Naturalization

[Innocent 0]

I wanted to hear your thoughts regarding "continuous residence, physical presence" requirement before I can apply for my citizenship. I was outside of the USA for more than 6 months but less than a year in 2008. I got my green card in 2005 and I want to apply for my naturalization this year and wanted to know how this will affect my application. Should i state that fact on my application or reduce it to 6 months. I will wait to hear what you guys think.

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

Once you are out of the USA for 6 months, the residence clock STOPS. Once you are out of the USA for 12 months, the residence clock sets back to ZERO, like you have not resided in the USA ever. Since you have not been absence for a whole year at a time, the clock started ticking again when you returned, so you should be fine.

Edited May 25, 2010 by Just Bob

[Innocent 0]

Thanks Just Bob. That was very helpful.

So does it mean I have to wait till next year to apply for naturalization even though my 5 years is up in September? My other question is how does the USCIS keep track of your time you out of the country since there are no immigration officers to report to when you leave the USA? Is the time out still based on an honor system, what you tell them is what they go with?

[warlord 73]

Thanks Just Bob. That was very helpful.

So does it mean I have to wait till next year to apply for naturalization even though my 5 years is up in September? My other question is how does the USCIS keep track of your time you out of the country since there are no immigration officers to report to when you leave the USA? Is the time out still based on an honor system, what you tell them is what they go with?

The 6 months thing is never a hardened rule. It will all depend soley on your case and nature of your time abroad. If you were say taking care of a sick relative and can prove that you should be fine, if you were working over there for a foreign company then you could not only risk losing your continous residency, but also your permenant residency status. There are people that have been out 8 months and got a good IO and have been fine because they had a strong case about their reasons for being out so long. Others have been denied by being out for only 4 months before. Again it's the nature and the past history.

You will notice with the INS nothing is ever strict by the rule book. General rule is if you have satisfied the total requirement of number of days in the US (can't remember what that is) in the past 5 years (3 if married) and you took one trip for a little over 6 months with good reason and documentation to prove it and you have satisfied the residency requirements of total days in the US, there's a chance the IO will be fine with that.

The only thing that the 6 months rule means is that before 6 months, the IO has to prove you broke continous residency. After 6 months you now have to prove to the IO that you didn't. It's just a change of who has to prove residency status.

Now with the year thing, that's usually when not only continous residency is broken, but also permenant residency status is often revoked (though you can have this for only being out a few months too), all depends on why you are out...

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

Warlord . . . please!

He's not trying to convince some I.O. at the border that he has not abandoned his US residency; he is in the US and is applying for citizenship.

Innocent, you don't have to wait any longer. USCIS has computers, and they ask you on the N-400 application about this as well. Then they look at your passport. They know, or they figure it out, trust me. As long as your total absence from the US in the past 5 years was less than a year, you are good to go.

[Innocent 0]

Thanks just Bob.....

So do i still have to show them proof that i was taking case of my father who had a stroke? If so will a letter from my Dads Doctor as well as the hospital be good enough to certify this?

Do they also need tax returns for the past 5 years?

[warlord 73]

Warlord . . . please!

He's not trying to convince some I.O. at the border that he has not abandoned his US residency; he is in the US and is applying for citizenship.

Innocent, you don't have to wait any longer. USCIS has computers, and they ask you on the N-400 application about this as well. Then they look at your passport. They know, or they figure it out, trust me. As long as your total absence from the US in the past 5 years was less than a year, you are good to go.

You do know how the INS works don't you? 6 months time does not mean you have reset your clock at all. It is only a generic line where the ownership of proving if you have broken continous residency switches. And yes, they will be wanting to know the details of the trip and if people away have abandoned their perment residency. Does that happen, yes very much so.

Over 6 months in no way, however, means you have broken or reset the clock either. It will be up to the IO to determine if you have. Sometimes they will determine if you have and others they will determine if you haven't if you have been out of the US for ANY amount of time. After 6 months though, YOU have to prove that you didn't with proof of US ties.

And what do you think the US citizenship interview is all about Just Bob? It's about whether or not you are legally qualified to be a US citizen. Look at people who have claimed they have voted before being a citizen on the N400? Denial and some in deportation proceedings. The N400 interview is all about determining someones legitamcy through their process. Denials are common, deportation proceedings happen. People out of the country too long, trigger that in the N400 interview regardless if you have been back in the US for a year or months.

And no, they don't always check passport entries through computers, the will look at the passport in hand, if it's not stamped they don't or won't or can't always check the computer systems. It doesn't work that way and never has.

Look at all the websites out there about over 6 months. They will all tell you this. Telling someone Just Bob that they will be fine after 6 months is just purely wrong and dangerous information considering people who have wasted so much money on the N-400 process to realize they are denied. Now I'm not saying the OP will be considered abandoning his GC at all, I just mentioned that it can happen depending on the situation which we don't know about. Most cases though it would be a denial if there isn't sufficent evidence to prove that the OP maintained enough residency after the 6 months and the nature of the trip and then the IO will decide if the time line resets or not.

And Just Bob, looking at your timeline you are not even at your N-400 yet. I have gone through the entire process...

Edited May 26, 2010 by warlord

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

Warlord,

You are simply mistaken and you are drifting away into the realm of hypotheticals that have no actual meaning to the O.P.'s case.

Residence and Physical Presence

An applicant is eligible to file if, immediately preceding the filing of the application, he or she:

* has been lawfully admitted for permanent residence;

* has resided continuously as a lawful permanent resident in the U.S. for at least 5 years prior to filing with absences from the United States totaling no more than one year;

* has been physically present in the United States for at least 30 months out of the previous five years (absences of more than six months but less than one year break the continuity of residence unless the applicant can establish that he or she did not abandon his or her residence during such period);

* has resided within a state or district for at least three months.

The O.P. has met all of the above requirements. His absence was less than a year total and he proved that he did not abandon his residence when returning and now once more by applying for citizenship.

The issue you are bringing up is only important for a GC holder who returns to the US after being absent for several months and is questioned by the CBP Officer. The O.P. is long beyond that point. It will not even come up during the interview.

And in response to your last point, I don't need to set myself on fire in order to know that it will burn my skin. Imagine every judge would have to rape a child first in order to know what it's like and then to pass judgment on a child rapist.

[warlord 73]

Warlord,

You are simply mistaken and you are drifting away into the realm of hypotheticals that have no actual meaning to the O.P.'s case.

Residence and Physical Presence

An applicant is eligible to file if, immediately preceding the filing of the application, he or she:

* has been lawfully admitted for permanent residence;

* has resided continuously as a lawful permanent resident in the U.S. for at least 5 years prior to filing with absences from the United States totaling no more than one year;

* has been physically present in the United States for at least 30 months out of the previous five years (absences of more than six months but less than one year break the continuity of residence unless the applicant can establish that he or she did not abandon his or her residence during such period);

* has resided within a state or district for at least three months.

The O.P. has met all of the above requirements. His absence was less than a year total and he proved that he did not abandon his residence when returning and now once more by applying for citizenship.

The issue you are bringing up is only important for a GC holder who returns to the US after being absent for several months and is questioned by the CBP Officer. The O.P. is long beyond that point. It will not even come up during the interview.

And in response to your last point, I don't need to set myself on fire in order to know that it will burn my skin. Imagine every judge would have to rape a child first in order to know what it's like and then to pass judgment on a child rapist.

Just Bob, you need to reseach the 6 months issue more, your information is incorrect. Look it up there is a lot on the internet about it. This has nothing to do with coming back into the US recently. Check the USCIS's own website:

Requirements from http://www.uscis.gov/files/article/M-476.pdf

5 years (3 if married) without leaving the US for trips longer then 6 months.

Section under questions: What if I was outside the US between 6 and 12 months?

Answer: If you leave the United States for more then 6 months, but less then 1 year, you have broken or disrupted your continous residence unless you can prove otherwise.

As I had stated before, there are 2 things they will look at in the interview. One is if they broken continous residence since 6 months is the line where after that the person must prove that they didn't and the next part is if they don't have enough evidence, the USCIS can then determine if the Green Card was broken during that time. The 2nd part isn't very common, but it would be stupid to assume it never has happend. This is why people should never leave for more then 6 months without a very good reason. Both these things may be examined at the interview. As I stated before some people have had good interviews where it was not a problem and they were able to prove their trips didn't break continous residency, others have been denied under 6 months. Some have been placed in deportation proceedings.

How can you say that is going off topic Just Bob? It is everything to do with the OP's topic when they stated they were out of the US for over 6 months and under a year. You need to understand how this system works Just Bob, and really research this as your advice people would be safe is not only wrong, but dangerous for people to go in thinking everything would be fine only to find out they could be facing some problems...

Edited May 27, 2010 by warlord

[Innocent 0]

Just Bob, you need to reseach the 6 months issue more, your information is incorrect. Look it up there is a lot on the internet about it. This has nothing to do with coming back into the US recently. Check the USCIS's own website:

Requirements from http://www.uscis.gov/files/article/M-476.pdf

5 years (3 if married) without leaving the US for trips longer then 6 months.

Section under questions: What if I was outside the US between 6 and 12 months?

Answer: If you leave the United States for more then 6 months, but less then 1 year, you have broken or disrupted your continous residence unless you can prove otherwise.

As I had stated before, there are 2 things they will look at in the interview. One is if they broken continous residence since 6 months is the line where after that the person must prove that they didn't and the next part is if they don't have enough evidence, the USCIS can then determine if the Green Card was broken during that time. The 2nd part isn't very common, but it would be stupid to assume it never has happend. This is why people should never leave for more then 6 months without a very good reason. Both these things may be examined at the interview. As I stated before some people have had good interviews where it was not a problem and they were able to prove their trips didn't break continous residency, others have been denied under 6 months. Some have been placed in deportation proceedings.

How can you say that is going off topic Just Bob? It is everything to do with the OP's topic when they stated they were out of the US for over 6 months and under a year. You need to understand how this system works Just Bob, and really research this as your advice people would be safe is not only wrong, but dangerous for people to go in thinking everything would be fine only to find out they could be facing some problems...