Feminism to blame for girls gone wild

[Ban Hammer 13,342]

Please enlighten me how it is not my wife's choice to serve her husband (not all the men on VJ, she will leave that to Elm and others trhat send their nude photos around on their iphone)

i didn't get that pic!

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

i didn't get that pic!

You didn't miss anything.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

that's very ungentlemanly Gary

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

that's very ungentlemanly Gary

Thank you, Trompe.

[Empress of Groovy 373]

What do you understand by feminism, Gary?

Allow me to step in.

Feminists, particularly American feminists, are angry, neurotic, self-loathing women with no fashion sense, cooking skills, or ability to walk several miles on cobblestone in stilettos, without complaint. If a man unfortunate or stupid enough to marry her requests a sandwich (with real mayo), he can expect a slug in the gut while her feminist sisters cheer her on.

[ValerieA 350]

Thanks, but I don't deserve the credit as I never said it.

Why do feminists so belittle their fellow women that believe differently than them? I thought you were "pro-choice" maybe I have mis-defined that also? Please enlighten me how it is not my wife's choice to serve her husband (not all the men on VJ, she will leave that to Elm and others trhat send their nude photos around on their iphone)

What is wrong with a woman pleasing her husband? What is wrong with her making a sammich with real mayonnaise? Or mashed potatoes with real potatoes? When did these things become bad and why? She is my wife, not my secretary. Not my room mate. Why isn't she permitted the same choices you are? Why does she have to make the same choices you do? Why am I not permitted to make a choice without ridicule?

I do not ridicule gays or lesbians and respect their choices, I respect your choices for YOU and for your husbands, I guess if that is what they like...hey why do I care? But why can't we get the same consideration? why do I have to "like" feminists or feminism? Why do I have to marry a feminist?

And do you still think feminism is not responsible for violence?

Gary, I think we are having an issue with our definitions of feminism. I don't work. I used to, and can't now because of waiting for my AOS. However, my husband and I have decided that we don't want me to work, that I will stay home, take care of his children from a prior marriage (when needed) and our children together (assuming that happens). I clean and cook. Yes, I make him sandwiches with real mayo (have recently found chipotle mayo that goes awesome with salami, btw) and mashed potatoes if that is what he has a hankering for with his supper.

This is my choice. My version of feminism accepts this as a choice. The thing is - choice is what is most important in my definition. I have the same level of equality as my husband, in our relationship and in the general world. I debate politics, I have many opinions (shocker to you all, I know) and no one is allowed to stifle my voice.

If I wanted to go back to being a Director of Finance? Well, yeah, I could. But my priorities are elsewhere, and luckily, I have a husband who enjoys working, makes a decent enough living for this scenario, and has priorities similar to mine.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Much love to Sister Val. We seem to be cut from very similar cloth.

[ValerieA 350]

Hooba-dooba.

First of all, I salute -- and I really do mean that -- your wife's choices. I'm a feminist, unabashedly, and for me that means a woman's choice to direct her life as she sees fit. I think what your wife is doing is great for her, and I would never, ever tell her not to do that so long as that makes her happy.

Second, I only use real mayonnaise and real potatoes in my cooking. I may be a ballbreaker, but I'm also surprisingly skilled in the domestic arts (viz my knitting thread and participation in the recipe thread). I love pleasing my man too.

Third, you probably already married a feminist, even if you didn't realise it at the time. Your wife sounds like a woman who has real determination, brains and grit. You're lucky, as you often say. If you buy into my definition of feminism, your wife is probably a feminist.

Fourth, no, I don't think feminism is responsible for violence.

And finally, my oopsie sext was sent to my husband.

Good Lord, were we separated at birth? Only you are a way better writer and obviously much faster than I am.

Much faster at typing, people!

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Good Lord, were we separated at birth? Only you are a way better writer and obviously much faster than I am.

Much faster at typing, people!

Eh, I write a lot for work. But thank you!

I also managed to write that while welcoming my estranged husband into the house, fixing him a cup of tea and planning our lunch together. For realz.

[ValerieA 350]

Eh, I write a lot for work. But thank you!

I also managed to write that while welcoming my estranged husband into the house, fixing him a cup of tea and planning our lunch together. For realz.

It's all about multi tasking. But that is unreal. I wrote mine while munching on chips and salsa, and IMing with hubby. I feel so tacky.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Threatened? Hardly. It's more a matter of being mystified by the ignorance of someone who can have such a weak grasp of human rights and equality. You know, two of the cornerstones that this nation was founded upon. You have the freedom and right to associate and enter into marriage with whomever you chose. That doesn't mollify your ignorance one bit.

Ignorance is a lack of knowledge. If I were ignorant of feminism I would probably have ignorantly married a feminist and still not realized why she isn't making my sandwiches. Instead, I consciously avoided that possibility. I am not ignorant. I disagree with you on the role of women in a marriage and such is my choice. It is not ignorance, it is a choice.

But again you put forth the argument of a threatened individual. Why? I mean what if I said that women who choose to have abortions are ignorant of the fact that the fetus is a live human being. Preposterous. They KNOW it is a live human being (it isn't dead and it isn't a fish)and they CHOOSE to kill it for whatever reason and the government should NOT make that decision for them. I am pro-CHOICE. I am NOT pro-abortion, that is two different things. Comprendez vous?

I am not ignorant of feminism or what it means. I am fully aware what it means, don't agree with it and choose to avoid it in my life. You do not like that because you think you have to force your opinion on everyone else so that you can do what you want and we (men) have to put up with it. But the fact is, you CAN do what you want and we DON'T have to put up with it. We can go elsewhere. I CHOSE to go elsewhere, out of the KNOWLEDGE that I do not have to accept feminism in my life, not out of IGNORANCE for what it is.

Perhaps you feel better now, knowing I made a concious decision...like an abortion, and will respect my and my wife's choice to thumb our noses at feminism.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Two words: holy #######.

[Peikko 1,575]

Allow me to step in.

Feminists, particularly American feminists, are angry, neurotic, self-loathing women with no fashion sense, cooking skills, or ability to walk several miles on cobblestone in stilettos, without complaint. If a man unfortunate or stupid enough to marry her requests a sandwich (with real mayo), he can expect a slug in the gut while her feminist sisters cheer her on.

To be fair, there are women who do not view relationships as avenues to emotional fulfillment but what I find bizarre is that somehow these women are assumed to be confined to Western cultures and that somehow, those women who are brought in from abroad are blessed by some unique but yet wholesome yearning for self sacrifice that manifests itself in a desire to simply 'please a man' regardless of any personal need for emotional growth and fulfillment.

The reality is much more complex with hardly anyone fitting into any of the simply stereotypical boxes being assigned for them. I expect that even Gary's wife is not the non-entity that she is made out to be but has her own set of desires that may or may not be being completely fulfilled in the role that she currently fills - I very much doubt that she gets nothing out of the relationship even though she is portrayed as little more than a personal escort cum house keeper. What I find most odd is Gary's desire to portray her as such, now that is insulting to his wife.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

I've been cogitating upon this further as I did the washing up and put lunch on. I think my major issue here is that Gary doesn't get that we are not foisting our choices onto his wife, but he sees fit to force his version of what it means to be a "real woman" onto us. If I were a misandrist, and I certainly am not, I would say that's classic male thinking: everyone has a choice as long as it's MY choice.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Allow me to step in.

Feminists, particularly American feminists, are angry, neurotic, self-loathing women with no fashion sense, cooking skills, or ability to walk several miles on cobblestone in stilettos, without complaint. If a man unfortunate or stupid enough to marry her requests a sandwich (with real mayo), he can expect a slug in the gut while her feminist sisters cheer her on.

Correct.

My wife is NOT a feminist. Not by any stretch of imagination. She is highly educated, very resourceful, fully capable of being successful on her own. She can cook, walk miles on cobblestones in heels and never complain and all that stuff that Empress describes.

She CHOOSES to be married to me and to live as a wife should (in our opinion) and takes great pleasure in pleasing her husband as I take pleasure in pleasing her. That she is capable of providing very well for herself is further evidence it is a CHOICE, not a neccessity to depend on a man. This makes it all the more satisfying to me, that she...

1. Made that choice

2. Continues to make that choice every day. I would b=never accepot it if she didnlt have the means to leave at any point, at any moment without notice. If she isn't free, it isn't a choice.

She believes, really, that men and women are fundemantally different and that women should not have to do a man's job, and vice versa. She believes a man and woman in marriage should be dedicated to each other and do those things they are best equipped to do for their mates. As a child of the Soviet Union she is aware of what she must be prepared and educated to do if need be. What you must do is not a choice. What you CHOOSE to do is what defines you as a feminist or not. Alla is fully CAPABLE of "being a feminist" she chooses not to be one.

Her beliefs and mine are closely meshed in this area...good thing, I married her.

Elm...you should be sending naked pics to your husband ON PURPOSE, what is there to be embarrased about? I thought you were sending it to strangers and were just a feminist floozie.