help with I-864 form for IR5 parents visa

[meric 0]

I am trying to fill out the AOS form. I am sponsoring both of my parents. Should I fill out two separate I-864forms for them? I will also be using my husband's income, since I only have been working for two years. We file tax together, however,when I was trying to fill out the form, it asks for individual income. What should I put in? Also, the taxable income showing on the tax return is not really annual income. If I put my annual income, that would not match the taxable income on the tax return. So what number should I put?

Please help.....thanks

[trailmix 77]

Hi,

Basically - yes, you will fill out two separate forms (the answer to that question is in the I-864 instructions, page 3).

When you say it won't match, you mean because you filed jointly with your Husband? You need to prove your own individual income, you will need to submit either your 1040 or tax transcript and all of your own individual tax slips (W2s, 1099s etc).

"income means an individual's total income (adjusted gross income for those who file IRS Form 1040EZ) for purposes of the individual's U.S. Federal income tax liability, including a joint income tax return (e.g., line 22 on the 2005 IRS Form 1040, line 15 on the 2005 IRS Form 1040-A, or line 4 on the 2005 IRS Form 1040EZ or the corresponding line on any future revision of these IRS Forms)".

The same for your Husband, when he fills out the I-864A.

From : Adjudicator's Field Manual - Redacted Public Version \ Chapter 20 Immigrants in General \ 20.5 Enforceable Affidavits of Support

"If a sponsor filed a joint tax return with a spouse, but is qualifying using only his/her own individual income, the sponsor must submit evidence of that individual income. This evidence would include, for example, the sponsors own W-2(s), Wage and Tax Statement, and if necessary to reach the income requirement, evidence of other income reported to IRS which can be attributed to him/her, usually on Forms 1099".

Edited May 20, 2010 by trailmix

[andresbonifacio 7]

I will also be using my husband's income, since I only have been working for two years. We file tax together, however,when I was trying to fill out the form, it asks for individual income. What should I put in? Also, the taxable income showing on the tax return is not really annual income. If I put my annual income, that would not match the taxable income on the tax return. So what number should I put?

Please help.....thanks

on the I-864:

Number 23 put your ANNUAL INCOME

Number 25 put the exact AGI (adjusted gross income) that appears on your Tax Return even if its not just your income because you filed jointly.

Edited May 20, 2010 by andresbonifacio

[Darnell 8,479]

IIWY, I'd take the joint tax return and DECONSTRUCT IT, work up 2 new returns, per year -

one on you

one on your husband

then fill out the return, capturing income and tax data on each form.

(you don't have to submit these to IRS at all, just think of it as a worksheet, at this point'.

Once you've done this, for each year, you'll have a CLEAR picture of income and tax, for each person (you and your husband) . Then, you can match up, in the I-864 instructions, exactly WHICH lines of the tax return to put into the I-864.

I suggest to do it 'this way' because it's easier to 'track the financial numbers' on this. The 'mapping of data', IMO, is easier.

Good Luck !

Edited May 20, 2010 by Darnell

[andresbonifacio 7]

IIWY, I'd take the joint tax return and DECONSTRUCT IT, work up 2 new returns, per year -

one on you

one on your husband

then fill out the return, capturing income and tax data on each form.

(you don't have to submit these to IRS at all, just think of it as a worksheet, at this point'.

Once you've done this, for each year, you'll have a CLEAR picture of income and tax, for each person (you and your husband) . Then, you can match up, in the I-864 instructions, exactly WHICH lines of the tax return to put into the I-864.

I suggest to do it 'this way' because it's easier to 'track the financial numbers' on this. The 'mapping of data', IMO, is easier.

Good Luck !

Sorry but I think that is a waste of time and kinda stupid. YOU HAVE TO PUT ON THE I-864 THE EXACT AGI ON YOUR TAX RETURN WEATHER IF ITS JUST YOUR AGI OR BOTH FOR YOU AND YOUR SPOUSE. SO IF YOU FILED JOINTLY THEN THE AGI IS NOT JUST YOUR OWN INCOME.

just to give you an idea on what I did for my mom's petition:

-I'm jobless but still earned something in 2009

-Used my wife's income (I-864a)

-I put zero as my current annual income on the I-864

-submitted only ONEcopy each of 2007,2008 and 2009 Transcripts from IRS w/ the I-864 and I-864a (NO W2s, payslips nor letter of employment from the wife's job)

-BTW we filed jointly so the AGI on the i-864 is both mine and my wife's income w/c is the exact amount on our tax return

-Affidavit of support was accepted after a week with no RFEs

Edited May 20, 2010 by andresbonifacio

[Darnell 8,479]

Sorry but I think that is a waste of time and kinda stupid. YOU HAVE TO PUT ON THE I-864 THE EXACT AGI ON YOUR TAX RETURN WEATHER IF ITS JUST YOUR AGI OR BOTH FOR YOU AND YOUR SPOUSE. SO IF YOU FILED JOINTLY THEN THE AGI IS NOT JUST YOUR OWN INCOME.

Sorry, I disagree.

[andresbonifacio 7]

its your opinion, you're entitled to it.

[trailmix 77]

Sorry but I think that is a waste of time and kinda stupid. YOU HAVE TO PUT ON THE I-864 THE EXACT AGI ON YOUR TAX RETURN WEATHER IF ITS JUST YOUR AGI OR BOTH FOR YOU AND YOUR SPOUSE. SO IF YOU FILED JOINTLY THEN THE AGI IS NOT JUST YOUR OWN INCOME.

just to give you an idea on what I did for my mom's petition:

-I'm jobless but still earned something in 2009

-Used my wife's income (I-864a)

-I put zero as my current annual income on the I-864

-submitted only ONEcopy each of 2007,2008 and 2009 Transcripts from IRS w/ the I-864 and I-864a (NO W2s, payslips nor letter of employment from the wife's job)

-BTW we filed jointly so the AGI on the i-864 is both mine and my wife's income w/c is the exact amount on our tax return

-Affidavit of support was accepted after a week with no RFEs

You recommend people put the AGI from the 1040 - even if it is a joint return (which is correct) but then you also recommend that they don't send any evidence to show their individual income?

While I understand that this was accepted at NVC, that does not necessarily mean it will be accepted at the consulate level.

You are supposed to include W2s and 1099s etc to prove your individual income, if you filed a joint return.

Good luck though, hopefully they won't ask for them.

Edited May 20, 2010 by trailmix

[andresbonifacio 7]

You recommend people put the AGI from the 1040 - even if it is a joint return (which is correct) but then you also recommend that they don't send any evidence to show their individual income?

While I understand that this was accepted at NVC, that does not necessarily mean it will be accepted at the consulate level.

You are supposed to include W2s and 1099s etc to prove your individual income, if you filed a joint return.

Good luck though, hopefully they won't ask for them.

In the I-864 instruction it says:

"If you provide a photocopy of your tax return(s), you must include a copy of each and every Form W-2 and Form 1099 that relates to your return(s). Do not include copies of these Forms if you provide an IRS transcript of your return(s) rather than a photocopy."

So I'm only saying that W2s are not needed if they submit IRS transcripts.

Same instruction also says:

"You may include evidence supporting your claim about your expected income for the current year if you believe that submitting this evidence will help you establish ability to maintain sufficient income. You are not required to submit this evidence, however, unless specifically instructed to do so by a Government official. For example, you may include a recent letter from your employer, showing your employer's address and telephone number, and indicating your annual salary. You may also provide pay stub(s) showing your income for the previous six months. If your claimed income includes alimony, child support, dividend or interest income,or income from any other source, you may also include evidence of that income.

It says there IT IS NOT REQUIRED but YOU MAY INCLUDE IT.

Edited May 21, 2010 by andresbonifacio

[trailmix 77]

I don't think you are actually seeing what I have posted.

What you have posted above is true and correct IF you are submitting an affidavit of support that does not include a joint return.

The instructions only cover the basics - when you get outside the basics you have to do a little research to find out which rules apply to your particular situation.

[andresbonifacio 7]

I don't think you are actually seeing what I have posted.

What you have posted above is true and correct IF you are submitting an affidavit of support that does not include a joint return.

The instructions only cover the basics - when you get outside the basics you have to do a little research to find out which rules apply to your particular situation.

You didn't read what I posted don't you?

"-BTW we filed jointly so the AGI on the i-864 is both mine and my wife's income w/c is the exact amount on our tax return"

Me and my wife submitted a joint return for the last 5 years.

For my affidavit of support we included IRS Transcripts for the past 3 years (2007, 2008, 2009) that are all JOINT RETURNS.

So, if the above rules that I posted doesn't apply for JOINT RETURNS, why was our affidavit of support approved?

Yes, I agree that you need to do more research for particular situations and that's what I did.

Edited May 22, 2010 by andresbonifacio

[trailmix 77]

Yes, I am reading what you have written - although I don't have to - I am quite familiar with the I-864. What I am saying is that you are not following the instructions (now I don't really care if you do or not - that's up to you personally).

However - if you are going to answer a question about the I-864, it is important that you give them the correct information, you have not.

You cannot take the I-864 instructions at face value. As soon as you deviate from the norm you must do some more research and say, ok, well our situation is a bit different from what they have instruction for, so I guess I need more information.

The link I posted to the correct instruction for the I-864, when you have a sponsor that filed a joint return, is from the adjudicator's field manual. This is the reference point for the COs at the consulate. Your I-864 has been accepted at the NVC - that does not mean it will be accepted at the consulate.

Again, I am not trying to tell you what to do, maybe your I-864 will be accepted, I don't know, but again, if you are going to help someone else out, at least give them ALL the information so that they don't go to their interview unprepared because I am sure you will be sorry and i'm also sure that won't help them at all.

Good luck to you.

Edited May 22, 2010 by trailmix

[andresbonifacio 7]

I see your point Trailmix and if you think I gave the wrong information then my bad.

Anyway, lets go back to one of the questions of the thread starter:

I will also be using my husband's income, since I only have been working for two years. We file tax together, however,when I was trying to fill out the form, it asks for individual income. What should I put in? Also, the taxable income showing on the tax return is not really annual income. If I put my annual income, that would not match the taxable income on the tax return. So what number should I put?

Now lets go back to the "RULE" that you quoted:

"If a sponsor filed a joint tax return with a spouse, but is qualifying using only his/her own individual income, the sponsor must submit evidence of that individual income. This evidence would include, for example, the sponsor’s own W-2(s), Wage and Tax Statement, and if necessary to reach the income requirement, evidence of other income reported to IRS which can be attributed to him/her, usually on Forms 1099".

From what I understand after reading that rule, you only need evidence of an individual's income if that individual is NOT going to use his/her spouse's income to qualify.

But if both incomes will be used then no need to prove "individual" income since both incomes will be used anyway that's why (in my opinion) an IRS Transcript alone is enough.

Going back to Meric's case, she is the sponsor and will be using her husband's income too which is similar to what I did.

If you think that I'm still wrong then who cares, what you said is right - "it is up to me".

Thanks for the luck.

[trailmix 77]

You're welcome.

I see what you are saying - and it is possible that you are right.

That's not how I read it.

For instance, say you were adjusting status and filling out an I-864 - or even filing for a CR1/IR1 and therefore you are married - and you are going to use the sponsor's income (yours) and the beneficiaries income (your spouse). In that scenario the spouse is not required to fill out an I-864A - as you probably already know, you would be submitting just the one I-864. Now I interpret that statement to apply in that case.

But, as you point out, it is open to interpretation.

We had one VJ member, from Canada, who submitted the I-864 from her cosponsor with the accompanying tax transcript/return and all slips - to prove the individual income of the one sponsor.

The CO rejected that and insisted the joint tax filer must also submit an I-864A - so who knows.

Edited May 22, 2010 by trailmix