Governor of Bamiyan province in Afghanistan wants to put back together Buddha statues blown up by Taleban

[Mirorgate 0]

Wow.. 27 pages of temporally slowed train wreck before my eyes. fascinating and frightening all the same.

Personally VP i have no issue with your beliefs as they pertain to you... personally. When you interject them onto others for their "own good" well then therein lies the issue, wouldnt you say?

I grew up in a legalistic religion.. similar to yours. rules for everything and everyone. i hated it... the hypocrasy there was astounding when finally seen as i got older and started to question why we believed as we did. "just follow along" didnt work anymore for me, and i formed my own opinions instead of parroting off what they "taught" at services. If this works for you, and you enjoy it great... dont expect others to "tolerate" your views though if you wont tolerate theirs.

[Veiled Princess 1]

That is preciscly why I said Arab and Muslim, as we are quie often grouped together. If you are stressed out maybe you should take a breather. I can understand being flamed on VJ is not fun but you are bringing it upon yourself. I had to talke a break for a month once.

You are right when you say that people don't need help forming thier misconceptions, but keep in mind that you are just feeding their misconceptions. You are as quick to judge as anyone else, calling a young girl a ####### for making out with a boy is a very quick and harsh judgment.

You don't have to come out and say "I support the Taliban" to give tht message clearly to people.

One thing I respect about you is your voice of reason, however, I can not give a message that I don't support.

[Fandango 1,440]

VP are you divorced or did you have your children out of wedlock?

[jordanianprincess 0]

That is preciscly why I said Arab and Muslim, as we are quie often grouped together. If you are stressed out maybe you should take a breather. I can understand being flamed on VJ is not fun but you are bringing it upon yourself. I had to talke a break for a month once.

You are right when you say that people don't need help forming thier misconceptions, but keep in mind that you are just feeding their misconceptions. You are as quick to judge as anyone else, calling a young girl a ####### for making out with a boy is a very quick and harsh judgment.

You don't have to come out and say "I support the Taliban" to give tht message clearly to people.

One thing I respect about you is your voice of reason, however, I can not give a message that I don't support.

A message of what exactly? What is it you don't support?

VP are you divorced or did you have your children out of wedlock?

Why does that matter?

[Veiled Princess 1]

Exactly - so move to Saudi, where women don't have the rights to marry foreign men... thus dropping your petition for your SO.

Please show proof that Saudi women are not allowed to marry foreigners

[Fandango 1,440]

VP are you divorced or did you have your children out of wedlock?

Why does that matter?

I'm wondering what the penalty is for either under Shaira law...since you're such a supporter of that kind of government, I'm wondering how they would have punished you?

[Veiled Princess 1]

You don't have to come out and say "I support the Taliban" to give tht message clearly to people.

One thing I respect about you is your voice of reason, however, I can not give a message that I don't support.

A message of what exactly? What is it you don't support?

That I support the taliban as everyone keeps slinging at me.

VP are you divorced or did you have your children out of wedlock?

Why does that matter?

I'm wondering what the penalty is for either under Shaira law...since you're such a supporter of that kind of government, I'm wondering how they would have punished you?

Penalty for what? Divorce? Divorce is allowed in Islam.

Edited August 9, 2006 by Veiled Princess

[jordanianprincess 0]

A message of what exactly? What is it you don't support?

That I support the taliban as everyone keeps slinging at me.

You don't have to say you support them directly You are still not answering my question. I am trying to understand your stance on this view. When I fast during lent, there is temptation all around. My ability to pass up those temptations is what makes my religious convition even stronger.

If you live in a country that is not "muslim", fasting is a much harder thing because the temptation to break your fast is all around you. The fact that you are not breaking your fast just makes you a stronger person. I think its harder for the Muslims in the USA to fast then it is in Jordan for example, because in Jordan all temptation is taken away completely.

[iceyspots 0]

A message of what exactly? What is it you don't support?

That I support the taliban as everyone keeps slinging at me.

You don't have to say you support them directly You are still not answering my question. I am trying to understand your stance on this view. When I fast during lent, there is temptation all around. My ability to pass up those temptations is what makes my religious convition even stronger.

If you live in a country that is not "muslim", fasting is a much harder thing because the temptation to break your fast is all around you. The fact that you are not breaking your fast just makes you a stronger person. I think its harder for the Muslims in the USA to fast then it is in Jordan for example, because in Jordan all temptation is taken away completely.

I find that a very good point to living in the states as well. Ramadan is much harder to achieve living here.

[Veiled Princess 1]

You don't have to say you support them directly You are still not answering my question. I am trying to understand your stance on this view. When I fast during lent, there is temptation all around. My ability to pass up those temptations is what makes my religious convition even stronger.

If you live in a country that is not "muslim", fasting is a much harder thing because the temptation to break your fast is all around you. The fact that you are not breaking your fast just makes you a stronger person. I think its harder for the Muslims in the USA to fast then it is in Jordan for example, because in Jordan all temptation is taken away completely.

OK? What is your point exactly? I already said I don't think it's in Islam to force the christians in the country to fast.

[jordanianprincess 0]

You don't have to say you support them directly You are still not answering my question. I am trying to understand your stance on this view. When I fast during lent, there is temptation all around. My ability to pass up those temptations is what makes my religious convition even stronger.

If you live in a country that is not "muslim", fasting is a much harder thing because the temptation to break your fast is all around you. The fact that you are not breaking your fast just makes you a stronger person. I think its harder for the Muslims in the USA to fast then it is in Jordan for example, because in Jordan all temptation is taken away completely.

OK? What is your point exactly? I already said I don't think it's in Islam to force the christians in the country to fast.

My point is this:

When you are protecting future Muslims from Idolism as you said, you are taking tempations away from them. Their ability to pass these temptations and obstacles in life is what defines their religious conviction. Instead of looking at it as "Christians being forced to fast" which is not the case, its done to take away the temptation to make it easier for the Muslims to fast.

The Quran teaches you that Idolism are wrong, the way I see it as long as in your personal life you follow this then you have succeded in making God happy. The same goes for fasting which is why I used it as an example. You are fasting for your religous convictions, why do I need to fast for you to be a good Muslim?

[Nizzy 1]

I cant believe you have the audacity to say that no one misses it because I do. I wanted to be able to go to Afghanistan and soak up my past and know where I have come from. That was always a missing link for me. Those statues are a part of me and will be a part of the generations of Afghans to come. We have to know where we have come from in order to know we are going. You can't just pretend we were never Buddhist and put the wool over people's eyes. If someone wants to convert to another form of religion other then Islam they won't need a statue to seal the deal. You seriously have some nerve

I have "some nerve" because I have an opinion? I am not free to have an opinion?

I would like to get your views on something VP. In Jordan, during Ramadam, it is forbidden for non-muslims to eat, drink, or smoke outside of their homes during daylight hours. All the restaurants are closed as well. Do you agree with this?

I guess I would say for you to take your own advice to me.... if you don't like it don't live there. I don't know what other answer you want from me. If it's the law there deal with it. As you have stated Jordan is not governed by the sharia and as far as I know forcing non-muslims to fast is not there.

You have some nerve because you don't even know what it means to be Afghan and you are stating that my history doesn't mean anything. I guess all the other stuff I said flew past your head.

[Veiled Princess 1]

My point is this:

When you are protecting future Muslims from Idolism as you said, you are taking tempations away from them. Their ability to pass these temptations and obstacles in life is what defines their religious conviction. Instead of looking at it as "Christians being forced to fast" which is not the case, its done to take away the temptation to make it easier for the Muslims to fast.

The Quran teaches you that Idolism are wrong, the way I see it as long as in your personal life you follow this then you have succeded in making God happy. The same goes for fasting which is why I used it as an example. You are fasting for your religous convictions, why do I need to fast for you to be a good Muslim?

You don't.

And here is my point.... you don't know what the future generations might think about those statues... I'm not talking about the next generation of even the next three... think 2,000 years down the road... what happens if something happens to the civilization there? 2,000 years later here are people digging through the rubble... they find a Quran some bukhari books and a bunch of statues? Think they might get the wrong idea? Is it possible they might misconstrue the reason those idols were there?

Do you not think this ever happened in the past? Every time an archeologist (sp?) finds a doll in some dig we get a new fertility goddess that someone must have worshipped in the old days....

The point is not to encourage idolatry in the future by leaving things like this behind in muslim culture. I believe that's the reason why the prophet destroyed the idols in his day and why he ordered others to do the same.

It's not just about offending God... it's also about preserving the truth. (our truth)

His it not also forbidden in christianity to make idols? graven images?

[Bosco 1]

Would you want to live in a Sharia governed state - with all that comes with that?

Yes

In most countries with Sharia law, you would lose custody of your children once you remarry and/or when they become age of custodial transfer. Few countries make provisions for when a women converts and the father is a non-Muslim.

[jordanianprincess 0]

My point is this:

When you are protecting future Muslims from Idolism as you said, you are taking tempations away from them. Their ability to pass these temptations and obstacles in life is what defines their religious conviction. Instead of looking at it as "Christians being forced to fast" which is not the case, its done to take away the temptation to make it easier for the Muslims to fast.

The Quran teaches you that Idolism are wrong, the way I see it as long as in your personal life you follow this then you have succeded in making God happy. The same goes for fasting which is why I used it as an example. You are fasting for your religous convictions, why do I need to fast for you to be a good Muslim?

You don't.

And here is my point.... you don't know what the future generations might think about those statues... I'm not talking about the next generation of even the next three... think 2,000 years down the road... what happens if something happens to the civilization there? 2,000 years later here are people digging through the rubble... they find a Quran some bukhari books and a bunch of statues? Think they might get the wrong idea? Is it possible they might misconstrue the reason those idols were there?

Do you not think this ever happened in the past? Every time an archeologist (sp?) finds a doll in some dig we get a new fertility goddess that someone must have worshipped in the old days....

The point is not to encourage idolatry in the future by leaving things like this behind in muslim culture. I believe that's the reason why the prophet destroyed the idols in his day and why he ordered others to do the same.

It's not just about offending God... it's also about preserving the truth. (our truth)

His it not also forbidden in christianity to make idols? graven images?

Idols are not forbidden in Christianity? What would give you that idea? They are a huge part of Christianity. Given the fact that Jordan is 94% Muslim, I don't think I will have any problem raising my children to be Christians. For people 2000 years down the road? C'mon think of what you are saying. There is nothing wrong with digging through rubble and finding history and those that don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

You can't erase the fast that Afghanistan was not always a Muslim country, you can't erase the fact that other religions exist. I don't start worshipping fertility goddesses when they after they are discovered, do you? My religion goes deep down in my roots, like I said nothing can shake it, its a part of who I am. Being Muslim is a part of who you are. If you are worried that seeing a statue is going to make you second guess your religion then perhaps Islam is not for you.