Urgent Question to All of You

[bufumufu3 0]

I know I'll probably get my application denied, but I just wanted to make sure.

I'm going to be completely honest here. I'm in the process of obtaining my citizenship. I passed the interview and was recommended for citizenship approval on Sep. 17, 2010. I was arrested for petty theft on Sep. 29, 2010. This is my first offense. There's no need to remind me how unbelievably stupid and morally reprehensible this decision is. I'm not looking for justification. I know what I did was wrong, and I'm ready to accept all consequences.

I'm just not sure if reporting this crime to USCIS is one of those consequences. Do I have a civic duty to report this crime if between the interview and the oath ceremony, they do not ask if I have committed any crime? I guess that's what I'm asking here. For those who've been through the process, do they ask whether you've committed a crime in between these two steps? If they ask, I will state the full truth, in which case, I will probably be denied my citizenship. If they don't ask, I don't know...

[v333k 59]

Yes - from what I understand, you will have to either fill the back of the oath letter or they ask you when you arrive for your oath if anything has changed since your interview (usually, this applies to travel in most peoples' cases). If you do not tell them and they find out, I think they may be able to remove your citizenship... not very sure about the details but they make the rules so they should protect them more than the applicants.

[Lematin 0]

I do not know what will happen but you will be asked if you committed any crime since the interview. There are about 8 questions on the back of the Form N-445 Notice of Naturalization Oath Ceremony. Here is the N-445 http://www.ilw.com/forms/N445.pdf

Good luck to you.

[Anatopia 0]

once you obtain your citizenship, it is my understanding that it can NOT be taken away. I would answer all questions truthfully, but not offer any additional information unless asked. I would ABOVE ALL, be honest. Once you lie, you can bet it will come back to bite you in the bum. What you did is not a felony, correct? Maybe it would be worth putting a few dollars down to pay for a consult with an attorney. I think that may be wise?

[Anatopia 0]

Tried to edit my last post, wouldn't let me. Let me be a little more clear:

once you obtain your citizenship, it is my understanding that it can NOT be taken away. But that is after the fact, and if you lie, they may be able to strip you of it if you of it after the fact. But that is just me tossing it around in my head, not legal advice in any way, and not even 80% sure of what I am saying. I think things through thoroughly to kind of feel out situations and the 'what ifs'. It has been my experience that always being truthful is ALWAYS best. I would answer all questions truthfully, but not offer any additional information unless asked. I would ABOVE ALL, be honest. Once you lie, you can bet it will come back to bite you in the bum. What you did is not a felony, correct? Maybe it would be worth putting a few dollars down to pay for a consult with an attorney. I think that may be wise?

Yup, # 4 clearly ask if you have been arrested, cited, charged, indicted, convicted, fined or imprisoned for

breaking or violating any law or ordinance, including traffic violations?

no way around that one! I do wish you the best!

[Lansbury 19]

once you obtain your citizenship, it is my understanding that it can NOT be taken away. I would answer all questions truthfully, but not offer any additional information unless asked. I would ABOVE ALL, be honest. Once you lie, you can bet it will come back to bite you in the bum. What you did is not a felony, correct? Maybe it would be worth putting a few dollars down to pay for a consult with an attorney. I think that may be wise?

He hasn't obtained his citizenship yet because he hasn't been sworn in as a citizen. There are circumstances in which citizenship can be taken away once granted. It doesn't matter if what he did was a felony or a misdemeanor, the question he has to answer is did he commit a crime between the interview and day of the oath ceremony. Once he says yes, which he must, his application becomes pending while the circumstances are reviewed.

[bufumufu3 0]

Okay, so it looks like I will be asked whether I've committed a crime since the interview, in which case, I will have to tell the truth. I'm assuming this will mean an automatic denial (I heard USCIS looks down on theft cases, especially). Sigh...

[NickD 203]

I did a web search on this subject awhile ago, mainly about that question of committing a crime and never getting caught. Reason for asking it was if you are caught, you committed perjury on your application which would be a reason for the USCIS not only to take away your US citizenship, but deport you as well.

Also in the process of searching, learned there were some 5,000 cases pending for perjury charges on the application. So I do not feel you should avoid answering the questions incorrectly. Really don't know what they will do about this, sorry.

[Anatopia 0]

I agree, honesty is going to be your best bet. If you are not, as I said in my above post, it will be found out. that you can count on, and when it is you can bet it will bite the big one.

I really wish you luck.

[Anatopia 0]

He hasn't obtained his citizenship yet because he hasn't been sworn in as a citizen. There are circumstances in which citizenship can be taken away once granted. It doesn't matter if what he did was a felony or a misdemeanor, the question he has to answer is did he commit a crime between the interview and day of the oath ceremony. Once he says yes, which he must, his application becomes pending while the circumstances are reviewed.

ok, so you did not read my second corrected post, no?

for your reading pleasure....

once you obtain your citizenship, it is my understanding that it can NOT be taken away. But that is after the fact, and if you lie, they may be able to strip you of it if you of it after the fact. But that is just me tossing it around in my head, not legal advice in any way, and not even 80% sure of what I am saying. I think things through thoroughly to kind of feel out situations and the 'what ifs'. It has been my experience that always being truthful is ALWAYS best. I would answer all questions truthfully, but not offer any additional information unless asked. I would ABOVE ALL, be honest. Once you lie, you can bet it will come back to bite you in the bum. What you did is not a felony, correct? Maybe it would be worth putting a few dollars down to pay for a consult with an attorney. I think that may be wise?

Yup, # 4 clearly ask if you have been arrested, cited, charged, indicted, convicted, fined or imprisoned for

breaking or violating any law or ordinance, including traffic violations?

no way around that one! I do wish you the best!

Edited October 6, 2010 by Anatopia

[NickD 203]

Since I have never swiped anything, well maybe a cookie out of the cookie jar when my mom wasn't looking, was curious what petty thief is. Found this at an attorneys law site.

"Petty theft is considered a pretty minor offense, but it is still theft and still punishable by law. It can be a stain on your record and may cost you further down the line, especially when trying to get a new job. The first thing to do when charged with petty theft is get an experienced petty theft attorney.

Examples of Petty Theft

Examples of petty theft include shoplifting, bicycle theft, or stealing other "minor" items from a residence when lawfully allowed to be there (otherwise it would be burglary).

Petty theft is classified as theft of an item or items with a total monetary value under the amount of $500. Anything more than $500 is considered grand theft, in which case the charges will be significantly more serious.

First Offense vs. Repeat Offense

While every state has different laws regarding petty theft, they all come close to the same guidelines.

A first offense is always going to be treated more lightly than someone who is a repeat offender, whether it is petty theft or not. A judge is more likely to give the maximum penalty to someone who didn't learn his or her lesson the first time.

First Offense Options

Deferred judgment or diversion has become an option in many states when it comes to petty theft.

If you have never been convicted of petty theft, or a similar crime, and have never participated in a diversion or deferred judgment program, you may be eligible.

Deferred Judgment Program

A diversion or deferred judgment program will have the charges dropped under the stipulation that you do not commit another crime in the course of your determined probation period. While you'll still be responsible for paying court fees and fines, one of these programs will keep the charge of petty theft off your permanent record.

If you qualify for diversion or deferred judgment you will first be responsible to pay all fines and fees required by the court. By entering one of these programs you are also agreeing to waive your constitutional rights to a formal arraignment and a jury trial on the petty theft charges against you.

Jurisdiction Requirements

Most jurisdictions will require you to attend and successfully complete a correction counseling program related to your offense, whether it is shoplifting, etc.

You will also be responsible for making full restitution to the victim in your petty theft case. During the time of your petty theft probation you are not allowed to violate the laws of any city, state, or of the United States.

The judge in your petty theft case has the authority to enter any other conditions he or she deems appropriate to your specific case.

Convicted?

This is where an experienced petty theft attorney comes in handy. Having representation will be the difference of getting off easy or getting the maximum penalty.

An experienced petty theft attorney is well versed in seeking out the least punitive of sentences and helping you put this incident in the past. While going in front of the judge on your own may save you a few dollars now, it will end up costing you in the long run.

If you are interested in learning more about petty theft, please contact us to speak with a qualified and experienced criminal defense attorney who can assess your case to determine how best to protect and maximize your legal interests."

Was from this site: http://www.criminal-law-lawyer-source.com/terms/petty-theft.html

Really don't know if the USCIS would treat this like a traffic violation or not, but may be worth looking into. I was horrified to see the police take out a kid in handcuffs for swiping a candy bar when we have a president that broke over 564 constitutional laws and already met my share of crooked judges and attorneys. Did report them to the bar, but didn't do any good, they are all crooks.

[Lansbury 19]

once you obtain your citizenship, it is my understanding that it can NOT be taken away

Then your understanding is wrong. If you perjure yourself when making the application your citizenship can be taken away. If you commit serious crimes against the United States it can be taken away.

One very notable case just recently was the 90ish year old man who had been a US citizen by naturalization for many years. He failed to disclose he had been a member of the Nazi party in Germany, where he was wanted for war crimes. He was stripped of his US citizenship and deported to Germany. He died this year before standing trail.

[Harsh_77 718]

once you obtain your citizenship, it is my understanding that it can NOT be taken away. I would answer all questions truthfully, but not offer any additional information unless asked. I would ABOVE ALL, be honest. Once you lie, you can bet it will come back to bite you in the bum. What you did is not a felony, correct? Maybe it would be worth putting a few dollars down to pay for a consult with an attorney. I think that may be wise?

Sorry to tell you, but YES your citizenship can be revoked, if you have lied, misrepresented, if you have committed crime against humanity etc.

Very good example was the Nazi guard who was sent back to Germany.

[Anatopia 0]

Then your understanding is wrong. If you perjure yourself when making the application your citizenship can be taken away. If you commit serious crimes against the United States it can be taken away.

One very notable case just recently was the 90ish year old man who had been a US citizen by naturalization for many years. He failed to disclose he had been a member of the Nazi party in Germany, where he was wanted for war crimes. He was stripped of his US citizenship and deported to Germany. He died this year before standing trail.

well, yes, that does indeed make sense, doesn't it? I can not remember which government website I read that on about not losing your citizenship, perhaps they should reword their statement. Yes perjury I can see, but that is why I stated AFTER the fact. Again, go back and reread my SECOND post where I did make the same mention of this. They may not strip him of it for stealing, but they might for perjury if they find out later. I would take my chances and be honest about the arrest. Petty theft seems mild in comparison to perjury by far.

[Anatopia 0]

Sorry to tell you, but YES your citizenship can be revoked, if you have lied, misrepresented, if you have committed crime against humanity etc.

Very good example was the Nazi guard who was sent back to Germany.

OK, so my second post right under the first one is completely invisible? again:

But that is after the fact, and if you lie, they may be able to strip you of it if you of it after the fact.

I am sure being a Nazi does not even compare petty theft. Perjury yes, I can understand that, hence the reason I said 'do not lie'.