A Plea to Long Time, Level-Headed Members Who Still Post Here

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

i'm assuming he is referring to the last bullet under the permitted uses section.

Permitted Uses. You agree that you are responsible for any Content and communications that you Post and for any consequences thereof. You agree to use the Service (including but not limited to the discussion forums) only to send and receive messages, material, and in general Content that is “in conformity with or permitted by law†(legal), proper and if part of the discussion forums then also related to the particular subject matter. By way of example, and not as a limitation, you agree that when using the Service, you will not:

-> Condone or instruct, either directly or indirectly, others on how to commit fraudulent or illegal immigration activities in any way, shape, manner or method.

I haven't seen him providing instructions on how to commit illegal immigration....nor condoning the act of illegal immigration. While I disagree with him on the subject of Amnesty, to say that by his support of amnesty he commits any of the above actions is misleading at best. In fact to allude that he does based on his support of Amnesty is bordering on defamation and is a TOS violation in and of itself.

Edited June 6, 2010 by Sousuke

[SMOKE 1,426]

i'm assuming he is referring to the last bullet under the permitted uses section.

Permitted Uses. You agree that you are responsible for any Content and communications that you Post and for any consequences thereof. You agree to use the Service (including but not limited to the discussion forums) only to send and receive messages, material, and in general Content that is “in conformity with or permitted by law†(legal), proper and if part of the discussion forums then also related to the particular subject matter. By way of example, and not as a limitation, you agree that when using the Service, you will not:

-> Condone or instruct, either directly or indirectly, others on how to commit fraudulent or illegal immigration activities in any way, shape, manner or method.

I haven't seen him providing instructions on how to commit illegal immigration....nor condoning the act of illegal immigration. While I disagree with him on the subject of Amnesty, to say that by his support of amnesty he commits any of the above actions is misleading at best. In fact to allude that he does based on his support of Amnesty is bordering on defamation and is a TOS violation in and of itself.

i guess you missed the bolden part. i didn't say it. i merely explained where i believed what another poster was reffering too.....but since we're now talking about a TOS violation of defamation. saying i was alluding to something i wasn't...

are you starting to see that enforcing the TOS verbatim isn't a good idea, especially in the OT? & why if people don't like certain people or subjects that get discussed in the OT. the best thing for them to do is just stay out of those threads & not stalk & respond to every other post made by the object of their scorn?

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

i guess you missed the bolden part. i didn't say it. i merely explained where i believed what another poster was reffering too.....but since we're now talking about a TOS violation of defamation. saying i was alluding to something i wasn't...

are you starting to see that enforcing the TOS verbatim isn't a good idea, especially in the OT? & why if people don't like certain people or subjects that get discussed in the OT. the best thing for them to do is just stay out of those threads & not stalk & respond to every other post made by the object of their scorn?

Sorry, my post wasn't directed at anyone in particular. I quoted your post because it contained the relevant information. And no I don't see an issue with TOS enforcement. Clearly everyone but a few knows that having a debate about changing immigration law does not equal a TOS violation.

[SMOKE 1,426]

And no I don't see an issue with TOS enforcement. Clearly everyone but a few knows that having a debate about changing immigration law does not equal a TOS violation.

idk sousuke i think its a good example of how things can be viewed differently among members. 'condone' itself is pliable. it depends on ones pov what it means. dealing with multiple people having multiple povs, any TOS is next to impossible to apply verbatim. a mod or admin would have to use 'their best judgement' when considering what is & isn't a violation, or when the TOS should be enforced more leniently. i still say, its better for posters to police themselves as much as possible & accept the decisions made by the admin & mods when they feel their intervention is needed. they see a lot more of the big picture & posting patterns than we do.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

The op is talking about 'playground behavior' I'd hardly call Rich's comment as such.

And Rich's comment has nothing to do with the OP, what's more I don't think it's exactly truthful.

Of course if you think its fine to play that game then I *could* bring up Rich's consistent anti-muslim invective. Of course it too would have nothing to do with the OP, aside from having some silly neener-neener dig.

[Darnell 8,478]

well poo - I am not a Long Time, Level-Headed Member but I wish you well with this endeavor.

It seems to be the same krewe of folksen who fire the flame bait.

Now that I've read enough of it - I can see the pattern, know who the f*cktards are.

It's not about the topic, #### no - it's all about 'the play'.

Seriously, put the keyboard down, fellas, and get into the gym. If you could change yer body shape, yer spouse would spend more time with ya !

Raise yer hand if you got into the gym, after the 21st, and let us know of any new 'spousal involvement' ??

[BishopM 114]

We need more of you to participate in the Off Topic Forum. For those who are level-headed, you know who you are and you've probably avoided OT because of the handful of posters who've made it less enjoyable to have reasonable discussions about a lot of topics that deserve some serious thought. Of course, not every thread needs to be serious, but I think the ones here who've been long time members and are still here, are staying in the upper forums where there is less tolerance for playground behavior.

Brother Steve,

I will try to clean up my OT act

Peace to you,

B-ji

[Sinergy 3]

Hi Tara! :star::star:

awww yaaay

[Aubrey 10]

I have to agree about the OT forum to those who say it's a cesspool. I regularly see racist or sexist comments that are clearly intended to flame someone. And that attitude spills into other subforums. I get so tired of the people who spam VJ all day and are part of their little clique dominating the forums and being so rude to anyone that dare respond to them.

I think that the community feel of VJ falls flat because of the treatment that's allowed to persist towards newer members and the hate that fills OT. Rather than calling older members to post in OT, I think that moderation efforts need to zap topics much more frequently that are filled with these inflammatory comments and threads started only for that purpose. Not just because OT is an ugly place to try to visit, but because members feel that they can mistreat others in immigration-related forums because it's allowed in OT.

It's a lot like a classroom. Crazy stuff can happen outside the classroom, but once you step inside it should be a safe learning environment for everyone, regardless of age, gender, ethnicity, or what clique you belong to. Good schools create that environment. Bad ones allow the cursing, teasing, and harassment to happen openly in their classrooms.

[Darnell 8,478]

After giving it some thought, I think the best solution would be to have Off Topic split into two forums - one that is for more serious discussions and one for light-hearted topics. The more serious OT forum would then be moderated with the same scrutiny as the upper forums are currently.

You might want to start 'the lobbying effort' on this, sometime soonish.

[^_^ 5,021]

I have to agree about the OT forum to those who say it's a cesspool. I regularly see racist or sexist comments that are clearly intended to flame someone. And that attitude spills into other subforums. I get so tired of the people who spam VJ all day and are part of their little clique dominating the forums and being so rude to anyone that dare respond to them.

You know, I've been reading complaints along these lines for years. And yet, despite the alleged hostility to newbies and despite the alleged cliques, many frequent posters on OT today were not frequent posters one year ago. One wonders, if the hostility was as bad as alleged and the cliques as powerful, how could this be?

[Fandango 1,439]

You know, I've been reading complaints along these lines for years. And yet, despite the alleged hostility to newbies and despite the alleged cliques, many frequent posters on OT today were not frequent posters one year ago. One wonders, if the hostility was as bad as alleged and the cliques as powerful, how could this be?

It can't, it's the same old tired schtick that is on every message board on the net. That, and the 'this place has changed' schpiel.

[^_^ 5,021]

It can't, it's the same old tired schtick that is on every message board on the net. That, and the 'this place has changed' schpiel.

Yup.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I see nobody haz invented the panties-unwadder yet.

Edited August 1, 2010 by ##########

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

I see nobody haz invented the panties-unwadder yet.

i did, but someone's been using it for months now.