J1 craziness?!?

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

We get that you don't like the system.

I don't think anyone here does.

It's the Constitution of the United States that governs how law is written. Not values espoused on television or in video games. Not the verse scrawled beneath the Statue of Liberty.

Nowhere in the US Constitution or any of its amendments is there any reference to immigration, other than a sentence stating that Naturalization is a function of the Federal government.

Immigration policy is therefore very fluid and very much subject to the politics of the time they are crafted.

So there's your common sense argument.

You've also stated we shouldn't look to how things are done in other countries. That's true. In other countries, immigrants aren't welcomed at all. Even in nations that are US allies, an American can't enter those borders and even marry a national of those countries.

The US allowed you to marry your wife. It affords you a path for her J1 requirements to be waived and it affords you a path for her residency. That's a freedom you have. Too bad otherwise about the paperwork.

[sachinky 465]

The bottom line is that the minute we are married, let alone have a child in the US, -SHOULD- by all things ethical and moral rhetoric of our country, grant her citizenship -no matter what visa she was here on.

[Sgt. McGee 27]

I'm not normally one to attack spelling/grammar in a post, but I have to admit that it's surprising to see

ad numerum fallacy {fallacy of appealing to numbers} ...You also appeal to another fallacy ad pupulum {that because others do it it makes it right}

(rather sophisticated language, even if the spelling's a little rough)

in the same post as

The reason everyone is getting in a tisy about me being pissed is to fold,

Which is very difficult to parse.

I suspect it's far more indicative of your general state of being, considering that you follow it up with:

So, shut up with the whole, "you should have known better", "not had a kid", "what did you expect" and all that other B.S. because, I have every logical right to be emotionally pissed. My country has been setting the expectation with me my whole life that I am free, and at liberty to purse happiness, with out persecution, and now... I am being persecuted by policy -and that aint got ###### to do with Bosnia.

So please try and use valid and sound arguments before you chime in, and you might want to know what that mean prior to attempting it, as it is clear you either forgot, or did not know in the first place.

The system is not "working", may have solved one problem, but created others, my marriage is not fraudulent, and now I am suffering because of it. So, -that is not working.

You also, must have for got the 70's and 80's when the US was playing kids videos on Saturday morning about "the great American melting pot", and how anyone can come here and be "Free". And now to try and maintain this illusion of diversity they have a lottery? But possibly will not let my wife stay?! #######?! Do me a favor everyone, do not respond to this and get me going again.... I get even madder when I start to look at how dumb it all is.

When some gets on here and is pissed for justified reasons just say, yeah.. it sucks... now do this... do not try and justify clearly unjustifiable policies, or be a ####### to them -besides making the experiences worse for them, they may be a ####### back by pointing out how much of a ####### move you pulled.

You're an angry, angry person, and I'd wager that it has almost nothing to do with your situation.

You ask us not to respond to a thread that you posted, unsolicited? Odd.

What's unjustifiable about policies that state "you must follow our rules to be in this country legally?"

The "melting pot" concept you toss out there doesn't include ANYTHING about whether there are rules concerning said "melting" or not, just that our country is better off for the contributions of the different cultures that are represented here BY THOSE WHO FOLLOW THE RULES.

I'm sorry you got your wife pregnant before you understood what you were doing. Like it or not, having a baby requires the parents to assume certain responsibilities, and you've clearly failed to understand those appropriately. That's not the fault of the US Government, or anyone other than you. Complain all you like about the "system" but the "system" didn't get you married or conceive a child without understanding the implications. Your wife SHOULD have known that she had a 2-year home residency requirement, and if she didn't disclose that to you, then your issue is with her. Or with you, since you didn't try to sort that out in advance of marriage, or childbirth.

By comparison, if you walked into a buffet-style restaurant, and just started eating the food in front of you, and then got angry when you were expected to pay for it, whose fault is that? The "dumb system that doesn't work"? Or the person who wasn't observant/careful/smart enough to figure out that there are rules about how things are done?

The good news is, there's a chance for getting the waiver. The bad news is, having a baby isn't normally a strong enough reason to get one.

You're clearly not interested in being reasonable or rational on this (what are the implications of letting absolutely anyone become a citizen simply through marriage/childbirth? You don't think, with regard to national security or anything else, that there's an element of danger or foolishness there?), which is fine, but don't then try to pretend that you're the only sane one, and the rest of the world is crazy.

Sorry you're in a bad spot - a lot of us here are. But ranting and raving won't fix anything, and you're not going to win much help here by telling us all that we're stupid for following (or even believing in the justness of) the rules that are in place...

Good luck. I suspect you'll need it, and not just with this...

Edited June 17, 2010 by Sgt. McGee

[belinda63 3,038]

My understanding is that the J-1 with the home requirement is because the home country in some way provided financial aid to the student. (Please correct me if I am wrong). So a woman comes here paid in part or in total by her country (either the government or some private agency) with the understanding that she will take that knowledge and training back to her country to provide a needed skill in her country. She decides for whatever reason to get married and have a child while she is here, knowing that she is obligated to return to her country, and now you want to complain because you have to file some paperwork to obtain a waiver?

Maybe the answer would be to not give student visas and that would prevent situations such as yours. Then people couldn't complain how the US denied them the freedom to come here on a student visa and obtain citizenship.

Or to follow your argument we should give any person who married a US citizen immediate citizenship. Boy that would really work well (sarcasm).

I understand your frustration with the situation but it was caused initially by a lack of planning on your part. No one forced the woman to come here on a student visa (wife at the time or not). No one forced her to accept a student visa with a two year home requirement. No one forced her to have a child while she was here. These were all choices she made....she exercised her freedom in making these choices.

This situation is not the fault of the US government and I am sorry you do not agree with the laws but you still have to obey them.

[Killmon 0]

This article seems to be enlightening as to what is needed, as far as structure and criteria, for a successful Hardship letter.

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2007,0906-hake.shtm

I just read the whole thing, and it is very good. Granted, I need to read more, but I suspect that I am well armed now and have a solid basic understanding of what is needed to win a hard ship.

[Killmon 0]

My understanding is that the J-1 with the home requirement is because the home country in some way provided financial aid to the student. (Please correct me if I am wrong). So a woman comes here paid in part or in total by her country (either the government or some private agency) with the understanding that she will take that knowledge and training back to her country to provide a needed skill in her country. She decides for whatever reason to get married and have a child while she is here, knowing that she is obligated to return to her country, and now you want to complain because you have to file some paperwork to obtain a waiver?

Maybe the answer would be to not give student visas and that would prevent situations such as yours. Then people couldn't complain how the US denied them the freedom to come here on a student visa and obtain citizenship.

Or to follow your argument we should give any person who married a US citizen immediate citizenship. Boy that would really work well (sarcasm).

I understand your frustration with the situation but it was caused initially by a lack of planning on your part. No one forced the woman to come here on a student visa (wife at the time or not). No one forced her to accept a student visa with a two year home requirement. No one forced her to have a child while she was here. These were all choices she made....she exercised her freedom in making these choices.

This situation is not the fault of the US government and I am sorry you do not agree with the laws but you still have to obey them.

It was not caused by lack of planning, it was caused by the things needed for the original plan breaking down. And again illogical, I have shown that the system, and process with in it, are illogical. Therefore, unless you have a way of logically planning for the illogical, to conclude that it is possible to "Plan" for such a thing is illogical. No one on this site comes to it because they planned perfectly for the situation. They come here to deal with something that is unpredictable and illogical. No one would plan to go through this process. It is the whole reason why the J1 issue is such a pain in the ####! Your comment is flawed. You cannot plan everything, especially not this -all the planning in the world does not grantee a waiver.

I will not address the majority of you comment because it is entirely inconsistent for all the same reasons stated before, and more, but I will say this - Again, with the "No one forced her to have a child" comment?! Before I explain, once again, why it serves only to harm, let me clearly say #### YOU! As that is clearly the only language that such a comment deserves. Now, once again, logically, that is one of the most illogical and insensitive things you could possibly say to a person. Please see above logical arguments for the contradiction it results in and consider that you have no ###### clue as to the birthing circumstances such as age, ability to bare children, health risk and much more information. Not to mention that it is completely illogical to say... I am angry at clearly moronic people using bad logic to justify shitty comments to a person that has every logical right to be pissed off?! But, I guess that is above your understanding. You are either dumb, or you said that to be a #######... only two choices as it is clearly not relevant or logical.

I am angry at a process that harms people that should not be harmed in order to prevent crimes... totally against everything America is said to stand for. In essence, I must now prove my and my families innocents, not the other way around.

Unfortunately, my writing only seems sophisticated to a country that now teaches its children that "lmao" is a sentence and anything more than a hundred word is grad level. My spelling sucks because I am not spell checking and typing at at least eighty wpm. That, and I am just preparing to start a cross departmental double doctorate in philosophy {logic/mind/language} and neuro-science. I am now well aware that ignorance is bliss in a world of idiots -it is what it is.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

People do plan for this process. That's actually what the entire website is about.

I'm about to call you out now and I am sure you are not going to like it.

What you and your wife have done, in essence, is misuse the J1 visa she was granted. The purpose of her residency was to come here, teach, and return home.

So in essence, you and she are the ones who did not follow the plan.

However, even in that circumstance, the government allows her to file a waiver asking for forgiveness for having gone against the plan. Your problem is you are pi$$ed off about that. I actually think you are quite lucky to have the opportunity, given the fact you have broken a promise to the US government.

You are entitled to NOTHING from the US government insofar as your marriage to your foreign born spouse is concerned. So, the sooner you get that chip off your shoulder and do away with the entitlement mentality, the sooner you will be able to go about accomplishing the task at hand.

[Sgt. McGee 27]

Seriously. GET OVER IT.

I didn't say that you were "sophisticated". I was suggesting that average run-of-the-mill idiots don't generally use language like "appealing to ad populum fallacies". That was intended to be a compliment, but, predictably, you managed to make yourself look even worse by rejecting it. Impressive.

JohnnyQuest is right - if ANYONE has the right to be angry, it's the US Government, since you and your wife clearly violated the terms of the agreement that enabled her to come here.

You've also got a very bizarre notion of what America's about, what it stands for, and how it works.

What does the age at which your wife had the baby have to do with freedom?

Good luck proving your family's "innocents", since, um, you're not innocent. You broke the law. As others have said, the US government DOES give you a way to make amends (via the waiver process), but I'd suggest that you try to approach that with hat in hand, humbly seeking forgiveness, since that's really what you're asking for.

80 words per minute? That's hardly fast enough to justify the errors you're making... The way you express yourself suggests that you're probably rather young, eh?

[Killmon 0]

Man, let the illogical fools expound. I have just ask to be removed form this site as it is filled with idoits, and I have found very little helpful info. Any info I run across I will not share here. May all the suffering you cause people with problems come back on you a thousand fold. Obviously going through visa issues did not enlighten you to how truly horrible it can be for people which has allowed you to make the experience worse for many many people, I am just one that is vocal about it.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

I have just ask to be removed form this site

[alex and astrid 38]

Man, let the illogical fools expound. I have just ask to be removed form this site as it is filled with idoits, and I have found very little helpful info. Any info I run across I will not share here. May all the suffering you cause people with problems come back on you a thousand fold. Obviously going through visa issues did not enlighten you to how truly horrible it can be for people which has allowed you to make the experience worse for many many people, I am just one that is vocal about it.

Wow. The sense of entitlement you have is astonishing. You seem really unhappy that you have a chance to get around the home residency requirement that can be applied to the J1. At least you don't have to deal with the sometimes YEARS of waiting some VJ members have to be with their fiance/spouse. You don't want to listen to some of the honest, solid opinions of members here. Immigration takes planning. You, or at least, your wife, knew she would either have to return to Spain or set about getting a waiver. Having a whinge that you left it a little late isn't going to make the lack of planning go away. You know what you need to do. So do it.

By the way...granting instant citizenship upon marriage is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Fraud would ABOUND. Remember, residency and citizenship is not a right, it is a gift. Right now, you sound really ungrateful.

[msd 3]

Wow, the first time I come into this part of the forum and I read such a think.

Is it always like that?

Don't forget that you can lie and break laws to your government ALL you want but NOT your wife, since she is not a citizen. Therefore following the "idiotic" procedures will be necessary, whether you like it or not.

I don't like them either but it's not like you can change it.

Either you do what they ask or not. They don't care. But not following rules will not get you what you want.

Whining doesn't help either.

[Armenia 18]

@Killmon: I have a J1 visa waiver application that's pending. I've already received a favorable recommendation from USDoS but I'm still waiting for the "final decision" from USCIS.

Before applying for a waiver, do check if your wife is really subject to the HRR. Does she have it written on her visa or the DS-2019?

I'm sure you already know by now that there are only five grounds for the granting of a waiver (http://travel.state.gov/visa/temp/info/info_1288.html) = NOS, IGA, persecution, exceptional hardship, CONRAD or request by a State Dept of Public Health. I opted for the NOS route (No Objection Statement). You could try exceptional hardship but it's highly unlikely that the waiver will get approved. As the USDoS website said, mere separation from family is not considered exceptional hardship. From what I've read, what would be considered as hardship would be if there are cases where there's an ailing family member who is totally dependent on the J1 visa-holder (i.e., there's no one but her to take care of and financially support the ailing family member). If you are going the hardship route, have a backup in case your wife gets denied the visa waiver.

The other possible option is for your wife to apply for an NOS. The NOS is granted by the home (Spain) government, issued by the home government's embassy in the US directly to the US DoS. When she applies for the NOS, she also has to apply for the J1 visa waiver already since she will probably need to provide her case number (generated when she files her J1 visa waiver application online) to the home government (or whichever agency her home government has assigned to take care of processing NOS requests). There's also a third party barcode page that's generated during the J1 visa waiver application process that the home government/agency has to receive since the home government/agency has to include that barcode page when they send the NOS to USDoS.