nature could have parted the red sea for moses' escape

[웃 910]

-I'm not familiar with very many passages which claim the world is flat, perhaps you could list a few.

-Put faith aside for the discussion....

Even if no one on earth believed a higher power (God) created the universe.... how could you conclusively state "There is no God" or creator in the universe if you have barely explored any of it?

You don't find that claim a little premature?

It doesn't have to be 1 God. You could say there is a water bottle 10 billion light years away that controls everything. There is a pencil sharpener 7 billion light years north that is the Creator.

17 Gods. 1,000,000 Gods. ..

Nobody can prove it either way. At the present time, 4.5 billion years (give or take a couple hundred million years) after earth's existence, no atheist can "prove" there is not a Creator and not one person of faith can prove there is a Creator.

[Danno 1,228]

It doesn't have to be 1 God. You could say there is a water bottle 10 billion light years away that controls everything. There is a pencil sharpener 7 billion light years north that is the Creator.

17 Gods. 1,000,000 Gods. ..

Nobody can prove it either way. At the present time, 4.5 billion years (give or take a couple hundred million years) after earth's existence, no atheist can "prove" there is not a Creator and not one person of faith can prove there is a Creator.

I knew reasonable people would agree

[ready4ONE 5,400]

-I'm not familiar with very many passages which claim the world is flat, perhaps you could list

Isaiah 11:12 

12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH. (KJV)

Revelation 7:1

1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. (KJV) 

Job 38:13

13 That it might take hold of the ENDS OF THE EARTH, that the wicked might be shaken out of it? (KJV) 

Jeremiah 16:19

19 O LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ENDS OF THE EARTH, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit. (KJV) 

Daniel 4:11

11 The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the ENDS OF ALL THE EARTH: (KJV) 

Matthew 4:8

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; (KJV) 

[웃 910]

Now everyone says in 2010 that the following quote from the Bible about a big red dragon whipping his tail and sweeping 1/3rd of the stars out of the sky and onto earth is just metaphorical! But it clearly makes more sense, if you go back to when it was written 1000s of years ago, to say that the author had no idea how many stars were in the sky or how large they were....We don't need to go in to specifics, but let's just say this dragon would have to be so large you could start at his tail, travel at 186,000 miles per second (speed of light) for hundreds of millions of years and still not get to the end of his tail!!!!

Revelation 12:2-5 (New International Version)

²She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth. ³Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on his heads.⁴His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, so that he might devour her child the moment it was born. ⁵She gave birth to a son, a male child, who will rule all the nations with an iron scepter. And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.

Edited September 27, 2010 by Lord Infamous

[JohnSmith2007 353]

Isaiah 11:12 

12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH. (KJV)

Revelation 7:1

1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. (KJV) 

Job 38:13

13 That it might take hold of the ENDS OF THE EARTH, that the wicked might be shaken out of it? (KJV) 

Jeremiah 16:19

19 O LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ENDS OF THE EARTH, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit. (KJV) 

Daniel 4:11

11 The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the ENDS OF ALL THE EARTH: (KJV) 

Matthew 4:8

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; (KJV) 

You do understand the concept of "figure of speech" don't you? The term "end of the earth" just means everywhere. It isn't talking about a specific spot on a square or flat earth.

[JohnSmith2007 353]

Speaking as a Christian, faith is something you either have or don't have. God cannot be proved or disproved. The proof I have is in my heart and to me He is very real. I do not need a scientific proof of Gods exsitence nor does any scientific discovery shake my faith. There is no disconnect with science. To me God created the universe by setting up the laws of physics with an understanding of what will be the final outcome billions of years later. There is a barrier that science will never be able to cross, what happend before the big bang and where the big bang came from. That is where God is and that is where creation began.

[Danno 1,228]

Isaiah 11:12 

12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH. (KJV)

Revelation 7:1

1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. (KJV) 

Job 38:13

13 That it might take hold of the ENDS OF THE EARTH, that the wicked might be shaken out of it? (KJV) 

Jeremiah 16:19

19 O LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ENDS OF THE EARTH, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit. (KJV) 

Daniel 4:11

11 The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the ENDS OF ALL THE EARTH: (KJV) 

Matthew 4:8

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; (KJV) 

While not absolutely dismissing the references you offered, I must say theu do not quite rise to the level of claiming "The Earth is round".

People even today use the term four corners of far corners to express long distance rather than the shape of a land mass or area. If you think about it, why would anyone assume a flat world is square in the first place... it could just as easy been flat and circular.

ENDS OF THE EARTH- These references could simply mean the ends of the land masses. I guess if one wanted to be argumentative, one could suggest this "Ends of the earth"... might have referred to the North pole/South pole axis but I think thats a stretch.

I think people assume because the notion of a flat earth was settled science at one time... it must have come from the Bible.

The Bible is thousands of pages covering most every topic, we can disagree but these passages in my view do not quite rise to the level of teaching that the world was flat (and square).

A study of the original language may or may not give us more understanding.

[chri'stina 190]

I think it's a weak argument to use "ends of the earth" to mean a flat earth theory. So does that mean they believed the earth was a square?(four corners, four winds references) Meanwhile in Isaiah it says God looks at the circle of the earth. So you have never heard modern day people say something like "there were people there from all corners of the earth" as figure of speech???

Isaiah 40:22 (New International Version)

22 He sits enthroned above the circle of the earth,

and its people are like grasshoppers.

He stretches out the heavens like a canopy,

and spreads them out like a tent to live in.

Sure, it doesn't say specifically sphere, but I don't think the bible enforced a flat earth theory.

[^_^ 5,021]

The earth isn't a sphere.

[chri'stina 190]

The earth isn't a sphere.

Ok then it didn't specifically say earth is a round ball that's not perfectly round. Better?? lol

[Danno 1,228]

Sure, it doesn't say specifically sphere, but I don't think the bible enforced a flat earth theory.

But it sure gets credit for it.

Good Post

[^_^ 5,021]

Ok then it didn't specifically say earth is a round ball that's not perfectly round. Better?? lol

Much.

[chri'stina 190]

Much.

You are a sphere nazi! I think people from all four corners of the earth would agree.

[^_^ 5,021]

I think people from all four corners of the earth would agree.

May they fall off the ends of the earth into eternal hellfire.

[chri'stina 190]

May they fall off the ends of the earth into eternal hellfire.

Thankfully there is gravity on this roundish (not spherical) world, so people can't fall off the earth. I know what gravity is, even with being a Christian and all.