What do you drink to celebrate?

[Fandango 1,439]

Twist your words? You said this thread was bashing christians. Clearly I'm the one that introduced the theme and I certainly wasn't bashing christians, I was suggesting that those who justify abstinence with biblical references are nuts. One because christ had no problem with drinking (even if you want to qualify that with responsibly) and two because suggesting that drinking leads to sin abdicates the person from all responsibility for their actions which is neither christian nor rational.

Pretty much every thread i see you participate in has you coming in like Snoopy's 'Pigpen' complete with your cloud of sh!t to ruin the damn thing with your constant bickering BS.

Ironically, I didn't quote you, didn't name you in my post, yet you immediately thought I was talking to you. Interesting.

[SMR 368]

What is false about it? I did amend my statement to say this was not true of all christians, but those of certain sects within christianity and they don't do it from some kind of preference, but because of a belief that drinking is sinful when there is nothing in the bible that makes such a claim at all. Drinking to the point of drunkenness is obviously more problematic, but it is based on a false premise that people that drink do things they do not want to do, or would not want to do if sober - that's ####### and as I also said, if you honestly believe that you can't drink because you are worried about what you might do while drunk, then you have serious issues that have nothing to do with alcohol.

I don't have any problem with anyone's personal preferences - people can choose to drink whatever they enjoy or think is most beneficial to them, but there is nothing righteous about not drinking alcohol and non drinkers are not special people.

Really, the most interesting issue here is that a couple people indicated their preference to celebrate without alcohol and you got on one about religion and how "non-drinkers are not special people." Nobody said anything about the religious implications of alcohol. Gary talked about the bad side effects of alcohol from his perspective but unless I am mistaken Gary didn't approach this from a religious perspective. Why did you suddenly become defensive?

Your assertion that people don't do things while drunk that they wouldn't do otherwise is really rather unfounded. Even a couple drinks will impair judgment and reaction times. I can't believe that you have never seen a drunk person make bad decisions that are uncharacteristic of that person while sober. That is the reality of alcohol.

While it may be true that alcohol simply removes inhibitions causing people to do something they had wanted to, inhibitions are often a good and reasonable thing. The fact remains that without alcohol the person was able to make good decisions based on an understanding of the probable outcomes of actions. While drunk, decision making and judgment become impaired and people don't make good decisions. Put another way, "inhibitions" are really just the ability of the person to make good decisions based on more than what he or she feels like. Alcohol removes that ability to make good decisions.

[Captain Oates 911]

I wish I'd never sent you those pics of me eating Mint Aeros, surrounded by bowls of whipped cream.

yes but what has that to do with what god drinks on his day off after creating yet another galaxy ?

He seems to be big on milk and honey actually - never tried it - never will

I like the blood drinking stuff - I have been everything except a catholic and I think they sound the best of the bunch with the blood drinking and imagining it is wine.. they never did that in the methodists

Do they tithe ? That will be the clincher...

Edited August 12, 2010 by saywhat

[SMR 368]

Really? Don't you think drinkers should take responsibility for their actions and not blame it on the alcohol?

Absolutely. At the very least, they made the decision to start drinking. That doesn't change the fact that drinking is making a decision to impair your ability to make good decisions in the future. That's not a safe idea.

I'm not defending people who do bad things while drinking by saying that it was the alcohol's fault and thus they should be absolved. I'm pointing out that people do more bad things while intoxicated.

[Captain Oates 911]

Absolutely. At the very least, they made the decision to start drinking. That doesn't change the fact that drinking is making a decision to impair your ability to make good decisions in the future. That's not a safe idea.

I'm not defending people who do bad things while drinking by saying that it was the alcohol's fault and thus they should be absolved. I'm pointing out that people do more bad things while intoxicated.

yeah I got engaged

[Jenn! 918]

It's not alcohol that makes you do that stuff - you either want to do it or you do not. Alcohol does not make people do anything. If one feels one must remain sober to abstain from such behaviours, one has a serious problem period.

I have a serious problem, but I think I'm in good company.

If you have really great self-control when you are drunk, then that's great. But I don't think that's true for many people.

[^_^ 5,021]

If you have really great self-control when you are drunk, then that's great. But I don't think that's true for many people.

Correct, it is not. MC lives in a bubble.

[Peikko 1,575]

Really, the most interesting issue here is that a couple people indicated their preference to celebrate without alcohol and you got on one about religion and how "non-drinkers are not special people." Nobody said anything about the religious implications of alcohol. Gary talked about the bad side effects of alcohol from his perspective but unless I am mistaken Gary didn't approach this from a religious perspective. Why did you suddenly become defensive?

Your assertion that people don't do things while drunk that they wouldn't do otherwise is really rather unfounded. Even a couple drinks will impair judgment and reaction times. I can't believe that you have never seen a drunk person make bad decisions that are uncharacteristic of that person while sober. That is the reality of alcohol.

While it may be true that alcohol simply removes inhibitions causing people to do something they had wanted to, inhibitions are often a good and reasonable thing. The fact remains that without alcohol the person was able to make good decisions based on an understanding of the probable outcomes of actions. While drunk, decision making and judgment become impaired and people don't make good decisions. Put another way, "inhibitions" are really just the ability of the person to make good decisions based on more than what he or she feels like. Alcohol removes that ability to make good decisions.

Seems to me like you are absolving responsibility from the person making the poor choice and placing it on alcohol. Sorry, no can do - making bad decisions is not a function of drinking. Lots of people drink and do not make bad decisions so how can that possibly be if alcohol removes the ability to make good decisions? It's rubbish is what it is - it impairs judgment IN TERMS OF ABILITY TO PHYSICALLY REACT TO EXTERNAL STIMULI, not the ability to know what is right and what is wrong. I have no idea why people feel the need to absolve people who drink and make bad choices of their responsibility and lay the blame on the alcohol as if it renders the drinker incapable. I am sure that is why people use it as an excuse, and people do, often.

[^_^ 5,021]

MC you can type in caps and yell all you want, you're still wrong.

[Jenn! 918]

Seems to me like you are absolving responsibility from the person making the poor choice and placing it on alcohol. Sorry, no can do - making bad decisions is not a function of drinking. Lots of people drink and do not make bad decisions so how can that possibly be if alcohol removes the ability to make good decisions? It's rubbish is what it is - it impairs judgment IN TERMS OF ABILITY TO PHYSICALLY REACT TO EXTERNAL STIMULI, not the ability to know what is right and what is wrong. I have no idea why people feel the need to absolve people who drink and make bad choices of their responsibility and lay the blame on the alcohol as if it renders the drinker incapable. I am sure that is why people use it as an excuse, and people do, often.

You even said you had a friend that strips when she gets drunk. Would she do this sober? No. Does she want to do it sober, quite possible. But she exhibits self control when she is sober by not stripping.

I just don't get your argument at all. No one is saying that your friend didn't strip herself and that the alcohol took off her clothes.

[Peikko 1,575]

Correct, it is not. MC lives in a bubble.

I see. Sorry, I just don't buy into the guff about drinking is to blame. It's not. When you are drunk you KNOW what you are doing and you know if what you are doing is questionable and you can choose not to - most people do not make poor decisions when they are drunk - they don't make any decisions worth talking about, they just hang out. I guess that is the excuse drivers give when they choose to drive home after drinking; "I was so drunk I thought I could drive home, it's not my fault I crashed and killed someone, it's the alcohol's fault!" Rubbish, people who drink still know they should not drive, that they are incapable of driving and that driving is wrong and if they do it, they are people who would make bad decisions sober as well. There is no excuse for it, period.

[^_^ 5,021]

I see. Sorry, I just don't buy into the guff about drinking is to blame. It's not. When you are drunk you KNOW what you are doing and you know if what you are doing is questionable and you can choose not to - most people do not make poor decisions when they are drunk - they don't make any decisions worth talking about, they just hang out. I guess that is the excuse drivers give when they choose to drive home after drinking; "I was so drunk I thought I could drive home, it's not my fault I crashed and killed someone, it's the alcohol's fault!" Rubbish, people who drink still know they should not drive, that they are incapable of driving and that driving is wrong and if they do it, they are people who would make bad decisions sober as well. There is no excuse for it, period.

You can throw as much of a hissy fit as you want, doesn't change the fact that you're wrong.

This is clearly a topic you know very little about.

[Peikko 1,575]

You even said you had a friend that strips when she gets drunk. Would she do this sober? No. Does she want to do it sober, quite possible. But she exhibits self control when she is sober by not stripping.

I just don't get your argument at all. No one is saying that your friend didn't strip herself and that the alcohol took off her clothes.

It's a guy, and yes, in fact he would although not as often. He knows what he does, he does it because he wants to. It is not offensive and it doesn't cause anyone harm but it is odd. Yes, it is very odd.

[Amby 490]

THIS IS A FUN THREAD NOT A BASHING THREAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BEEEEEEEEEEEE NIIIIIIIICCCCCCCCEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :angry:

[luckytxn 2,264]

It wasn't back peddling, my original statement didn't express what I meant to say, which was not that all christians have a thing about alcohol, just some of the more extreme sects, like the methodists. I know all about methodists...

I am a Methodist and you are wrong again as usual.