype webcam chatting, and phone, and email, we have also had many SMS exchanges. Every method of communication at our disposal – we have used these methods. But, more exceptionally, is all the time my fiancee has spent reviewing the key videos I shared. Videos where I sang to her. Videos where I showed her my dying mother. Videos where I showed my birds to her, where I would take my birds on hikes in the mountains – all to put my fiancee more at ease with coming, and to show how her I cared for her.

And, exceptionally, my fiancee took time to sit, with her slow but functional Internet connection at her home, to sit and review these videos – so that she could decide on her own what to do. And she decided to say yes – to proceed. And so we have proceeded. And here we are before you.

Like any relationship, there is an initial interest. There is further conversation. There is sharing of more details. And then comes marriage and moving forward.

I am very committed to making a marriage relationship with my fiancee work. And I do not doubt my fiancee's honest commitment to come to live with me as my fiancée so that we can be married.

We have been talking in earnest for nearly 10 months, and talking at a higher level than what mere text and mere phone conversations can allow. When I hear my fiancée speak and when I can see her face, the fidelity is substantially greater and it allows more emotional detail to be conveyed both ways. This has been the quality of our conversations since January of this year.

And, in January when I sat on a bench in the city garden of Odessa, and as I looked into the eyes of my fiancée as she stood in front of me and expressed to her my deep feelings for her, and about how I was sorry for not following up sooner than that to her – that was not a trivial experience. It was a deep emotional experience for both of us. It was the foundation for what we both hope is the foundation for having a happy life together.

This is not an arrangement of mere convenience. Not trivial. This is about two people who have grown to love each other. I did my part, as any man should, to share what my life is like here in the beautiful state of Utah. She said “yes” to being my fiancée. And so now, I hope you can allow us to proceed on to the next key phase of our lives.

If I must come to Kiev to attend a second interview at the embassy, I will.

If I must come to Odessa, to marry my fiancee while in Ukraine, and to instead do a K-3 visa, I will.

I am committed to making this work, because a beautiful sweet & strong woman who shows she’s also interested in moving forward – that does not happen every day. A person you can talk to. A person who you develop deep feelings for. A person you want to take hands with & share a life with. These things do not happen every day in one person’s life. This is our chance.

And so, with all due respect, I’ll do whatever it takes to make this happen.

I respectfully & humbly & earnestly request that you allow the normal happy K-1 visa process to play out in our case.

Please allow my fiancée to come to America.

Thank you for your time in consideration of this issue.

--------------------------- end of draft

So that's what I have so far. If you have suggestions on additions or deletions I'll make up the final version tonight. And tomorrow I'll call my congress people for backup.

And I plan to include more Skype logs excerpts with the letter.

[baron555 934]

The Skype logs are rather long. Included with them were excerpts, and then a separate very-small-font printout showing the bulk - that there had been much more.

Also not really shown are all the videos I made for her.

Included with the original application and with what she brought were copies of cards, phone logs, Skype log excerpts, a listing of the videos I made for her, notes about roses sent.

We don't have audio transcripts of what we talked about during our webcam chats, but there were many such conversations.

Anyway I've mostly composed a four page single spaced letter.

Make it easy to read. Use paragraphs where appropriate and double space accordingly.

It goes into some more detail about how we met, why I decided to move forward with asking her, and what I detected from her has we met.

Here's some excerpts from the new letter:

------------------------------------------- draft begins

Greetings Ms. Hennessey,

I am writing to you about a visa for my fiancée. This letter is being sent via fax and mail.

I wanted you to know that I am incredibly concerned about the initial denial of a visa for my fiancée. I respectfully request your assistance with having a visa for my fiancée granted.

In the recent email letter sent to my fiancée there were a couple of errors. The letter talks about a period of chatting of only six months. This is not accurate. Also, my fiancée did bring to your embassy a copy of my I-134 form, and from what I understand "...a K-1 applicant is not required to have a material basis for expatriation..." an affidavit of support (I-134) has already been sent.

Dont' go here. You can detail the timelines for them later but don't need to say they made an error, at least directly. It does not make for an even playing field.

I met my fiancée in October of 2009 at Café Tokio House in Odessa, Ukraine. I met her by happenstance, because a friend of hers invited her along to meet me. my fiancée was sweet, and we did have an immediate and fast romantic connection right from the beginning.

Get rid of the sweet. She's a person.

It took me a little while to realize what was happening to recognize her initial interest, and also my own feelings. So, when I returned to Ukraine in January of this year, I very much worked to rectify my past mistake in not following up sooner.

What mistake? Dont' talk about mistakes.

While I was in Odessa in January, I walked with her in the central city garden near Afina. I sat on a park bench and looked in her eyes, and I told her that I was sorry that I had made a mistake in the past by not recognizing earlier our mutual connection. She looked back at me in a loving & caring way, and we both connected & developed a deeper emotional connection and a commitment to move forward with our relationship. And yes, during my visit in January she and I did physically touch each other affectionately, and in a way that aligns with what lovers do & more than just friends.

Leave out this fluff. You looked in her eyes and fell in love? Please, strike this. Tell us about the relationship, not your eyes or your feelings, in this manner.

After my return to the U.S. I continued to talk with my fiancée, over the phone, and online via Skypes webcam conversing service.

Itemize this. How many hours have you talked on Skype. What about phone calls? How many SMS messages sent?

One key thing I would like to convey to you that webcam chatting is of a different fidelity and character than mere phone or text chatting. Fortunately, and thankfully, Skype with webcam chatting was available to us. It helped us maintain & deepen our relationship. I want you to realize that our so-called Internet chatting has not been trivial. We have connected emotionally via these chats which included us being able to see each other and to be able to hear each others voice in detail. The minor intonations & details of our voices were shared, so that we could detect what each of us was feeling. This was only possible with the higher fidelity conversations we were able to have via webcam conversing. Also our chatting has taken place at all hours of the day and night, chats that left us both without sleep the next day or having a hard time working the next day because either of us had spoken at either midnight or at 3AM the night before. This happened many times. Are these the actions of a couple merely interested in a fling? No. The time weve spent, the commitment, and the concern weve felt when we could not chat these are not trivial things.

But you still are telling about your relationship. Talk about the details of what you talked about; not about the fidelity of the communication.

Your staff does not have audio transcripts of the webcam conversations I have had with my fiancée. I wish I could provide such a thing. But I can swear to you that our webcam conversations have not been trivial. They have been of a couple who is growing to love & care for each other, and of a couple who wants to move forward to the next step in life.

Then describe the conversations in general terms and describe what you talked about and how the conversations changed as you got to know each other.

From all of my conversations with my fiancée, I have come to know that she is a strong woman, a woman of deep conviction, and also that she has developed deep romantic feelings for me. She is also very sweet, and she is not a woman who easily decides to make a big life decision like this.

My fiancée has placed in me a lot of trust. It does take a lot of trust for someone to come over to a country one has not been to yet. But, not trivially, she has decided that she wants to come to live with me as my fiancée so that we can then marry. This was not something she sought herself at first. I worked to convince her. And, when she became convinced, I then worked to show her what life would be like, and to continue our connection. She has placed her trust in me. I hope that you can honor this trust as well by honoring her visa request.

No stuff Sherlock. Leave this out, doesn't speak to the relationship.

In your most recently email to my fiancée your staff states that my fiancée and I have only been chatting for six months. This is not true. We have been chatting in earnest for about ten months now. I just consulted the Skype logs on my home computer and found that the first Skype message I exchanged with my fiancée was on January 20, 2010, after my return to the U.S.A. from Ukraine. Here is the very first entry form the log:

You should have already detailed this earlier.

Hello Jonatan! Thank you very much four you flowers and candys. It is so beautiful and sweet. How are you, how are you rest in NEW Yourk

I shall include with this letter more excerpts from the Skype logs, showing that was have been conversing for nearly ten months now via Skype. But, one thing the logs may not fully show (because they are long & detailed) is that we have had many webcam conversations. No, not just text. Not just phone. Webcam conversations and as previously noted, these conversations were of a much high quality & higher emotional fidelity than the other methods.

What other records are you sending? I sent monthly summaries showing international calls on my phone and the international SMS message listings. any emails? I sent a bunch of select emails that if one was to read them show a couple becoming involved, learning about each other, planning the meeting together, doing the visa process together and then learning more about each other. Your evidence should show the same. You spoken words may not be enough, your evidence should show the same. What about pictures? You two met up many times, there should be tons of pictures of you two together. What about Skype videosnapshots? Did you take any of these.

Also, so that my fiancée & I could better communicate, I helped her obtain a computer and webcam. And with her computer & webcam she was able to see how I lived my life.

Didn't she have a webcam access before? How would she have Skyped with you, leave it out. Does nothing to prove a real relationship, just that you bought her a computer.

My fiancée was able to evaluate what my life is like, what my family is like, and to be able to decide for herself whether to come over. She decided to say yes.

My fiancée was also able to see my mother before she passed away. One of the final videos of my mother was made for my fiancée. She was happy to see my mother before she passed away. And she also became very impressed by my family.

Talk more about this. This is very emotional and if you can send them the link or some photo snapshots?

I know that my fiancée has no special interest in coming to America just to come.

Don't even mention this. Of course not. No reason to mention it, you may indirectly be placing a thought into the CO's head.

I know that she wants to come as my fiancée and that this is her primary reason. She is a woman of principle and honor a strong Ukrainain woman who is also very sweet. We have connected. We can get along. We can work things out. We have worked through problems as they have come up. We have seen each others ups and downs, and weve learned how to move forward.

For the past several months we have been as a couple emotionally tied. Worried when we could not talk. Very concerned for the others welfare. Deeply emotionally tied. Our relationship is not trivial.

But one key thing I would like you to know is that my fiancée has been able to see how I live my life, via the following method: Via her viewing of many videos that I created for her, on a special section of Youtube.com and Blip.tv. Many hours of videos. And my fiancée took the time to review these videos, in detail. She spent many hours taking time to carefully review the videos I made for her. Here are the two websites I used to share the videos I made for my fiancée:

[]

Your staff is welcome to visit these sites so that you may see the titles of all that I have shared to her. On the second site you can see all the titles listed by clicking on episode archive.

Do a screen print of this and send it along.

The time my fiancée spent reviewing these videos, so that she could better see what life is like in Utah & Salt Lake City this shows that her interest is more than trivial.

My fiancée is a beautiful woman that is true.

Don't go here; there is no such thing as a MOB.

I do feel very lucky that she expressed a romantic interest in me, in October of 2009.

Again, you are not lucky, you met a wonderfull woman and after you two got to know each other, you felt you each met your mate and then met again in person and now want to be married, forever. Mention that word a lot.

And I am glad that I was able to follow up on her initial interest in January of 2010, during the Ukrainian Christmas and New Year.

We went out together several times, and we visited the Dolphinarium in Odessa, which is where the photos of us together were taken.

We have exchanged packages both ways, and greeting cards, and letters, in the regular postal mail. I have sent many greeting cards to my fiancée - much more than what was given to you in the previous documentation, and as she was able she also sent cards back to me, through the post, and she also sent to me two packages.

Itemize these out. Send in the receipts, whatever you have. maybe the online purchase summary

In addition to Skype webcam chatting, and phone, and email, we have also had many SMS exchanges. Every method of communication at our disposal we have used these methods. But, more exceptionally, is all the time my fiancee has spent reviewing the key videos I shared. Videos where I sang to her. Videos where I showed her my dying mother. Videos where I showed my birds to her, where I would take my birds on hikes in the mountains all to put my fiancee more at ease with coming, and to show how her I cared for her.

Talk about the relationshp and not the birds.

And, exceptionally, my fiancee took time to sit, with her slow but functional Internet connection at her home, to sit and review these videos so that she could decide on her own what to do. And she decided to say yes to proceed. And so we have proceeded. And here we are before you.

Again, of course she said yes, she agreed to send in the petition and signed the Letter of Intent. No need to repeat.

Like any relationship, there is an initial interest. There is further conversation. There is sharing of more details. And then comes marriage and moving forward.

I am very committed to making a marriage relationship with my fiancee work. And I do not doubt my fiancee's honest commitment to come to live with me as my fiancée so that we can be married.

It should be we are committed, not I don't doubt. All the doubting should have been gone a long time ago in a serious relationshp.

We have been talking in earnest for nearly 10 months, and talking at a higher level than what mere text and mere phone conversations can allow. When I hear my fiancée speak and when I can see her face, the fidelity is substantially greater and it allows more emotional detail to be conveyed both ways. This has been the quality of our conversations since January of this year.

Your repeating yourself. Enough said about the advantages of Skype

And, in January when I sat on a bench in the city garden of Odessa, and as I looked into the eyes of my fiancée as she stood in front of me and expressed to her my deep feelings for her, and about how I was sorry for not following up sooner than that to her that was not a trivial experience. It was a deep emotional experience for both of us. It was the foundation for what we both hope is the foundation for having a happy life together.

Show this in the evidence. Makes for a nice romance story, but what about your relationshp?

This is not an arrangement of mere convenience. Not trivial. This is about two people who have grown to love each other. I did my part, as any man should, to share what my life is like here in the beautiful state of Utah.

Dont' go here.

She said yes to being my fiancée. And so now, I hope you can allow us to proceed on to the next key phase of our lives.

You mean you both said yes to become married together. You see it's not a I made a decision or she made a decision, it's WE both made a decision, together. Together together together, like a married couple should. You are intending to get married. Act like it and talk like it.

If I must come to Kiev to attend a second interview at the embassy, I will.

If I must come to Odessa, to marry my fiancee while in Ukraine, and to instead do a K-3 visa, I will.

Don't mention this. Serves no purpose.

I am committed to making this work, because a beautiful sweet & strong woman who shows shes also interested in moving forward that does not happen every day. A person you can talk to. A person who you develop deep feelings for. A person you want to take hands with & share a life with. These things do not happen every day in one persons life. This is our chance.

And so, with all due respect, Ill do whatever it takes to make this happen.

L:eave the above out.

I respectfully & humbly & earnestly request that you allow the normal happy K-1 visa process to play out in our case.

Please allow my fiancée to come to America.

No, it's Please allow this couple to come together so they can be happily married, forever.

Thank you for your time in consideration of this issue.

--------------------------- end of draft

So that's what I have so far. If you have suggestions on additions or deletions I'll make up the final version tonight. And tomorrow I'll call my congress people for backup.

And I plan to include more Skype logs excerpts with the letter.

I hope you don't think I'm too strong but just my suggestions.

Edited October 11, 2010 by baron555

[baron555 934]

I hope you don't think I'm too strong but just my suggestions.

Again, I think there is more than you have told. What questions were asked at the interview and how were they answered?

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

I am not going to copy your whole letter and Baron has done about as good a job as possible with dissecting it anyway.

This whole case is very bizarre so it is difficult to say "do this.." By all rights they should either...

1. Issue a visa

2. Deny the visa and return the case to USCIS

3. Issue a specific 212(g) request for more information

They have done neither of those so who knows what the heck they will accept. I would normally say you may as well p*ss in the wind as to write them some sappy letter after the initial review professing your love and all the junk about looking in her eyes. I'm not sure if there was any indication at our interview that I even knew Alla HAD eyes let alone that I ever looked into them. I mean you have been DENIED (kind of) a visa and now you write a letter describing all this? Who would have guessed?

Electronic media is not allowed for evidence. Again, this case is wacky, maybe the will look at your webcam videos. Normally such a suggestion would be tossed.

DO NOT ask if you should go to the interview. Sheeeesh. Get a clue. IF you want her to get a visa, you WILL go to the next interview. Do not expect them to invite you.

I highly doubt the letter will have any effect at all. It appears from what Alla tells me from reading what you posted, that you could just call the call center tomorrow and schedule a new interview. Frankly I find that hard to believe but I trust Alla's translation of the letter and they definitely say you can make another application. (they almost always say that with any denial also, but it usually means they are sending the case back to USCIS and you have to file a new petition) They have NOT stated they are returning the case and they say nothing about filing a new petition. Alla's interpretation of the letter is that the main problem is that there is not enough evidence to support the request for a K-1 visa to "start a family". I am not sure in this case if that means they need MORE skype logs or not. She says it sounds as though "they think you met and then sometime later filed for a fiancee visa"

MY reaction to this would be to gather together all the other evidence I could and then call the call center and ask for a new interview. Or maybe call the call center first and ask and then gather the evidence, giving myself a couple weeks to do so. Go with her to the interview and hand the documents through the window to them yourself. I wouldn;t even wirte the letter. Just me. To my way of thinking there is nothing more detached, phony and uncaring than writing a letter after the fact to profess your love. They really don't even care if you are in love, they care if you have a relationship that would lead to marriage in any normal circumstance. More correctly, they care that you are NOT just doing this to circumvent immigration procedures. It isn't so much you have to "prove your love" as it is you have to prove you aren't committing fraud.

Make sure there are no discrepancies in her biographical data, though no such thing is listed specifically in their letter and Alla does not think it is being made an issue. I cannot get past the fact they mentioned she was unemployed. There is no requirement for the benefciary to be employed and a large percentage of Ukrainian fiancees are not employed, at least not on paper. There are a lot of people that have "black money" jobs in Ukraine and they list themselves as unemployed. Why this is an issue at all, I have no clue. THAT concerns me. What is it they AREN'T saying?

The extra information you sent with the petition is of little value for the interview and it indicates things that happened before the petition was filed. What has happened SINCE the petition was filed, that is what they want to know. Certainly you should include it at the interview, but there needs to be more "there" there.

And finally, yes, what DID they ask at the interview?

[birdman2010 0]

Well apparently I need to redraft the letter.

One question I have though is whether they will allow me to schedule a second interview?

I will work on the letter more this evening, but maybe I should send nothing and just call for a second interview date?

The problem is that there's a bit of a disconnect between the schedulers and the people who work in the consular office. The schedulers don't discuss case issues. And if I schedule a new interview (if I am able to) will the consular section see this and know not to send things back to USCIS?

Perhaps the letter I send shall start with the following:

----------------

On Tuesday I shall be calling to see if a second interview can be scheduled. I shall plan to attend this second interview.

If, after reading this letter, your office decides that a second interview is not warranted and the visa can be immediately granted, then please let me & my fiancee know. But in the mean time on Tuesday morning Kiev time I will call to your call center in an attempt to schedule a second interview.

---------------- end

In the interview they asked her about how we met and what our relationship was. She said the man was friendly, that he smiled and was positive, but he also said that it was not up to him to decide. He reportedly told her that he thought her intentions were genuine or some such thing. I hope to have more details later. But tonight I'm working on this homework as noted.

Edited October 11, 2010 by birdman2010

[baron555 934]

Well apparently I need to redraft the letter.

One question I have though is whether they will allow me to schedule a second interview?

I will work on the letter more this evening, but maybe I should send nothing and just call for a second interview date?

The problem is that there's a bit of a disconnect between the schedulers and the people who work in the consular office. The schedulers don't discuss case issues. And if I schedule a new interview (if I am able to) will the consular section see this and know not to send things back to USCIS?

Perhaps the letter I send shall start with the following:

----------------

On Tuesday I shall be calling to see if a second interview can be scheduled. I shall plan to attend this second interview.

If, after reading this letter, your office decides that a second interview is not warranted and the visa can be immediately granted, then please let me & my fiancee know. But in the mean time on Tuesday morning Kiev time I will call to your call center in an attempt to schedule a second interview.

---------------- end

In the interview they asked her about how we met and what our relationship was. She said the man was friendly, that he smiled and was positive, but he also said that it was not up to him to decide. He reportedly told her that he thought her intentions were genuine or some such thing. I hope to have more details later. But tonight I'm working on this homework as noted.

I would redraft the letter and in it address only your relationship and it's timeline and in it tie together all the new evidence, plus the old, that will show to the casual observer, you have a real relationship that has gone through all the typical steps.

Then separately, call and reschedule a second interview and plan to be there.

They may read your letter and approve the visa, whereupon the second interview is not required and can be cancelled by them.

OR, they don't read your letter and go for the second interview.

They are different entities and don't mix them up. Good luck.

Let's hope that you realized through this process the you need to do this proving at the interview stage and you have tons of solid and different types of evidence to show you have a real relationship.

Worst case is you have to repetition all over again but then you'll have time to build more evidence and more than just Skype calls. The lesson to other newbies is to ensure you "create" different types of evidence and make sure it is meaningful and can be used to prove to a complete stranger, that "here are two people in love and committed to being together and becoming married and not circumventing any immigration requirements."

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Well apparently I need to redraft the letter.

One question I have though is whether they will allow me to schedule a second interview?

I will work on the letter more this evening, but maybe I should send nothing and just call for a second interview date?

The problem is that there's a bit of a disconnect between the schedulers and the people who work in the consular office. The schedulers don't discuss case issues. And if I schedule a new interview (if I am able to) will the consular section see this and know not to send things back to USCIS?

Perhaps the letter I send shall start with the following:

----------------

On Tuesday I shall be calling to see if a second interview can be scheduled. I shall plan to attend this second interview.

If, after reading this letter, your office decides that a second interview is not warranted and the visa can be immediately granted, then please let me & my fiancee know. But in the mean time on Tuesday morning Kiev time I will call to your call center in an attempt to schedule a second interview.

---------------- end

In the interview they asked her about how we met and what our relationship was. She said the man was friendly, that he smiled and was positive, but he also said that it was not up to him to decide. He reportedly told her that he thought her intentions were genuine or some such thing. I hope to have more details later. But tonight I'm working on this homework as noted.

Call the call center and ask for a new interview date. If they give you one, then we know they will allow it. From my interpretation of Alla's interpretation of the letter, that is what I understand they are allowing you to do. If they are intending to deny the case and send it back, they will not show you as eligible for an interview. Seems strange it could be just that simple...but it could be just that simple. The call center opens in about 3 hours and you can find out easy.

The whole "letter thing" does nothing for me. (not that what it does for me matters, really) But they want to see EVIDENCE not a letter speaking about evidence. They don't want to hear how you looked into her eyes (Bozhih moy! kill me now!) They want to see a photo of the two of you sitting on that bench in Odessa. I will bet it is the same bench I have a photo of Alla and I sitting on. I had a plaque made for the headstone of Alla's grandmother. I brought it to the cemetary in Russia myself and installed it myself and have photos of me installing it, photos of us together at the cemetary and a Russian visa and passport stamps. I showed them all that but never SAID I had the plaque made (you think it was easy getting a plque made with Cyrillic writing in the USA?)

Then I will stick with my recommendation that you should be there for the interview. Don't ask, just go. Kiev DOES allow the US citizen into the interview area and often up to the window during the actual interview

[Used to be broken 147]

Hi.

Why are they mentioning that she is unemployed? Technically she's self employed,

They do still have her passport.

The interview took place.

They did take her passport.

They did not take the fee.

In the interview they told her she'd have to return and pay the fee if the visa was approved (even though she's in Odessa & she'd have to fly back again).

Here is a couple "clues" that I see.

Something at the interview "red_flagged" the situation.

Ask her if anyone has ever submitted a fiance VISA application on her behalf before.

Also someone not being employed for 6 months since is mentioned.. they always tell you not to quit your job or make any travel arrangements prior to the VISA approval.. some consulars red-flag this as here.

My guess is something about the interview answers, her demeanor during the interview or perhaps her inability to converse in English.. brought up the question of how you are communicating to the point of proposal ..perhaps.. just some ideas..

[Used to be broken 147]

Oh, also just caught at the end of the letter they tell her they gave her a map to the Embassy to come back an pick up her passport. Indicates intention to deny I think.

I will be watching this thread to see how it pans out ..keep us posted.

Edited October 12, 2010 by brokenfamily

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

I would redraft the letter and in it address only your relationship and it's timeline and in it tie together all the new evidence, plus the old, that will show to the casual observer, you have a real relationship that has gone through all the typical steps.

Then separately, call and reschedule a second interview and plan to be there.

They may read your letter and approve the visa, whereupon the second interview is not required and can be cancelled by them.

OR, they don't read your letter and go for the second interview.

They are different entities and don't mix them up. Good luck.

Let's hope that you realized through this process the you need to do this proving at the interview stage and you have tons of solid and different types of evidence to show you have a real relationship.

Worst case is you have to repetition all over again but then you'll have time to build more evidence and more than just Skype calls. The lesson to other newbies is to ensure you "create" different types of evidence and make sure it is meaningful and can be used to prove to a complete stranger, that "here are two people in love and committed to being together and becoming married and not circumventing any immigration requirements."

Good advice. Like it or not, you are in a process that requires you to present evidence at certain stages. AOS is the next one after the visa is issued and then the lifting of conditions. I just sent off another stack of evidence to USCIS for lifting of conditions. You have to conduct your relationship in a way that generates evidence in the form of paper that you can prove to someone else. Web videos are no good if they do not accept them, besides a video of you showing your fiancee your home or city means nothing really. Heck, I sent Alla photos of my toilet because she wanted to be sure that I had one! At the time I lived on an island in a village and such a lifestyle in Ukraine would definitely mean "outdoor toilets" Should I give a photo of my toilet tp the consulate? What about all the photos of ceramic tile I sent by email so she could pick the tile I put in the bathroom before she came? How would anyone know it was for her? I didn't mention those things.

It is something you and your fiancee/wife need to be cognizant of. You are NOT like other couples. They do not need government approval from people that do not know you and make decisions based on 30 second interviews. If you do not crush them with evidence from the get go, you are shoveling sh*t in the tide. That means photos, emails, calling cards that have a record of calls made, snail mail, etc. Alla makes a point to get our photo taken wherever we go, parties, get togethers, cities we visit, family gatherings, the beach, the mountains, apple picking, bowling, shopping. Keep the camera with you, ask someone to take your photo. We keep the envelopes of letters sent here and addressed to both of us. I stood at the copy machine at Staples for more than an hour last week just to copy all I sent (I have a copy of each piece of paper) and that is just the COPY time. I fully expect to have conditions lifted with no interview and no RFEs. I will be SHOCKED if we do not get approved no questions asked. Then we are done you do not need any of that stuff for citizenship and then I can burn the whole three boxes full of stuff I have had for four years...as soon as we do Sergey's lifting of conditions next year.

[birdman2010 0]

Well apparently I need to redraft the letter.

Here's the latest draft. Thanks for the suggestions. I plan to send the letter via email, fax, and regular mail this evening - because it seems to be there's a time issue at hand, and also an issue of "making an impact."

I don't want to make things worse. So it's now a choice between sending such a letter or not. Calling to a senator or not. But we'll keep pressing onward. But I must say that this is an emotional drain on both of us, after all the work we've put into this & the hoping things would go smoothly.

I may insert my fiancee's name into places below where I just say "my fiancée."

And thanks for your help. I've worked on this most of the day since I heard the news. Since they still have her passport I thought I needed to get something off to them ASAP.

-------------------------

Greetings Ms. Hennessey,

I am writing to you about a visa for my fiancée. This letter is being sent via email, fax, and postal mail.

I wanted you to know that I am incredibly concerned about the initial denial of a K-1 visa for my fiancée. I respectfully request your assistance with having a visa for my fiancée granted.

On Tuesday October 12 I shall be calling to your call center to see if a second interview can be scheduled. I shall plan to attend this second interview.

If, after reading this letter, if your office decides that a second interview is not warranted because the visa can be immediately granted, then please let my fiancée and I know via email. But in the mean time on Tuesday the 12th in the morning Kiev time I will call to your call center in an attempt to schedule a second interview – an interview which I shall plan to attend with my fiancée – so that her visa can be honored.

On October 9 my fiancée received an email from the embassy mentioning that she and I had only been chatting for six months. But I wanted to let you know that, as per the documentation I previously submitted, and as per what my fiancée brought, my fiancée and I have been talking to each other in earnest since January of this year. And we first met in October of 2009 at Café Tokyo House in Odessa. I met my fiancée by happenstance, because a friend of hers invited her along to meet me. my fiancée and I did have an immediate and fast romantic connection right from the beginning.

Also in the October 9 embassy email my fiancée received, mention of her being unemployed was made. But there are many unemployed women in Ukraine. And on our submission forms we noted that my fiancée has been “self employed,” rather than just straight unemployed. Furthermore it was my understanding that "...a K-1 applicant is not required to have a material basis for expatriation..." And we did submit an affidavit of support (I-134).

I was in Odessa in October of 2009 and January of this year. While I was in Odessa in January, I walked with my fiancée in the central city garden near Afina. We had deep conversations about the future and we made a deep connection there. This connection was the basis for our continuing to where we are today.

After my return to the U.S. I continued to talk with my fiancée, over the phone, and online via Skype’s webcam conversing service. If we could not reach each other by phone we would speak on Skype. We frequently used SMS to coordinate chatting sessions. The sessions including webcam usage, where we could see each other and hear each other very clearly. We had many lengthy webcam conversational sessions.

Our conversations were sometimes light & sometimes deep. We spoke about our families. We spoke about the music we loved. The films. The books. Our families. We spoke about the future, and about how we both wanted children. We spoke about my fiancée’s law degree and how she has worked as a lawyer in Odessa. We spoke about my fiancée’s relationship with her parents & her friends. She wanted to know about my parents and my friends, and what I did during my free time.

We worked through concerns & problems. We saw who we were deep down, and more importantly we also saw each other when we were either tired or stressed. For example, many of the webcam conversations took place at odd hours, either in the middle of the night for me or for my fiancée. Over time we became increasingly committed to marriage, and we are still committed to this goal.

My fiancée was also able to see my mother before she passed away earlier this year. She was happy to see my mother before she passed away. And she also became very impressed with my family.

I know that my fiancée wants to come so that we can be married – and that this is her primary reason for wanting to come. My fiancée is a woman of principle and honor – a strong Ukrainian woman who is also very kind hearted. We have connected. We can get along. We can work things out. We have worked through problems as they have come up. We have seen each other’s ups and downs, and we’ve learned how to move forward together.

For the past several months we have been “as a couple” – emotionally tied. Very worried when we could not talk. Very concerned for the other’s welfare. Deeply emotionally tied.

But one key thing I would like you to know is that my fiancée has been able to see how I live my life, via the following method: Via her viewing of many videos that I created for her, on special sections of Youtube.com and Blip.tv. Many hours of videos. And my fiancée took the time to review these videos, in detail. She spent many hours taking time to carefully review the videos I made for her. Here are the two websites I used to share the videos I made for my fiancée:

[]

Included in the list findable at the sites above are videos where I sang to my fiancée. Videos where I showed my fiancée my dying mother. Videos where I showed my birds to my fiancée, and videos showing the mountains here & what life it like here - all to put my fiancée more at ease with coming, and to show how her that I cared for her. She spent many hours and many weeks reviewing all the videos I shared with her.

Your staff is welcome to visit video sharing these sites so that you may see the titles of all that I have shared to my fiancée. On the second blip.tv site you can see all the titles listed by clicking on “episode archive.”

I am very glad that my fiancée first expressed a romantic interest in me in October of 2009. During that initial visit I saw my fiancée several times at various cafes and etc., and in the gardens of Odessa.

I am very glad that I was able to follow up on her initial interest in January of 2010, during the Ukrainian Christmas and New Year. During this most recent trip in January my fiancée helped arrange for an apartment for me to stay in. We again went to several cafes, to the Dolphinarium, and to the gardens of Odessa. In January we cemented our relationship on an initial basis where we decided to move forward with this whole endeavor.

And I’m glad that we have been able to continue intensively talking to each other, using every means at our disposal, since January of this year. My fiancée and I have exchanged many letters and cards. I have sent many greeting & love cards to her via the postal mail. I sent several packages, and she sent two packages back to me. Many of these exchanges were documented in the documents previously submitted. But even after those documents were created, we have continued exchanging messages, not only online, but also through the post.

We have spent countless hours on this endeavor. Talking to each other because we knew this was key. Seeing how each other lived. Seeing what we enjoy, and how we react to concerns. We’ve seen all these things via our very in depth conversations, and working through all that is required to get this visa done.

I am very committed to making a marriage relationship with my fiancée work. I know that my fiancée’s has an honest commitment to come to live with me as my fiancée so that we can be married.

I am committed to making this work, because a beautiful & strong woman who shows she’s also interested in moving forward – that does not happen every day. We have found that our personalities are compatible. We have touched each other. We have spoken for many many hours over the course of the past ten months. And we have both chosen to move forward with a fiancé fiancée relationship and to marriage.

On Tuesday October 12 I shall be calling to your call center to see if a second interview can be scheduled. I shall plan to attend this second interview.

If, after reading this letter, if your office decides that a second interview is not warranted because the visa can be immediately granted, then please let my fiancée and I know via email. But in the mean time on Tuesday the 12th in the morning Kiev time I will call to your call center in an attempt to schedule a second interview – an interview which I shall plan to attend with my fiancée – so that her visa can be honored.

Encl: Titles of videos shared; further excerpts from Skype logs.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Here is a couple "clues" that I see.

Something at the interview "red_flagged" the situation.

Ask her if anyone has ever submitted a fiance VISA application on her behalf before.

Also someone not being employed for 6 months since is mentioned.. they always tell you not to quit your job or make any travel arrangements prior to the VISA approval.. some consulars red-flag this as here.

My guess is something about the interview answers, her demeanor during the interview or perhaps her inability to converse in English.. brought up the question of how you are communicating to the point of proposal ..perhaps.. just some ideas..

I agree there is something we don't know. absolutely. One thing to remember is that the decision is made BEFORE the interview. The interview confirms the decision. We had no questions asked...how could it possibly have affected the decision? Asking about the unemployment simply puzzles me and leaves me very uneasy. Alla does, in addition to translations, consultation with fiancees for the purposes of gathering information for G-325 forms. Some are more comfortable speaking to a woman in their native language. Never underestimate that a lot of women are scared to death of the consulate and this interview process. The US consulate in Ukraine has a horrible reputation for treating people badly, but it does not apply to K-1s, generally. At any rate, many of the women tell Alla..."I work but not officially, you know how it is" Of course she does. Black money. I think perhaps 80% of the income in Ukraine is black money. Everyone has an angle to make money and most people make more money on their "side jobs" than on their real jobs...if they have a real job. So they have to claim they are unemployed because they have no official employer. Some say they are "self employed". Hard to say you are a self employed secretary though. There is no requirement for the beneficiary to be employed.

Broken Family is more specific, and maybe that is good because you need to know, HAS she applied for these visas before? There is something up here and I don't know what. The whole thing in another thread that she hadn't had sex for some years...I am not buying that either. I lived in Odessa for two years. (very close to the city garden where you looked in her eyes) The average guy who doesn't look like a crocodile can get laid by walking out his door and ordering a coke at a sidewalk cafe. There will be a very attractive woman joining you at your table before the coke arrives. Sometimes two women. You can be in bed with her/them in an hour if you want, and NO she is not a prostitute. I don't think you believe her on that either. $1200 to go to Kiev from Odessa? $900 (twice?) because her computer fried out because of problems with electricity? I mean Ukraine has its issues but it is not a primitive country, certainly not in cities like Odessa. Hot water can be a sometimes thing but electricity is pretty reliable, really. I constructed some large facilities in Odessa and had no issues with power quality and that WOULD have been an issue. We did lose power more than one would expect in a similar city in the USA, I will give you that, but as far as frequency and voltage variations, they were very well within clean standards. I've seen worse in the USA.

[baron555 934]

Here's the latest draft. Thanks for the suggestions. I plan to send the letter via email, fax, and regular mail this evening - because it seems to be there's a time issue at hand, and also an issue of "making an impact."

I don't want to make things worse. So it's now a choice between sending such a letter or not. Calling to a senator or not. But we'll keep pressing onward. But I must say that this is an emotional drain on both of us, after all the work we've put into this & the hoping things would go smoothly.

I may insert my fiancee's name into places below where I just say "my fiancée."

And thanks for your help. I've worked on this most of the day since I heard the news. Since they still have her passport I thought I needed to get something off to them ASAP.

-------------------------

Greetings Ms. Hennessey,

I am writing to you about a visa for my fiancée. This letter is being sent via email, fax, and postal mail.

I wanted you to know that I am incredibly concerned about the initial denial of a K-1 visa for my fiancée. I respectfully request your assistance with having a visa for my fiancée granted.

On Tuesday October 12 I shall be calling to your call center to see if a second interview can be scheduled. I shall plan to attend this second interview.

If, after reading this letter, if your office decides that a second interview is not warranted because the visa can be immediately granted, then please let my fiancée and I know via email. But in the mean time on Tuesday the 12th in the morning Kiev time I will call to your call center in an attempt to schedule a second interview – an interview which I shall plan to attend with my fiancée – so that her visa can be honored.

On October 9 my fiancée received an email from the embassy mentioning that she and I had only been chatting for six months. But I wanted to let you know that, as per the documentation I previously submitted, and as per what my fiancée brought, my fiancée and I have been talking to each other in earnest since January of this year. And we first met in October of 2009 at Café Tokyo House in Odessa. I met my fiancée by happenstance, because a friend of hers invited her along to meet me. my fiancée and I did have an immediate and fast romantic connection right from the beginning.

Also in the October 9 embassy email my fiancée received, mention of her being unemployed was made. But there are many unemployed women in Ukraine. And on our submission forms we noted that my fiancée has been “self employed,” rather than just straight unemployed. Furthermore it was my understanding that "...a K-1 applicant is not required to have a material basis for expatriation..." And we did submit an affidavit of support (I-134).

I would leave all this out. I serves no useful purpose to describing your relationship.

I was in Odessa in October of 2009 and January of this year. While I was in Odessa in January, I walked with my fiancée in the central city garden near Afina. We had deep conversations about the future and we made a deep connection there. This connection was the basis for our continuing to where we are today.

You need to reference exact dates and relate these to the pictures you are sending and such. I assume you have pictures. You do have pictures and other receipts? Passport stamps?

After my return to the U.S. I continued to talk with my fiancée, over the phone, and online via Skype’s webcam conversing service. If we could not reach each other by phone we would speak on Skype. We frequently used SMS to coordinate chatting sessions. The sessions including webcam usage, where we could see each other and hear each other very clearly. We had many lengthy webcam conversational sessions.

Our conversations were sometimes light & sometimes deep. We spoke about our families. We spoke about the music we loved. The films. The books. Our families. We spoke about the future, and about how we both wanted children. We spoke about my fiancée’s law degree and how she has worked as a lawyer in Odessa. We spoke about my fiancée’s relationship with her parents & her friends. She wanted to know about my parents and my friends, and what I did during my free time.

Again, why not speak about what you talked about concerning your relationship to each other?

We worked through concerns & problems. We saw who we were deep down, and more importantly we also saw each other when we were either tired or stressed. For example, many of the webcam conversations took place at odd hours, either in the middle of the night for me or for my fiancée. Over time we became increasingly committed to marriage, and we are still committed to this goal.

My fiancée was also able to see my mother before she passed away earlier this year. She was happy to see my mother before she passed away. And she also became very impressed with my family.

How was she able to see her. Even though this is heartbreaking, and I endorsed it earlier, it doesn't mention anything about your relationship.

I know that my fiancée wants to come so that we can be married – and that this is her primary reason for wanting to come. My fiancée is a woman of principle and honor – a strong Ukrainian woman who is also very kind hearted. We have connected. We can get along. We can work things out. We have worked through problems as they have come up. We have seen each other’s ups and downs, and we’ve learned how to move forward together.

YOur statements are meaningless. Of course she wants to come, maybe for a Green Card. You need to really reword this. You two are perfect for each other and you both need to be together. Quite mentioning about she want to come....maybe she only wants to come to the US for the GC? See what I mean? You keep mentioning this but you don't say that you two want to be together, just she wants to come and we can work it out. No, you should have already worked it out.

For the past several months we have been “as a couple” – emotionally tied. Very worried when we could not talk. Very concerned for the other’s welfare. Deeply emotionally tied.

But one key thing I would like you to know is that my fiancée has been able to see how I live my life, via the following method: Via her viewing of many videos that I created for her, on special sections of Youtube.com and Blip.tv. Many hours of videos. And my fiancée took the time to review these videos, in detail. She spent many hours taking time to carefully review the videos I made for her. Here are the two websites I used to share the videos I made for my fiancée:

[]

Included in the list findable at the sites above are videos where I sang to my fiancée. Videos where I showed my fiancée my dying mother. Videos where I showed my birds to my fiancée, and videos showing the mountains here & what life it like here - all to put my fiancée more at ease with coming, and to show how her that I cared for her. She spent many hours and many weeks reviewing all the videos I shared with her.

Your staff is welcome to visit video sharing these sites so that you may see the titles of all that I have shared to my fiancée. On the second blip.tv site you can see all the titles listed by clicking on “episode archive.”

I am very glad that my fiancée first expressed a romantic interest in me in October of 2009. During that initial visit I saw my fiancée several times at various cafes and etc., and in the gardens of Odessa.

Any other evidence of such that you can provide?

I am very glad that I was able to follow up on her initial interest in January of 2010, during the Ukrainian Christmas and New Year. During this most recent trip in January my fiancée helped arrange for an apartment for me to stay in. We again went to several cafes, to the Dolphinarium, and to the gardens of Odessa. In January we cemented our relationship on an initial basis where we decided to move forward with this whole endeavor.

And I’m glad that we have been able to continue intensively talking to each other, using every means at our disposal, since January of this year. My fiancée and I have exchanged many letters and cards. I have sent many greeting & love cards to her via the postal mail. I sent several packages, and she sent two packages back to me. Many of these exchanges were documented in the documents previously submitted. But even after those documents were created, we have continued exchanging messages, not only online, but also through the post.

We have spent countless hours on this endeavor. Talking to each other because we knew this was key. Seeing how each other lived. Seeing what we enjoy, and how we react to concerns. We’ve seen all these things via our very in depth conversations, and working through all that is required to get this visa done.

Can you show how many hours you have spent. Can you provide evidence to such?

I am very committed to making a marriage relationship with my fiancée work. I know that my fiancée’s has an honest commitment to come to live with me as my fiancée so that we can be married.

Well this is good. But the K-1 is not a get to know you visa. Of course you both should already be committed to the forever relationship and you both have vetted this out with each other. Knowledge that she will honor the committment should not be in question here.

I am committed to making this work, because a beautiful & strong woman who shows she’s also interested in moving forward – that does not happen every day. We have found that our personalities are compatible. We have touched each other. We have spoken for many many hours over the course of the past ten months. And we have both chosen to move forward with a fiancé fiancée relationship and to marriage.

On Tuesday October 12 I shall be calling to your call center to see if a second interview can be scheduled. I shall plan to attend this second interview.

If, after reading this letter, if your office decides that a second interview is not warranted because the visa can be immediately granted, then please let my fiancée and I know via email. But in the mean time on Tuesday the 12th in the morning Kiev time I will call to your call center in an attempt to schedule a second interview – an interview which I shall plan to attend with my fiancée – so that her visa can be honored.

Dont' put words into their mouths. I told you to keep it all separate. Just say that you two are committed together to being together forever and please allow this couple to fulfill their mutual destiny and be together. Please grant the visa. Don't give them options to the otherwise.

Encl: Titles of videos shared; further excerpts from Skype logs.

No other evidence to enclose? SMS logs, phone call logs? Email excerpts? Gift rceipts? Photos? Passport stamps from other trips?

[baron555 934]

$1200 to go to Kiev from Odessa? $900 (twice?) because her computer fried out because of problems with electricity?

I read that also and I'd say that something seem very rotten with this also.

B-man may not have a real relationship and he is just buying this lady. All I know is that Ukraine K-1s are very easy but only if there is a legit relationship. For them to deny this or to act "strange" means to me that there is something strange about all this.

I wonder if B-man has the other evidence needed to prove his relationship or he just threw money at her and talked all the time on Skype?

I do wish him luck but only if there is a real relationship....if not then the Embassy is doing it's job. Remember that guy from earlier this year with the model/stripper/young thang? She made it here, so maybe there is hope.