Change the way I dress?

[Karonya and Adel 8]

Sorry.. if you feel so pressured in a Christian town / Country how about then you pack and move to Arab country may be you feel more relaxed there!! No one forced you to live here!

I just cannot understand why so many Muslim people feeling the guilt of so called being abused or targeted by others in a country that accepts all religion practices.

Only people who cannot stand up for themselves find excuses of their surrounding to justify their weakness.

now that was an absurd statement. Tell that to the millions who died in the Holocaust.

Plus the 3rd sentence doesn't make any sense. "I just cannot understand why so many Muslim people feeling the guilt of so called being abused or targeted by others in a country that accepts all religion practices."

oh yeah, we're accepting yeah, let's see, wasn't it just a couple of weeks ago there was a big Qur'an burning planned?

ok now it's time for you to blast me... go for it

[ErikaAndHamit 73]

OMG this topic seems to be a rude and ignorant people magnet! I don't know why people are such jerks sometimes....ugh!

I dress "American" and wish I had the balls to dress more "Islamic" and kudos to you! And I am not even "religous" though I converted as well. I agree the MENA wear can be very pretty, feminine and stylish. I see nothing wrong with being a new convert and wanting to dress this way. It IS beautiful!

Just look at the women walking around in most Muslim countries (minus strict countries like Saudi, etc)and you will see style and fashion even in a head scarf. In Turkey, the scarves look just like a fashionable accessory and not what westerners think is something oppressive! I wish I could dress like that, but I know I would be seriously putting myself out there for ridicule here in the US to people who know me already and I admit I don't have the courage to do so. Maybe some day.....I definitely try to dress modest yet stylish-minus the scarf as I cannot get used to it when I tried (out of respect and because it looks nice) when visiting his family, but they were ok with that. Muslims aren't what most westerners think! And my hubby comes from a more conservative family.

Good for you for asking! Ignore the rude people.

I think Muslima style and clothing is stylish , feminine and freeing...yes, freeing! I am not including countries where they wear all black or have a slit only for their eyes......

Edited September 24, 2010 by ErikaAndHamit

[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

The only thing I can say is dress by your own convictions. Dont do it for pressure of a man or to try to please him if one is hoping to please him. Be yourself.

In my own life, I grew up wearing dresses and skirts and the modesty rule was set by my parents. I carried it over into my young adult life style. When Adam has the question of a clothing that I wear, I tell him that my conscience is clear and what I am wearing is modest. I stand firm on that. Rarely anything is in question since he understands that if hes going to be wearing shorts to the knees, so will I. Modesty does go both ways.

[KittyPollitt 284]

I haven't reverted, but I've always felt like if you're going to say that you are a member of a religion, that means following it's precepts, and part of being a Muslimah is being covered. Just like part of being Catholic is going to confession, part of being Buddhist is meditation, and part of being Jewish is maintaining a Kosher diet. I never understood why people want to do things halfway. I'm Buddhist, and have been taught not to physically harm any living thing.. That means, if I have a mouse in my kitchen, I use no-kill traps and release it outside. Mice are NASTY, but I have no right to harm them, that is part of my religion. Hijabs are hot in summer, and may make one stand out in a small rural American town, BUT it's part of the Islamic religion, therefore I don't think it should be a "choice" if you're going to call yourself a Muslim:

"And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and be modest, and to display of their adornment only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils over their bosoms, and not to reveal their adornment save to their own husbands or fathers or husbands' fathers, or their sons or their husbands' sons, or their brothers or their brothers' sons or sisters' sons, or their women, or their slaves, or male attendants who lack vigour, or children who know naught of women's nakedness. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And turn unto Allah together, O believers, in order that ye may succeed." Quran 24:31

IMHO, that is..

[sandinista! 1,816]

How was that absurd? I had to do a lot of soul searching before I decided to convert to Islam. It does not only effect me but it affects my children as well. And then when I chose to cover I had to face criticism from my family and my ex and his opinions on what it was doing to our daughter. If you are born Muslim that I can understand it being absurd but anyone who has converted knows the difficulties you face especially living in a state or town that is primarily Christian. I was just offering support to a sister I didn't need your approval or disapproval for a comment that obviously was understood by who it was meant for.

regardless of any circumstances, it is utterly absurd to proclaim "the decision to hijab or not hijab is an even bigger one" than one's decision to convert to islam. as a muslim, i find saying such a thing downright blasphemous.

[Ban Hammer 13,429]

[amal 4]

The husband is not supposed to force their wife to wear hijab or not to wear it. It has to be all her choice because if she does it for the wrong reasons, he is the one that is punished by God, not her. I agree with MrsAmera (I think it was) that said to take your time. Changing religions is a HUGE step. Islam does not require new converts to follow everything to a T from the get-go. Heck, it took 22 years for the whole Qura'an to be completely revealed. Mega Baby Steps. Learn all you can learn now, then, in the future, if you decide you want to change a part of your lifestyle, do it....but not right now. It's not all peaches and cream to be a hijabi ..... especially an American hijabi. I live in HOUSTON...one of the largest cities, with the largest diversity of religions...and we get discriminated against all of the time. Nasty things are said, bad looks, pointing, people going out of their way to avoid us....and I'm not even hijabi....they notice my husband and that's all they need to form their incorrect opinions. A neighbor kid is not allowed to play with my son since his parents found out my husbnd is muslim.

So, I'm just saying, take it super slow, make sure you are comfortable with all aspets of what you're trying to take on. Do what you want to do, but make sure it's for the right reasons, and not for the reason being that you're in love with your husband's culture/religion, the look of Arab women in Hijab/abaya/etc... I'm not saying that's the reason you're doing it....just saying that you're going to have to defend your decision, so you need to be 100% sure, for yourself, that it's what you believe and what you want. Good luck in all you choose and in the journey you have ahead of you.

[Utha 10]

Do you think it would appear weird or like I'm "trying" to be different if after marriage I started dressing a little bit closer to Ali's Jordanian culture? He hasn't decided about Hijab yet because he just isn't sure if he likes the idea of being that covered although his mom and sisters wear it when they leave the house. However, I am the one who is just naturally modest and in love with some more modest fashions. I feel more comfortable when I don't have the potential for things to pop out or look uncomfortable.

Basically, my question is, would it look like I was playing dress-up, especially because I don't share the coloring, shape, or style as most of the arab and indian models who wear fashions that I'm in love with from magazines?

Has anyone else here in MENA tried changing their dress a bit? how did it go? pics?

Welcome to Islam. I am birth Moslem. Funny thing, my convert fiance Moslem which is American is the one who make me better religiously. Eventhough i am Moslem but before i met him, i wasn't wear Moslem dress properly. I wore jeans, tight t-shirt, etc. I felt too free to decide everything for myself. Too independent. I felt i need something to border me. The thing called marriage. I feel so happy when he suggested me to change the way i clothes, i feel like he cares about me. What i think is, that marriage in Islam not about love only, it is about a part of the deen. As long as it good for your belief/religion, it must be better if you do it not by force, i think it is okay for you to change the way you dress.

Once again, congratulation and welcome to Islam. The correct Islam, inshAllah. Ameen.

Edited September 24, 2010 by Utha

[Anna and Ali 13]

I just want to make it abundantly clear that my future husband has no intentions of "forcing" anything regarding my free will. Both he and his family understand and respect that I was raised under different cultural norms.

However, when I first started reading Quran two years ago it was completely of my own volition. I started to study as curiousity so that I would be understanding of my boyfriend. I did it in secret because I didn't want him to think I was treating him as a research subject. I have been raised in an extremely moral and modest family but we don't practice any religion. Father was raised fundamental christian and my mother a catholic but neither practice. Therefore I grew up with the morals and knowledge of both branches but none of the physical practicing of them. Considering my state is like 95% Roman Catholic, I was one of maybe three of my friends who didn't do Catechism.

I feel really blessed that my family taught me, through actions, not lessons, that modesty, hard work, and study allow for a happier and more fulfilling future. Though I felt always that I may be a bit more conservative or wanting of structure than the rest of my family. I never had rules or threats of punishment growing up and I can't exactly explain why my older brother and I just instinctively didn't get into trouble or even want to.

Yet, this lack of rules and discipline confused me and I didn't know exactly what was expected of me by parents or mentors. When I started researching Islam and reading the Quran I felt something almost like butterflies in my stomach. I never felt that when reading the bible as a child. I never felt like I could get through pages at a time without disagreeing with a part of it. I wont' get into what I like and don't like about the teachings of certain faiths because I am not God and have no right to judge an entire religion! Also, I can't insult people who follow a strong moral code regardless of the name of their holy text, if there is one, or ways of expressing their faith. I think its great no matter what.

I took notes on every page I read of Quran and kept a list of questions I wanted to ask. My boyfriend said he wasn't able to answer the questions and I would have to ask an Imam and its been two years and he hasn't helped me find one Basically, the gist of what I'm trying to say is, I'm not feigning an interest in the religion because I'm in love. I found Islam because of love. I feel like it was my own path to Islam. It just seems like no matter what you question in life, you can find the answer in Islam. Not to mention my scholarly side being blown away by some of the early observations of the life cycle. How cool is that?

Long story---long, I guess, I like the religion regardless of my SO and I've never felt any pressure to look into it. One of my favorite quotes about religion, though I must paraphrase as I can't remember the exact source, is that God does not need man's help to reign in his followers, if he needed man to spread the word to his neighbors and force people to follow him, he wouldn't be almighty, would he? God can guide those he wishes to and away from the path. Every person should be concerned with his/her relationship with God alone, and next that of their children. <3 hope I didn't offend anyone or come off as preachy. Just wanted to explain the original premise of the thread. Play nice!

[Utha 10]

I just want to make it abundantly clear that my future husband has no intentions of "forcing" anything regarding my free will. Both he and his family understand and respect that I was raised under different cultural norms.

However, when I first started reading Quran two years ago it was completely of my own volition. I started to study as curiousity so that I would be understanding of my boyfriend. I did it in secret because I didn't want him to think I was treating him as a research subject. I have been raised in an extremely moral and modest family but we don't practice any religion. Father was raised fundamental christian and my mother a catholic but neither practice. Therefore I grew up with the morals and knowledge of both branches but none of the physical practicing of them. Considering my state is like 95% Roman Catholic, I was one of maybe three of my friends who didn't do Catechism.

I feel really blessed that my family taught me, through actions, not lessons, that modesty, hard work, and study allow for a happier and more fulfilling future. Though I felt always that I may be a bit more conservative or wanting of structure than the rest of my family. I never had rules or threats of punishment growing up and I can't exactly explain why my older brother and I just instinctively didn't get into trouble or even want to.

Yet, this lack of rules and discipline confused me and I didn't know exactly what was expected of me by parents or mentors. When I started researching Islam and reading the Quran I felt something almost like butterflies in my stomach. I never felt that when reading the bible as a child. I never felt like I could get through pages at a time without disagreeing with a part of it. I wont' get into what I like and don't like about the teachings of certain faiths because I am not God and have no right to judge an entire religion! Also, I can't insult people who follow a strong moral code regardless of the name of their holy text, if there is one, or ways of expressing their faith. I think its great no matter what.

I took notes on every page I read of Quran and kept a list of questions I wanted to ask. My boyfriend said he wasn't able to answer the questions and I would have to ask an Imam and its been two years and he hasn't helped me find one Basically, the gist of what I'm trying to say is, I'm not feigning an interest in the religion because I'm in love. I found Islam because of love. I feel like it was my own path to Islam. It just seems like no matter what you question in life, you can find the answer in Islam. Not to mention my scholarly side being blown away by some of the early observations of the life cycle. How cool is that?

Long story---long, I guess, I like the religion regardless of my SO and I've never felt any pressure to look into it. One of my favorite quotes about religion, though I must paraphrase as I can't remember the exact source, is that God does not need man's help to reign in his followers, if he needed man to spread the word to his neighbors and force people to follow him, he wouldn't be almighty, would he? God can guide those he wishes to and away from the path. Every person should be concerned with his/her relationship with God alone, and next that of their children. <3 hope I didn't offend anyone or come off as preachy. Just wanted to explain the original premise of the thread. Play nice!

Alhamdulillah and congratulation again that you convert Islam for and by yourself. No force. In most cases, it seems they who convert it by themselves, because they choose it for themselves, instead of parents, husband, or third party pick it for you, they have stronger faith in it. Just like my fiance, and you, inshAllah. Ameen.

[UmmSqueakster 54]

regardless of any circumstances, it is utterly absurd to proclaim "the decision to hijab or not hijab is an even bigger one" than one's decision to convert to islam. as a muslim, i find saying such a thing downright blasphemous.

Perhaps she meant that when one takes the shahada, it's not immediately obvious to everyone around them that they have embraced islam. But, when one dons hijab, it's like a big ol neon sign that says, hey, I'm a muslim, so you're subjected to scrutiny by your friends, neighbors and random strangers on the street. Reconciling oneself with islam is one's own struggle, but dealing with people's judgments adds additional stress.

I just cannot understand why so many Muslim people feeling the guilt of so called being abused or targeted by others in a country that accepts all religion practices.

Yes' date=' we have a country that allows us the freedom to practice our faith, alhamdulilah, but that doesn't mean that everyone upholds those ideals. Having experienced discrimination and having been physically targeted, I can assure you that there is nothing "so called" about these behaviors. I'm very lucky to live in a large metro area that has a lot of muslims, but there are still bigots out there who feel that it's their right to verbally and physically harrass us.

I'd like to reference this little rant by the Republican candidate for governor of New York from NPR on Wednesday:

Mr. PALADINO: Oh, well, that's just wonderful. And we think it's great for Mr. Cuomo to have Mr. Bloomberg, who sides with him on the mosque issue. I mean, these guys are in another world. They're not standing up for the rights of the American people and the rights of the people of the state of New York. They're not protecting the honor of our soldiers and the honor of our fallen.

Three thousand people died at ground zero. Their families are entitled to a little bit of respect, to respect the memory of those poor people that died there. And how about the families of all those soldiers that died in the two ensuing wars? Aren't they entitled to a little bit of respect - the kids, the wives, the parents?

How sad is that when your public officials only think about politics and make an excuse that it's freedom of religion? How sad is that? And Mr. Bloomberg and Mr. Cuomo, they deserve each other.

From which I get that muslim americans are in fact not americans and do not have rights. Or that the rights of non muslim americans supercede the rights of muslim americans. This isn't to open up a whole nother discussion on the mosque issue, but rather to point out this sentiment that seems to be rising in american public discource that is hostile to american muslims.

Anna, a few resources for you:

*My list of resources for converts and people interested in islam

*An introduction to islam online course that starts this weekend. Non muslims and new muslims get a 75% discount

*Seeker's Guidance courses - you may enjoy this course on the life of the Prophet (saws). The Seeker's Guidance podcast is also excellent.

*A podcast of lectures by Sh. Hussain Abdul Sattar.

Edited September 24, 2010 by UmmSqueakster

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Just a tip - do NOT post this kind of question in Off Topic. If you think that response was rude, post this in OT and see what that does.

He's right on about that

[NigeriaorBust 4,087]

This is not a mena answer but my husband has given me many beautiful Nigerian outfits. I have declared one day a week "enjoy Africa" day. The first time I got a few odd looks, now there are people that comment when they haven't seen my in my outfits in a while. So you may not get as negative response as you think you will. Just don't get defense when asked, simply say that you got these recently and think they are comfortable. As long as you are not in violation of a safety code at work you should be fine.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I haven't reverted, but I've always felt like if you're going to say that you are a member of a religion, that means following it's precepts, and part of being a Muslimah is being covered. Just like part of being Catholic is going to confession, part of being Buddhist is meditation, and part of being Jewish is maintaining a Kosher diet. I never understood why people want to do things halfway. I'm Buddhist, and have been taught not to physically harm any living thing.. That means, if I have a mouse in my kitchen, I use no-kill traps and release it outside. Mice are NASTY, but I have no right to harm them, that is part of my religion. Hijabs are hot in summer, and may make one stand out in a small rural American town, BUT it's part of the Islamic religion, therefore I don't think it should be a "choice" if you're going to call yourself a Muslim:

"And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and be modest, and to display of their adornment only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils over their bosoms, and not to reveal their adornment save to their own husbands or fathers or husbands' fathers, or their sons or their husbands' sons, or their brothers or their brothers' sons or sisters' sons, or their women, or their slaves, or male attendants who lack vigour, or children who know naught of women's nakedness. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And turn unto Allah together, O believers, in order that ye may succeed." Quran 24:31

IMHO, that is..

Hijab as a way of dress is not mentioned in the ayah you posted. In fact, it is never mentioned even once in the Quran as a way of dress. The khimar is mentioned, but that was a piece of cloth employed by men and women, Muslim and non-Muslim for a variety of utilitarian uses. It was not decided that women had to conceal their hair and neck until nearly 250 years after the death of the Prophet (pbuh). The most popularly quoted hadith on the subject is weak.

Over the centuries, covering, how it's done and to what extreme has trended all over. When I was a kid, the Muslimas who taught Sunday school at masjid didn't wear headcovering at all. No one expected them too. We were Arab, but we were in America, not in the desert of Arabia.

There's a serious Arab chauvinism involved in all this hoopla about hijab. The Wahabi strain that has infiltrated the spread of Islam has insisted on incorporating a lot of Arab cultural norms as part of Islamic practice to the point where the two are becoming synonymous with being Muslim. It's seriously unfortunate that the first thing so many converts or potential converts cling to is covering when there is so much more to Islam and so much more that women can contribute to Islam than what they wear.

Being an old lady who has been Muslim all my life and taught Islam for most of it, it has been a struggle for me and a lot of Muslimas of my generation to understand why there are so many trivial things (and in the larger sense, they are trivial) that converts get hung up on. I've been told that it's a way of gaining a new identity, that it's relatively easy to to, as opposed to other aspects of the faith.

I admit, not being a covert may be a disadvantage for me, and I am not knocking converts. We love you, but, a lot of Muslims are puzzled by the western obsession, pro and con, with pieces of cloth. I've attended so many meetings and lectures with Muslim intellectuals where the subject comes up and we say again and again, be who you are. You don't have to become Arab or Pakistani or Indonesian to be Muslim. Islam is a UNIVERSAL faith. It is not defined by any cultural dress code. That women insist on looking like foreigners to be Muslim is not helping Islam be accepted as a western or American religion. Islam is not a costume party. Try some of the "harder" stuff before you convert and see if that suits you, too.

Edited September 24, 2010 by Sofiyya

[sandinista! 1,816]

Hijab as a way of dress is not mentioned in the ayah you posted. In fact, it is never mentioned even once in the Quran as a way of dress. The khimar is mentioned, but that was a piece of cloth employed by men and women, Muslim and non-Muslim for a variety of utilitarian uses. It was not decided that women had to conceal their hair and neck until nearly 250 years after the death of the Prophet (pbuh). The most popularly quoted hadith on the subject is weak.

Over the centuries, covering, how it's done and to what extreme has trended all over. When I was a kid, the Muslimas who taught Sunday school at masjid didn't wear headcovering at all. No one expected them too. We were Arab, but we were in America, not in the desert of Arabia.

There's a serious Arab chauvinism involved in all this hoopla about hijab. The Wahabi strain that has infiltrated the spread of Islam has insisted on incorporating a lot of Arab cultural norms as part of Islamic practice to the point where the two are becoming synonymous with being Muslim. It's seriously unfortunate that the first thing so many converts or potential converts cling to is covering when there is so much more to Islam and so much more that women can contribute to Islam than what they wear.

Being an old lady who has been Muslim all my life and taught Islam for most of it, it has been a struggle for me and a lot of Muslimas of my generation to understand why there are so many trivial things (and in the larger sense, they are trivial) that converts get hung up on. I've been told that it's a way of gaining a new identity, that it's relatively easy to to, as opposed to other aspects of the faith.

I admit, not being a covert may be a disadvantage for me, and I am not knocking converts. We love you, but, a lot of Muslims are puzzled by the western obsession, pro and con, with pieces of cloth. I've attended so many meetings and lectures with Muslim intellectuals where the subject comes up and we say again and again, be who you are. You don't have to become Arab or Pakistani or Indonesian to be Muslim. Islam is a UNIVERSAL faith. It is not defined by any cultural dress code. That women insist on looking like foreigners to be Muslim is not helping Islam be accepted as a western or American religion. Islam is not a costume party. Try some of the "harder" stuff before you convert and see if that suits you, too.

imagine if addressing female illiteracy in the muslim world, or ensuring that muslim women be granted their full, God given rights under islam received half as much play amongst muslims as headscarves...