Here's What's the Matter With Kansas

[luckytxn 2,264]

Teachers are last to get their shitty 2% pay rise during booms times, when everyone is doing well and sneers at then. Yet the first to be hated on, when the economy tanks, because of the actions [negligence] of the same people now hating on them.

I've traveled around the US and yes while anecdotal as you guys call it, the level of poverty visible here is something I have never seen before in Australia or numerous other first world countries. Like I said the other week, poor areas are a minority in AUS, while middle class and wealthy areas are the majority.

It's the total opposite here, while there are pockets of middle-class and wealthy, a vast section of America is now living in what is by definition considered the third world abroad. LIke any third world countries, there are pockets of people doing extremely well.

Heck I saw it in India. If someone came along and lived my friend's family lifestyle, they'd think India offers the best life possible. As I recall it's you of all people who argued otherwise regarding this point; illustrating how the rest live - the norm.

Total bunk. I probably drive around this whole country more than anyone here and can say that the norm is middle class on up. Next time you go around open your eyes.

I also have been to Australia and can say the norm is middle class on up and there was poverty and a lot of racism. The only reason they are doing so well is that China is infusing their economy so much right now. If China gets a hic up then Aussie land will get a huge dose of the clap.

[Heracles 417]

It's not all that elite. Nor is it all that exclusive. Whenever I visit India I have a variant of the same conversation with someone who wants to "go abroad" as a student. These people always "apply" to many different countries, the US and Canada always being choices #1 and #2. Australia is always the safe backup. Anyone can get a student visa to go to Australia, from what I hear. They even have visa fairs in Indian cities to beg Indian kids to forego the University of North freakin Dakota to come study in Sydney instead. And yet, more Indian kids prefer North Dakota and Louisiana and other American backwaters to Australia.

The US does have excellent colleges, however, it does not change the reality of the financial state of the majority of middle Americans.

Indians are probably a bad example for economic growth, considering their spending habits in service driven western countries. Just saying.

[Heracles 417]

Total bunk. I probably drive around this whole country more than anyone here and can say that the norm is middle class on up. Next time you go around open your eyes.

What someone in Texas considers middle-class varies greatly to that of most.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

What someone in Texas considers middle-class varies greatly to that of most.

No, it just doesn't meet your definition of middle class. Remember, you're not like most.

[Heracles 417]

No, it just doesn't meet your definition of middle class. Remember, you're not like most.

This coming from the same guy who thinks a town of 6,000 in a country the size of America represents the norm. That town represents 0.0019% of Americas population, yet by "your definition", it's a great example.

Edited September 11, 2010 by Heracles

[spookyturtle 9,466]

This coming from the same guy who thinks a town of 6,000 in a country the size of America represents the norm. That town represents 0.0019% of Americas population, yet by "your definition", it's a great example.

Why don't you go back and read what I posted in that topic. It was about US towns with no murder and almost no crime. You said that none existed, so I posted several. And then you change the subject as you usually do when proven wrong. Go read it again.

[Texanadian 10]

The US had the largest boom in its history during the same time period that it also had the highest tax rates on the highest earners.

The country did the best when the majority of Americans earned a good salary, which also happens to coincide with the aforementioned time period.

So you're saying that we should pay more taxes so that we can earn more?

'The Situation' earned $5 million last financial year. Or how about dumbfuck atheletes or entertainers that earn tens of millions for what. My sperm has higher cognitive power than a entire NFL team combined.

That alone illustrates where a country's priorities lies. Ironically a similar situation found in numerous third world countries.

Seinfeld used to make $1 million per episode. 20 shows in a season? The work isn't exactly 40 hours a week either. Much as I think The Situation is a giant tool, he makes his living by entertaining millions of people. Simple as that. If you can sell a product to millions of people, you'll do the same.

The market can't always assign value to labor, particularly when it comes to intangibles. Even an NFL coach recognizes certain intangibles that don't show up on a player's stats when determining who stays and who gets cut from the team.

I agree on the sports analogy. Some hockey players get low goals and low assists. But they can block plays. Intimidate or irritate other teams. Hold other teams back while their own team goes on the offensive. As for value and labour? That's why pay is better determined at the local lower level than at the top. The CEO doesn't know if you're better or worse than your co-workers. Your manager does.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I agree on the sports analogy. Some hockey players get low goals and low assists. But they can block plays. Intimidate or irritate other teams. Hold other teams back while their own team goes on the offensive. As for value and labour? That's why pay is better determined at the local lower level than at the top. The CEO doesn't know if you're better or worse than your co-workers. Your manager does.

But it's the CEO's who sign the paychecks and they want to see tangible results, so your manager is going to have a hard time trying to go to bat for all his workers, especially when he's got his own pay to worry about. The reality is, unions are the only way to advocate for things such as fair wages, overtime, vacation and sick pay, beyond government policies, which the Libertarians of the Right loathe. Believing that the virtues of competition will work in favor of labor is a fallacy, because unbridled capitalism works against true competition.